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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

It's going to be fun, watching people try to deny this one!

I'd wait till the documentary comes out and people can take a look at what ever evidence these guys can present. The questions would be who and why didn't they take credit for the attack (terrorism isn't effective if no one knows it was terrorism).

DS, ya beat me to that one.
Ken, who says it was terrorism and not a military accident?
The latter would fit in a lot better with the facts as stated in the article. Our government is all too eager to scream "Terrorist attack" but they're really reluctant to own up to their own mistakes.

To the best of my knowledge there are no military facilities at the end of the JFK runways. So you're positing a soldier with a shoulder fired AA missile just happened to be there, just happened to lock the jet and accidently fired the weapon? That's just so incredibly unlikely I can't believe you even suggested it.

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

If it was a US Navy ship there is no way it could have been kept secret. Every single soul on the ship would know and it just isn't likely that a whole crew would keep quiet about a live missile launch at the same time a US jetliner crashes.

BTW I was in the service when that Iranian jet was shot down. I had a friend on that ship. The Iranians were putting civilian transponders in their military jets and those same military transponders in the civilian jets. Their radar showed the plane as an Iranian F-14.

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You know, like Area 51. You had to have a top secret clearance to work the gate house and perimeter patrol,

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then those of us who actually were cleared to patrol inside checking locks, safes and stuff had a much higher clearance.

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ORIGINAL: DomKen


BTW I was in the service when that Iranian jet was shot down. I had a friend on that ship.

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The Iranians were putting civilian transponders in their military jets and those same military transponders in the civilian jets. Their radar showed the plane as an Iranian F-14.

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

There are two radar systems in use in both civilian and military applications, primary radar systems measure only the range and bearing of targets by detecting reflected radio signals, but cannot identify the type of aircraft by radar reflection. SSR relies on targets equipped with a radar transponder, that replies to each interrogation signal by transmitting a response containing encoded data. SSR is based on the military identification friend or foe.

In other words, identifying an aircraft simply by radar return is about as accurate as determining the sex of an unborn child based on the size of the expectant mother's abdomen.

Since the return on a radar screen is basically a moving dot, the operator depends on the aircraft's transponder to indicate aircraft type, contrary to what the movies might expect you to believe.

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

It would seem that some people think that what they see on the movies, with some RO looking up from his screen and yelling what kind of aircraft, altitude and speed is reality.

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx

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You know, like Area 51. You had to have a top secret clearance to work the gate house and perimeter patrol,

Regulations prescribe that those guarding material must have the same clearance as the material guarded.

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then those of us who actually were cleared to patrol inside checking locks, safes and stuff had a much higher clearance.

What clearances would those be?
How does one maintain one's security clearance after discharge.

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ORIGINAL: Moonhead

We occasionally have colonials over so that there's somebody to mock in a condescending English fashion: why do you think the media should be any different to the posher parts of London?

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ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

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ORIGINAL: Moonhead

We occasionally have colonials over so that there's somebody to mock in a condescending English fashion: why do you think the media should be any different to the posher parts of London?

I actually do believe that some of that was involved in getting this cuckoo clock on the show in the first place. The Beeb contacted some US media people and asked, 'What's this Jones like? We don't want a droner, we want a loonie. Nobody watches Andrew Neill's tedious programme so it needs one of your headbanging celebrities to spice it up. Ideally, it'd be one of your goosestepping ultra-right-wing women with dazzling teeth and big knockers, but a particularly fire-blowing conspiracy theorist would do as second best'.

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx

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You know, like Area 51. You had to have a top secret clearance to work the gate house and perimeter patrol,

Regulations prescribe that those guarding material must have the same clearance as the material guarded.

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then those of us who actually were cleared to patrol inside checking locks, safes and stuff had a much higher clearance.

What clearances would those be?
How does one maintain one's security clearance after discharge.

Work in the consulting field for defense contractors, among other things.

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

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'Idiot’ Bilderberg conspiracy theorist Alex Jones disrupts BBC politics show
Bilderberg conspiracy theorist Alex Jones flew into an uncontrollable tirade live on the BBC’s flagship politics programme after host Andrew Neil described him as an “idiot”.

Mr Jones, who runs a conspiracy theory website, began shouting and ranting after the Sunday Politics host told him to “shut it”.

As he screamed “freedom will not stop, you will not stop freedom” Mr Neil tried to bring the show to a close, telling him he was the worst guest ever, then stifling a laugh and pulling faces as he said: “We have an idiot on the programme today.”
Video of Alex Jones

For those who may not know, Alex Jones is one of the patron saints of the conspiracy theorists' subculture in the US.

Personally, I think the BBC made a mistake inviting him on the show, surely they did not expect him to act like a sane individual.

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

There are two radar systems in use in both civilian and military applications, primary radar systems measure only the range and bearing of targets by detecting reflected radio signals, but cannot identify the type of aircraft by radar reflection.

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SSR relies on targets equipped with a radar transponder, that replies to each interrogation signal by transmitting a response containing encoded data. SSR is based on the military identification friend or foe.

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In other words, identifying an aircraft simply by radar return is about as accurate as determining the sex of an unborn child based on the size of the expectant mother's abdomen.

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Since the return on a radar screen is basically a moving dot, the operator depends on the aircraft's transponder to indicate aircraft type, contrary to what the movies might expect you to believe.

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

It would seem that some people think that what they see on the movies, with some RO looking up from his screen and yelling what kind of aircraft, altitude and speed is reality.

Air targeting radar can give you altitude and air search radar can get speed by marking the returns position one sweep to the next. I would assume computers handle the speed thing now.

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But without the transponder

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you are left with blip size as the only way to tell a jetliner from a fighter jet and nobody pulls out calipers in C3 to identify a return. Civilian aircraft are required by international treaty to have a transponder that responds to all queries with correct information.