RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (Full Version)

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Hillwilliam -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 6:55:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

Err... He's implying they're making up the rules as they go along...

Actually, they haven't done that since Gamma left. I was wondering




JstAnotherSub -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 7:20:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I didnt get a warning. But, then again, I didnt need a warning. I think the post I made even said I knew I was about to get modded, I deserved it, and I would take it with sweet grace because the satisfaction I felt in what I posted with absolutely worth it.

The one time I got moderated, I did the same thing. But, what I said I had to say in order to be true to my self.




ARIES83 -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 7:22:35 AM)

I don't think it's the case, but then I didn't think it was the case during the last moderation brouhaha either.




jlf1961 -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 7:30:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Calvinball again?



Wtf IS "Calvinball?"

http://calvinandhobbes.wikia.com/wiki/Calvinball

"Calvinball is a game invented by Calvin in which one makes the rules up as one goes along. Rules cannot be used twice. No Calvinball game is like another. The game may involve wickets, mallets, volleyballs, and additional equipment as well as masks.

There is only one permanent rule in Calvinball: One can't play it in the same way twice"

It was a popular moderation style when Alpha was sick and Gamma decided to 'take charge'




Never dealt with gamma, and I have never been treated in a manner I deemed unfair. I have always had plenty of warnings before any action was taken, and recently I noticed action was taken against one user who had tendency to slip through the gray area of the TOS.

Besides, as I stated, the mods are most likely members of the human race, and interpret the TOS in ways dictated by personal experience, education and however their brain is wired.

Is it perfect, no.
Is it expected, yes, they are human.
Are they always right? In the eyes of those who have been modded, probably not, but then who is, aside from that guy behind the curtain or the lunatic on the streets with the "The End is Coming" sign and wearing a toga made of white bed sheets.

I cant help it if some users expect the mods to be perfect and never make mistakes, but then everyone's idea of right and wrong is a personal perception.

People are going to get butthurt. There is only three logical things to do in that situation, make your feelings and opinions known in a polite manner, take a nice relaxing soak in a jacuzzi with a nice tall glass of Black Velvet or scotch, and fuck the object of your desires until such time as you feel better.

Or you can scream foul, play the martyr card, and generally make a fool of oneself.

FYI the use of the word you is not directed at any one person in particular, it is used as a general reference to user x, who could be anyone, including myself.




Spiritedsub2 -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 9:00:23 AM)

I just had what I think (humbly) is a brilliant idea, if the mods would go for it. A new sticky thread under Off Topic Discussions called "Calvinball". Unmoderated except for under age/ incest/K9 type stuff. Unmoderated otherwise.

With big red warnings at the top of the thread that anything goes inside. You might find Awareness in here! Posting! God knows what else lurks in this thread! Enter at your own risk! Abandon hope all ye who enter here! Sensitive souls stay out!

The danger of course is that this thread would be as overcrowded as Calcutta and the rest of the threads somnambulant.....




kdsub -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 12:05:28 PM)

It has been suggested many times and you would surprised how many members are dead against it.

Butch




ChatteParfaitt -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 12:31:47 PM)

I'm not going to comment about Awareness' moderation, since I have no personal knowledge of what is going on with that. I can say since I've been involved with CollarChat, moderation has been all over the place and back again. It doesn't affect me that much, since I try not to take things too personally and thus avoid pissing matches, which leads to gold letters, etc..

Having said all that, it's my never humble opinion that Awareness was extremely articulate about voicing his ideals, and although I often disagreed with him, found him a though-provoking poster. If he is permanently banned, I shall miss him. Again, not b/c I agree with him, most often I don't, but b/c of his ability to carry his side of a debate, and his obvious high integrity.

This is JMO, YMMV, yada yada




lizi -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 12:41:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko

Chi, I would be thrilled to admit it if I'm incorrect, but I did just double check with him to see if I've got things wrong, and he doesn't know what you're referring to.





Well maybe this is completely obvious but I'll say it anyway, what if you were to approach the mods (Chi) privately and ask what the deal is then on the additional information that seems pertinent? If she can't tell you, but can tell Awareness, why not have him ask for enlightenment then?




Kirata -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 12:49:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

If only the rules were applied consistently and fairly...

Well, I don't think that's entirely fair to say. I've been in forums that were moderated. Posts were either edited to remove objectionable comments (if the job could be done surgically enough to leave something worthwhile) or removed on the spot. But here in CM, there is little to no moderation at all in that sense of the word. Whether the Mods don't have the time or there aren't enough of them is irrelevant. In practice, they function more as arbiters, responding to reports, considering the applicable guidelines, and making the call whether to yank or not. In consequence, some really low shit gets to stand because nobody reported it, while other comparatively mild transgressions might end up getting pulled. If the reporting is spotty and inconsistent, and I think it obviously is, you can't pin that on the Mods.

K.




jlf1961 -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 12:51:02 PM)

Using my grandson as a example, "But mommy I didnt do nothing, he hit me for no reason."

Or in this case, "I got modded because mod ____ dont like me."




Spiritedsub2 -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 1:08:41 PM)

It sounds like a version of "the squeaky wheel gets the grease", which is the approach to take to work your will against a bureaucracy. A few people whining that Awareness upset them is enough to get him banned?

The forum (IMHO, YMMV, etc) continues to exist because of the minority of insightful, articulate, experienced posters. When they disappear for awhile, it is noticeable. And the discussions go flat. A little acid in the occasional post is welcome respite from the pap.

I agree with Kaliko; this should be a symbiotic relationship between the posters and the site owner(s). Not just a PC playground controlled by a few thin-skinned people who really need to leave the house a little more.




VideoAdminChi -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 1:10:41 PM)

This thread is locked until Alpha has a chance to come straighten out the many misconceptions herein.




VideoAdminAlpha -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 1:51:58 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Calvinball again?



Wtf IS "Calvinball?"

http://calvinandhobbes.wikia.com/wiki/Calvinball

"Calvinball is a game invented by Calvin in which one makes the rules up as one goes along. Rules cannot be used twice. No Calvinball game is like another. The game may involve wickets, mallets, volleyballs, and additional equipment as well as masks.

There is only one permanent rule in Calvinball: One can't play it in the same way twice"

It was a popular moderation style when Alpha was sick and Gamma decided to 'take charge'




Actually, when I was sick 21 was in charge....... so possibly some occurrences right or wrong may have a perception on them because of who was thought to be(and who actually was behind the scenes) the driving force behind the policy shifts that took place and that we are trying to undo as we can.

I am working through the replies , replying to what I am allowed to address and respond to by "site ownership standard policy" on speaking for the site,then will unlock




VideoAdminAlpha -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 4:12:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko


quote:

ORIGINAL: SatinWhip

Businesses ban troublesome customers. Hosts cease sending invitations to unruly guests. And moderators remove posters from forums who cannot behave. It is true that businesses need customers, forums need posters, hosts need guests. They don't need every warm body they can get their hands on. What they don't need is troublemakers. If the moderators here ran roughshod over everyone and the place was a ghost town as a result then that would be different. What small percentage of folks is on time out here at any given time? What percentage of forum posters has ever been placed in the penalty box?



Well, that's kind of been the ongoing discussion on this topic, over the years. What defines "troublemaker?" And what percentage of the forum posters that I enjoy reading have been placed in the penalty box? But I have already said more than my share about that. Moderators know how I feel.


quote:



I just went back and re-read your initial post. This person was placed on moderation and then created a new profile to circumvent the moderation and their predicament is somehow the moderators' fault?



Awareness wasn't put on moderation. He was banned. (That's not private knowledge. He stated that in one of his first posts as TAFKAA.) He did make the new profile, TAFKAA (The Asshole Formerly Known As Awareness) about six months after he was banned. But, he also claimed publicly exactly who he was upon his return and all knew it (including moderators) and allowed it.

TAFKAA was put on a two-month moderation in March. At the end of two months, his ability to post hasn't been restored. There has been no explanation as to why, even upon his inquiry. It seems odd to say, but if they had said in March "You are now permanently banned" then I would have nothing to say right now. But they didn't. Moderation stated something that they apparently had no intention of following through with. That's my grievance.




You are correct. Awareness was banned, and the member you answered is correct, HE CREATED THE SECOND ACCOUNT TO BE ABLE TO POST AND THEREFORE CIRCUMVENT MODERATION/BAN ACTION, whether he publicly admitted it or not is irrelevant. It is a HUGE violation of TOS, if there was a sliding scale. Especially considering that to get the ban lifted he was told he needed to contact me so we could discuss and work out. The reply was to call that mod mentally handicapped (the slur term) and said that a true dominant male would find it demeaning to ask a female for help on an online board since that female (and pretty much of ALL females on the site)were dominant in claim only.

Whether you understand the seemingly nonsensical appearance of him being allowed to continue to post because we were aware of it or not, again, (respectfully) is irrelevant. I am not going to share as many private details about a disciplinary action on a member on these boards as( respectfully again) you would like. I will say this; no matter what your relationship to Awareness, please remember YOU ARE GETTING HALF OF THE STORY., and possibly a biased one since it concerns him personally. I will also go so far as to say, that he was given another chance under the new nick and is aware of that, so what is nonsensical to you, he is fully aware of. What shot his chances and put him on moderation was in part a thread that was full of personal attacks, one of them on a moderator and the descriptive term of “mealy-mouthed, worthless, asshole-enabling, rancid pool of pig's vomit” was used about that moderator. That was not the worst attack IN THAT ONE THREAD ALONE. It is safe to say that members do not realize the posts they never see may in fact be light years worse than the ones they actually know about.

You said in the first post that Awareness told you he has had numerous communications with administration about the matter of moderation. Quote from post one: despite his communication with moderators regarding it. You were told by Chi that maybe you had not seen all the correspondence concerning this matter. The fact that a highly abusive email was sent to Chi on 4/1 and 4/3, than nothing until June 20( 4 days ago) when another highly abusive email was received, (and answered with the message she would forward his remark, as that attack could not properly be classified as a request) belies the statement that there was communication. I certainly have NO emails in my box with communications in any shape or form, and as I am the supervisor, one would assume the communications would be with me. There has also not been any communications from him to support during this time, nor any other possible moderators. I only had one on 4/3 that let me know what deficiencies I possessed when performing my site duties, and some other information that was felt I needed to know because of my perceived lack of mental faculties.I certainly have not had any communications from them since the 20th, and then this thread was started on the 21st. There has still been no communication from him to me, and I feel certain he is probably aware of this threads existence, so is aware and accepting of all you are doing to state his case to the public. He needs to thank you for your help, since he had not done as directed to remove the moderation in the very beginning because of his hesitancy( no matter how he presented that fact) to speak with me.




VideoAdminAlpha -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 4:15:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Spiritedsub2

It sounds like a version of "the squeaky wheel gets the grease", which is the approach to take to work your will against a bureaucracy. A few people whining that Awareness upset them is enough to get him banned?

The forum (IMHO, YMMV, etc) continues to exist because of the minority of insightful, articulate, experienced posters. When they disappear for awhile, it is noticeable. And the discussions go flat. A little acid in the occasional post is welcome respite from the pap.

I agree with Kaliko; this should be a symbiotic relationship between the posters and the site owner(s). Not just a PC playground controlled by a few thin-skinned people who really need to leave the house a little more.

People whining about another user is not enough to get them moderated OR banned. What determines that is when a report is made, the report (and the corresponding post(s) that correlate(s)) is evaluated, as is the users response by action (or inaction) in response to official site communications and/or warnings.




VideoAdminAlpha -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 5:00:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SatinWhip

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko
I've gone into it a bit more in detail on past threads. I agree, it's not quite as simple as it sounds. But there is a give and take. Businesses need customers, forums need posters, hosts need guests. One can't exist without the other. I don't subscribe to the "Love it or leave it" rule, myself. I've seen moderation here make changes as a result of our suggestions and needs. There can be, and has been, collaboration.


Businesses ban troublesome customers. Hosts cease sending invitations to unruly guests. And moderators remove posters from forums who cannot behave. It is true that businesses need customers, forums need posters, hosts need guests. They don't need every warm body they can get their hands on. What they don't need is troublemakers. If the moderators here ran roughshod over everyone and the place was a ghost town as a result then that would be different. What small percentage of folks is on time out here at any given time? What percentage of forum posters has ever been placed in the penalty box?

I just went back and re-read your initial post. This person was placed on moderation and then created a new profile to circumvent the moderation and their predicament is somehow the moderators' fault?



Less than approximately 2% are permabanned total, and that is OVER 3 years since the moderation staff change. In other words, it takes a LOT (maybe more than it should) to get banned.

Im opening up the thread here again, but do not plan to contribute to it anymore, I feel like I have said everything for the site(and possibly more) that I can.




Hillwilliam -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 6:30:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: VideoAdminAlpha

Actually, when I was sick 21 was in charge.......

You may have left 21 in charge but Gamma 'took charge'.




jlf1961 -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 6:42:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: VideoAdminAlpha

Actually, when I was sick 21 was in charge.......

You may have left 21 in charge but Gamma 'took charge'.



So you are saying there was a coup de' ta?




VideoAdminAlpha -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 6:44:45 PM)

Let's not go that direction please. It will stray further away from the topic.




Hillwilliam -> RE: I really don't want to flounce, but... (6/24/2013 7:16:29 PM)

Sounds like a plan.
That bridge has burned and floated downstream anyway.




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