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RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 1:44:54 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		I was thinking more along the lines of injuries sustained on the easement itself.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 161
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 1:47:22 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		on the road probably not. between the lakeshore and the road? High risk of my being held liable, yes.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 162
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:09:26 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Now, wait, I thought a gravel bar was like a sand bar.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 163
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:15:36 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Now, wait, I thought a gravel bar was like a sand bar.

it is. He's also talking about a gravel road that runs along the river on his property

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 164
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:17:23 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Ah ok... so.. if this all happened on the gravel bar, where does the easement come into play?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 165
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:17:30 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I have "land" between the ordinary low and high, not in water, but wetland. Not a gravel bar or sand bar in the water or at the edge, but muck and cattails sink in up to your ass some places.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 166
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:17:56 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Fuckin Sie A. And that water is big costly, big costly. Water is accessed at lakeshore rates, and the road is on agricultural land, so taxed in with agricultural land. Beyond that, I also pay township taxes on it and all the other taxes and mills. As if it was all mine to do as I please.


That is insane. The easement should at least reduce the tax rate.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 167
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:18:36 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Ah ok... so.. if this all happened on the gravel bar, where does the easement come into play?


because the low water mark and the high water mark may be many, many, many feet or yards of difference.


_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 168
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:19:29 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Ok.. so does it start at the low water mark or the high? I thought it was the high

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 169
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:19:39 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Ah ok... so.. if this all happened on the gravel bar, where does the easement come into play?

The easement for a navigable waterway extends from the high water mark. So the gravel bar is exposed right now but at some point in the year it is under water so it is in the easement.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 170
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:21:27 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Think of it like tides and the ocean for now, not quite right, but the low water you can see the bottom, high water not. However there are historical high and low water marks on inland waters taken in droughts (my lake was dry and they hayed it in the dirty thirties) and flood years.

all averaged out, the lows, and all averaged out the highs and that is the easement.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/25/2013 2:22:26 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 171
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:22:04 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Just like a sand bar in the ocean... sorry, I never lived close to rivers or streams, so I am trying toget all this in a way that I can wrap my head around it.

So, the easments.... private owned, but public allowed access?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 172
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:24:19 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I own into the bed of the lake I own the water as well, I have no right to it due to the high-low water mark difference in federal trust.

The guy probably actually does own the sandbar for the august honor of paying taxes on the fuckin thing, but thats about it.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/25/2013 2:25:09 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 173
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:26:18 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Like the easement between houses to a public beach... gotcha.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 174
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:27:19 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Just like a sand bar in the ocean... sorry, I never lived close to rivers or streams, so I am trying toget all this in a way that I can wrap my head around it.

So, the easments.... private owned, but public allowed access?



Just like the land under your sidewalks baby, pay, but no play. Your city boulevard in essence. Don't shovel the ice off it, it is your ass, but the easement is to the entire country if they want it.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/25/2013 2:28:10 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 175
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:28:46 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Ok.. so... the land owner walks down to tell them to get off his property... I am assuming he meant the woods... but only one was in the woods. Once they hit the water mark, he should have stopped.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 176
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:43:02 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		http://www.ottertailcounty.net/flexviewers/harn/

in the center you will see a big big lake. just above it you will see a long funny sort of lake. zoom in a little less than half way, and you should see that the big lake is otter tail lake, the long funny lake is long lake and if you zoom in too far west it is walker lake, get to long lake. pull it down to get the west end of long lake on your screen.

Zoom into it exactly half way. you will see a red 36 that is section 36 dead lake township. inside the black line you will see an elevation number 1343 and my house is the black square below it. I own that half of the section (the east half to the lake and the section is bordered on the east and south by the wavy black line, you will see the road, the big chunk of water I pay taxes on, but only own for taxes.

Meandered road, meandered land and the low water mark is about out there on the east and south wavy line, thats alotta shit aint mine to pay for.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/25/2013 2:46:44 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 177
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 2:48:29 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		Let me know when you find the part in there that says 'And we hold 471 U.S. 1,105 S. Ct. 1694, 85 L. Ed. 2d 1,1985 U.S. to be invalid in these circumstances'.


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Skinner v. Osage County, 822 S.W.2d 437
(1991)

I keep seeing this case cited in reference to the gravel bars.

I couldnt shoot someone accessing the beach if they used the "public easement" from my house. Its my understanding that if they were below the water mark, its not considered "private property". He may own it, but its still not property he can drive people off from.



_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 178
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 3:08:21 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		That phrase or that case you cite isnt used in Skinner. No clue what you are on about.

TENNESSEE, Appellant, v. Cleamtee GARNER, etc., et al. MEMPHIS POLICE DEPARTMENT, et al., Petitioners, v. Cleamtee GARNER, etc., et al.

471 U.S. 1 (105 S.Ct. 1694, 85 L.Ed.2d 1)



< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 7/25/2013 3:10:19 PM >

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Powergamz1)
Profile   Post #: 179
RE: Stand your ground in Missouri OH NO!!! - 7/25/2013 4:02:12 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		No amount of pointless discussion about waterways and easements is going to take away any American citizen's right to self defense, no matter how badly you wish that right to be reserved for the elite.


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

That phrase or that case you cite isnt used in Skinner. No clue what you are on about.

TENNESSEE, Appellant, v. Cleamtee GARNER, etc., et al. MEMPHIS POLICE DEPARTMENT, et al., Petitioners, v. Cleamtee GARNER, etc., et al.

471 U.S. 1 (105 S.Ct. 1694, 85 L.Ed.2d 1)





_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 180
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