RE: How Do I get my wife to agree????

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Hillwilliam -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 10:16:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: Domnotlooking To Lady Pact, re. opinions of infidelity on the long running Sexless Marriage board: We're all for it. Marriage means sex and a marriage without sex is a voided agreement (that "honor" thing -note quotation marks). Partners do not get to breezily rewrite the basic marital agreement going back to the stone age just because we said some mumbo jumbo in church and then slowly kill their partner's soul just because. Would it be better (or to quote a fave poster, "better") to seamlessly and perfectly tie up some completely muddled mess in a neat bow before moving on in a responsible, Dr Phil manner to a clean break future? Sure. But sometime life's a bitch and people are imperfect. Wow. Just wow. I guess it completely depends on what you consider "better" and just what you feel does kill your soul. Lack of sex wouldn't do that for Me but there are other things that would. There are a lot of people on the face of the earth that don't care what it does to the other party as long as you're getting yours. I couldn't handle My conscious or My character being dictated by My genitals. quote: My own story: I was trapped in a sexless marriage and met someone on a hobby board who was likewise. We hadn't been laid half a dozen times in a decade between us. We hit it off. Our marriages were all but dead and we had one foot out the door. To quote my now wife: "What did being honorable (or "honorable") ever get me? Fuck it, let's get laid before the dirt nap". Today, we have sex at least twice a week. We feel we were dug up from a cold grave and let to breath and live in the sun again. Sometimes, we weep with gratitude. Downside: we suffer, I suppose, the huffy and fatuous disdain of people like Jeff. It's OK -we can live with it. And Jeff's on here 10 times a day imperiously wagging his finger at strangers and loving it. So a win/win all around then. Well, at least you found somebody who takes loyalty and commitment with the same level of importance as you do, so that's a good thing. I hope you both remain happy and healthy. If you don't, and one of you sustained an accident or illness that would leave you unable to perform sexually, at least you've got your prior experience behind you to know that you'd be willing to let the new spouse go and get their satisfaction elsewhere. "Cause what does that honor thing get a person anyway. [8\|] People are just different, I guess. This thread had Me thinking back to those times that MP was deployed and what the difficulties of that period of time brought up. Lack of sex was so low on the list that it barely registered. I must have come up with forty things that I remembered missing about just having him in the same house that were so much more important. If he'd have come back from those deployments unable to have sex, I'd still be married to him today because I fell in love with the whole man. Not just what he could do for Me in the bedroom. Oh, and I'm glad you did turn out to just happen to be a new poster. It shows your not a dishonest person who just created the account just to answer the thread or lie about who you are. The latter would have implied that a person isn't quite as proud of their actions as you seem to be. Lady P. I think one thing that separates your experience with celibacy during deployments with some of the folks here who have been celibate with a partner living in the house is that when Mr P came home from deployment and you sat on the bed, patted the place beside you and gave a come hither smile, the first sentence out of his mouth didn't contain the word "Disgusting" or "Gross".

kalikshama -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 10:24:44 AM)
quote: Overwhelmingly tho, it's them not being into you, failing to send you the memo, and then years of gas lighting to maintain a toxic status quo for selfish reasons that's the scenario. Plenty of lying on both sides. In an attempt to save my marriage, we had date nights and I signed us up for marriage counseling, massage workshops, couples workshops, etc, etc. In all the cases of married coworkers who complained about their lack of sex, they did nothing to maintain the relationship. I'm curious about what you and your new wife did with your previous spouses to try to make the marriage better.

LadyPact -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 11:00:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam Lady P. I think one thing that separates your experience with celibacy during deployments with some of the folks here who have been celibate with a partner living in the house is that when Mr P came home from deployment and you sat on the bed, patted the place beside you and gave a come hither smile, the first sentence out of his mouth didn't contain the word "Disgusting" or "Gross". The closest that I've come to that was him feeling nasty after having been on the plane for so long. (In other words, it's not like I was getting any the minute he came through the door.) I'll still give it to you though. [;)] In a joking sense, I tell people all of the time that I'm a lousy military wife. I'm horrible with the lingo, don't have a clue about dependent services unless I've had personal experience with them, and nine times out of ten don't know what department I'm looking for when making a phone call. I don't jive with 'spouse support' activities at least 90% of the time and this subject is a primary reason for that. (MP literally tells people, "sure, you feel free to tell her she HAS to attend.") In My opinion, if you can't either a) deal with no sex during long deployments or b) have some kind of understanding between yourself and your military spouse, you really need to think twice before marrying somebody who is going to be gone for long periods of time. It's not like it's a big, huge shock that you're going to spend time during your marriage where there are a lot of things missing. Somebody up there said something about long term married folks not understanding what it's like not having sex. If anything, I'm more inclined to believe they know about it more. Kids, death, periods of grief, physical ailments, side effects from medications........ All kinds of stuff. If I remember right, Hill, you've had the same rotator cuff surgery that MP's had three separate times. How much bouncing around do you think was going on through that period of time? That was Me more than him because I was scared of hurting him. (Very interesting discussions we had over that. [8D])

Hillwilliam -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 11:03:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam Lady P. I think one thing that separates your experience with celibacy during deployments with some of the folks here who have been celibate with a partner living in the house is that when Mr P came home from deployment and you sat on the bed, patted the place beside you and gave a come hither smile, the first sentence out of his mouth didn't contain the word "Disgusting" or "Gross". The closest that I've come to that was him feeling nasty after having been on the plane for so long. (In other words, it's not like I was getting any the minute he came through the door.) I'll still give it to you though. [;)] In a joking sense, I tell people all of the time that I'm a lousy military wife. I'm horrible with the lingo, don't have a clue about dependent services unless I've had personal experience with them, and nine times out of ten don't know what department I'm looking for when making a phone call. I don't jive with 'spouse support' activities at least 90% of the time and this subject is a primary reason for that. (MP literally tells people, "sure, you feel free to tell her she HAS to attend.") In My opinion, if you can't either a) deal with no sex during long deployments or b) have some kind of understanding between yourself and your military spouse, you really need to think twice before marrying somebody who is going to be gone for long periods of time. It's not like it's a big, huge shock that you're going to spend time during your marriage where there are a lot of things missing. Somebody up there said something about long term married folks not understanding what it's like not having sex. If anything, I'm more inclined to believe they know about it more. Kids, death, periods of grief, physical ailments, side effects from medications........ All kinds of stuff. If I remember right, Hill, you've had the same rotator cuff surgery that MP's had three separate times. How much bouncing around do you think was going on through that period of time? That was Me more than him because I was scared of hurting him. (Very interesting discussions we had over that. [8D]) I thought you LIKED hurting people[8D]

LadyPact -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 11:05:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I thought you LIKED hurting people[8D] If I liked hurting people that way, I'd be a physical therapist. [8D]

Hillwilliam -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 11:07:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I thought you LIKED hurting people[8D] If I liked hurting people that way, I'd be a physical therapist. [8D] Pain n torture. I wrestled and coached for 13 years so I was there numerous times.

tj444 -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 11:18:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kalikshama quote: Overwhelmingly tho, it's them not being into you, failing to send you the memo, and then years of gas lighting to maintain a toxic status quo for selfish reasons that's the scenario. Plenty of lying on both sides. In an attempt to save my marriage, we had date nights and I signed us up for marriage counseling, massage workshops, couples workshops, etc, etc. In all the cases of married coworkers who complained about their lack of sex, they did nothing to maintain the relationship. I'm curious about what you and your new wife did with your previous spouses to try to make the marriage better. I tried to make suggestions to my ex too.. but he would refuse to even discuss the problems so that a solution could be found, if that was possible.. but of course you don't know until you talk and figure out the causes for said problem.. I remember one time I sat next to him, as soon as I started to talk to him he immediately stood up and walked away.. and its not like I am the screaming-bitch-throwing-dishes type.. I wanted a calm discussion.. I have frequently considered that relationship as being like "one hand clapping".. meaning it takes two! You can not force someone to maintain or save the relationship.. and its pretty hard to do that on your own.. [:(]

kiwisub12 -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 2:16:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cloudboy quote: ORIGINAL: kiwisub12 I disagree cloudboy. On both of the threads you mentioned - small penis and diaper - the negative postings were because the posters seemed to think that the rest of us were here to enable their "fun". When serious questions are asked, I don't see dogpiles, I see serious answers. And I don't consider "tell me how small and horrible my penis is" a serious question. First of all, the rough treatment those two OPs faced fits a longstanding pattern. Next, the small penis question was not wank fodder, it was a self description and good questions asked. Hating the kink resulted in hating the op. it was just disguised as hating "wank fodder." How else can you explain such poor reading comprehension? ------ This may seem like a strange question, but having recently chatted to a couple of other weak males with small penis's, I wonder if there is a link between cock size, confidence, success, and power. I have a very small penis, and I need people to laugh at it, and hurt it (including men with normal sized penis's). I wonder if men with real cocks are more succesful because of the confidence and success with women they have. This is just curiousity, because as a wimp with a 1 inch willie, I know I will never be more than a toilet and slavepig for my superiors. ----------- Simply Michael was the only decent responder on the diaper thread. Ya know, your quote from the original thread isn't proving your point, It pretty much shows how the op was there for wank fodder. And is there a male out there that seriously thinks that their penis makes them inferior? My observations show a bias towards if you have one you are the king of the world.

Domnotlooking -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 2:52:10 PM)
.....Yeah, I did everything I could think of to work it out with my wife too. She wouldn't do therapy, she kept presenting the problem as situational. We both worked hard to get her problematic kids into top schools and it was very consuming. But as I'd often posit, many a Harvard freshman has parents who have sex -well, one in six, maybe. Massage workshops? They slowly cut you down to size in degrees. Stuff like massage workshops is the provence of both partners still trying. People talk about internal enslavement here. By the slow racheting down of desire, by starving, twisting, and clipping us like bonsai trees over time we have walked that walk, but not in a hot way. But she'd checked out long ago and was just stringing me along for material reasons. She also had a hidden substance abuse problem to go along with her secret affair. My partner lost 20 pounds in a month to please her endlessly goal post shifting husband. We were honest and giving to our mates and they were not back. What you pine for is a sense of being desired, of ardor. Most of the woman here get a whole lot of ardor they don't want and I sympathize with them. Try zero for a thousand days. The end of my marriage was like crossing a parched dessert. And they watch you slowly die and shrug. I can forgive the people here who simply dismiss me as ruled by my genitals. I wanted something more fundamental then to come. I wanted to be wanted. I can forgive the people who dismiss my pain with a bluff, "well, there's 2 sides to that story". They have not crossed my desert. I am more forgiving of everything these days, partic. myself for letting myself be treated so badly. What you think is a bracing slap in the face to us is something we experience as just more tedious shaming. You don't mean it to be, but that is what it is. Witholding sex is the same as any other abuse. A generation from now, this will be known, the way we now accept that physical abuse is flat out wrong, but dismissed those suffering from it as "asking for it" in my lifetime. And then when we met each other on the hobby board, it hit us what suckers we were. Then she found the sexless marriage board and we found out that this problem is everywhere: It cuts across sex, class, culture -tho some cohorts are worse than others. Muslim women really, really take it on the chin, sex-wise. Japan is another sexless black hole. England too. Around the world, there are people stuck with a partner who just decided to give up on their watch. There's often a punitive element in refusers too. There definitely was in both our cases. We found love and healing and we re-built our lives. Just not in the exact order that many people here would approve of. In closing (for real now) I extend my love and solidarity with the OP -even if he so-called doesn't deserve it. He deserves to have some juicy sex before the grave. I hope he gets it.

metamorfosis -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 3:45:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Domnotlooking We found love and healing and we re-built our lives. Just not in the exact order that many people here would approve of. In closing (for real now) I extend my love and solidarity with the OP -even if he so-called doesn't deserve it. He deserves to have some juicy sex before the grave. I hope he gets it. I think there's been self righteous finger pointing on both sides of the issue. More from those on the side of honesty/fidelity than from those on the side of compassion, but it was there on both sides. It's not fair to condemn people on a message board for expressing a perfectly valid opinion when asked, and both of those opinions are valid. I'm not sure it's even fair to condemn them for being self righteous. I do think it's fair to ask whether people are applying their standard of honesty or compassion equally across the board. It is fair to condemn someone for using a double standard. And it is fair to condemn them for refusing to consider the legitimacy of their opponent's point of view.

angelikaJ -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 3:47:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Domnotlooking Marriage means sex and a marriage without sex is a voided agreement (that "honor" thing -note quotation marks). I agree that (for most people) marriage means sex and that lack of same is a void agreement. A happy/healthy sex life is a quality of life issue. So why did you stay? The obvious problem regarding partners trapped in sexless marriages is that once again, we are only reading one side. I am not suggesting that you or other posters are concealing anything. You have read women who say that lack of sex stems from a lack of emotional safety, or a lack of general intimacy. Those opinions are no less valid than your own as they are written from experience, just as yours is. I am not someone who thinks that every person who seeks out secretive sex outside of their committed relationship is a bad person. I know someone whose wife is 63 years old and because she has early onset Alzheimer's can not remember her spouse's name. To the best of my knowledge the spouse isn't seeking either physical or emotional intimacy outside of their relationship, but if that were to happen there would be no finger pointing from me. The wife is being well cared for. On the whole though, because I believe that compatible sex drives and a happy sex life are quality of life issues, I think that the honorable thing is usually to leave the broken agreement... before cheating occurs. (And btw: the saying "Two wrongs don't make a right", still applies.) Edit to complete thought: sometimes people with no sex drive find each other and have a happily sexless marriage and for others it is the sense of companionship that is the focal point regardless of differing sexual desires.

slaveluci -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 5:19:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: metamorfosis I think there's been self righteous finger pointing on both sides of the issue. More from those on the side of honesty/fidelity than from those on the side of compassion, but it was there on both sides. . But, but, but....it's honorable to be self-righteous and condemn the terrible cheaters!!!! [:'(] I find it (once again) terribly arrogant to be someone who comes here and practically brags about how long you go without sex and how you think that none of this BDSM stuff has to have any type of sexual component to it and then act holier than thou over not cheating or needing sex. It's like having zero appetite and feeling superior because you don't eat and are thin. Just because you have virtually no desire doesn't give you the moral authority to condemn others who do and who sometimes err in their judgment regarding sex. It's like being the sex police. Get a grip and get a lay and you (the general you, of course) might have a different perspective[8\|] luci

metamorfosis -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 5:22:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slaveluci Get a grip and get a lay and you (the general you, of course) might have a different perspective[8\|] That was precisely my point.

Domnotlooking -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 5:36:08 PM)
Why'd I stay? 1) For the kids (boring, easy answer). 2) Out of loyalty (painful answer). Here's what I learned: Love without loyalty is worthless. Loyalty without love is worth well, something. Talk about honor ("honor")? There is no honor in loving disloyal people. My loyalty was used against me like a club. Given who she was, she could not do otherwise. Helping people on that other board via telling my story and listening to their's helped me. And they tell them it helped them too. I hope I helped someone reading this thread today -but in this bitch of life, you just get what you get.

slaveluci -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 5:37:20 PM)
And there is no honor in being a self-righteous, holier-than-thou judge of your fellow man either. None. luci

LadyPact -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 7:02:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slaveluci And there is no honor in being a self-righteous, holier-than-thou judge of your fellow man either. None. luci If you'd care to explain the difference between being self-righteous about other people who are being judgmental as opposed to people being self-righteous about honesty, I'm all ears.

Hillwilliam -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 7:25:12 PM)
I think one of the problems is that you're supposed to attack the post, not the person. I don't feel that rule has been followed very well on this thread.

JeffBC -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 8:10:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact MP literally tells people, "sure, you feel free to tell her she HAS to attend." I want tickets to that conversation... and a bowl of popcorn please. I'd be VASTLY amused.

evesgrden -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 8:58:51 PM)
quote: BUBBLENUTS Posts: 16187 Joined: 8/27/2008 Status: online I think one of the problems is that you're supposed to attack the post, not the person. I don't feel that rule has been followed very well on this thread. yathink?

OrionTheWolf -> RE: How Do I get my wife to agree???? (8/15/2013 10:22:00 PM)
~FR~ This could have been a good topic if it had boiled down to: "How to get your vanilla partner involved in BDSM or Kinky sex." Could have been some good things coming out of that, or is someone going to disagree because it would have been too productive?

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