Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: OBAMA LIED!!!


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: OBAMA LIED!!! Page: <<   < prev  2 3 [4] 5 6   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 3:12:56 AM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim
Well, since you seem to know the insurance companies never leave a plan alone surely it's not a stretch to assume Sabelius and Obama knew that also and, therefore, knew that most plans would not meet the grandfather exemption and, therefore, THEY DID INDEED LIE. Given that Obamacare mandates what the insurance companies MUST include in their policies, blaming this on the insurance companies is BULL$HIT.

That fact that the insurance companies make those changes, then the onus is on those insurance companies, not the president.
Ergo, the president didn't lie - the insurance companies moved the goalposts.


Not exactly, freedomdwarf. The insurance companies were forced to move them because of Obamacare. This was not a free choice. They had no choice other than to change the policies.


No actually they weren't, DS. I know this. And I know you don't know this, because you STILL HAVENT READ THE AFFORDABLE CARE ACT. The insurance plans could be grandfathered into the ACA so long as they followed the rules under grandfathering. Those rules were spelled out over two different pages within the whole of the document. No company was forced by the President, nor the ACA prior to the law going into effect on March 31, 2010. If an insurance company made one or more changes, and those changes were not allowed under the grandfathered clause of the ACA; then they would need to be redone to be within compliance with the ACA. This is for insurance plans posted after the March 31, 2010 moment. Its just like a seat belt law, DS. After 'X', all cars manufactured in the USA needed to have seat belts in them. An that law stated that cars made before the date could be grandfathered in. Which is why you don't see seat belts as a standard item on cars from the 1930's, right?


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 3:25:26 AM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim
Well, since you seem to know the insurance companies never leave a plan alone surely it's not a stretch to assume Sabelius and Obama knew that also and, therefore, knew that most plans would not meet the grandfather exemption and, therefore, THEY DID INDEED LIE. Given that Obamacare mandates what the insurance companies MUST include in their policies, blaming this on the insurance companies is BULL$HIT.

That fact that the insurance companies make those changes, then the onus is on those insurance companies, not the president.
Ergo, the president didn't lie - the insurance companies moved the goalposts.


Not exactly, freedomdwarf. The insurance companies were forced to move them because of Obamacare. This was not a free choice. They had no choice other than to change the policies.

Again, the policies only lost grandfather status if they failed to come into compliance with the ACA or raised premiums while eliminating coverage. Simply obeying the ACA regs is not sufficient!

Simply not true.


Oh really? You don't like it, so therefore its not true. How immature of an answer! Have you bothered to read the whole ACA from cover to cover? All 2409 pages? No? What's your excuse this time? I've read the document. Its online in several places. Easy to access with a goggle search (i.e. 'Affordable Care Act Text PDF').

DK is mostly correct here. What he left out was the definitions of what constitutes a plan that falls out of being grandfathered and must be updated to comply fully with the current laws on the books. It is a fairly lengthy definition over about thirty pages in different parts of the whole document. Now if all of this is 'simply not true', by all means, present the facts to us. Make sure to include the actual page numbers from the ACA.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 5:26:37 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim
Well, since you seem to know the insurance companies never leave a plan alone surely it's not a stretch to assume Sabelius and Obama knew that also and, therefore, knew that most plans would not meet the grandfather exemption and, therefore, THEY DID INDEED LIE. Given that Obamacare mandates what the insurance companies MUST include in their policies, blaming this on the insurance companies is BULL$HIT.

That fact that the insurance companies make those changes, then the onus is on those insurance companies, not the president.
Ergo, the president didn't lie - the insurance companies moved the goalposts.

Not exactly, freedomdwarf. The insurance companies were forced to move them because of Obamacare. This was not a free choice. They had no choice other than to change the policies.

No actually they weren't, DS. I know this. And I know you don't know this, because you STILL HAVENT READ THE AFFORDABLE CARE ACT. The insurance plans could be grandfathered into the ACA so long as they followed the rules under grandfathering. Those rules were spelled out over two different pages within the whole of the document. No company was forced by the President, nor the ACA prior to the law going into effect on March 31, 2010. If an insurance company made one or more changes, and those changes were not allowed under the grandfathered clause of the ACA; then they would need to be redone to be within compliance with the ACA. This is for insurance plans posted after the March 31, 2010 moment. Its just like a seat belt law, DS. After 'X', all cars manufactured in the USA needed to have seat belts in them. An that law stated that cars made before the date could be grandfathered in. Which is why you don't see seat belts as a standard item on cars from the 1930's, right?


So there were no regulations put in place under Obamacare that impacted grandfathered plans? None?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 5:29:19 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
The rules under grandfathering are (in a nutshell)...

If you had a policy on the day the affordable care act was signed, and no major changes were made to it it does not have to be in compliance with the new act other than cover till 26 and the lifetime benefits (which could be changed without violation). It is grandfathered under the law for the rest of your life. The insurance companies could raise premiums just like normal without violation.

If you had a policy that had major changes or was bought the day after, it is grandfathered until the end of next year and considered in compliance, even if it does not meet the whole of the ACA requirements. And premiums could be raised.

So this five dollar horseshit is nutsacker horseshit. The insurance companies are making the decision to pull these fucking things now, not the ACA.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 5:51:23 AM   
MariaB


Posts: 2969
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
And what, pray, is wrong with a government funded single-payer healthcare system?
Everywhere that type of system is implimented it works out shitloads cheaper for the patient than private insurance-based systems.
Surely that would be better for the majority of Americans?



Of course but this isn't about what's better for the American people, its about stomping out a socialist principle. Its about visions of Stalin and the Iron curtain by those people detached from reality. ;)

America isn't going through a temporary malfunction. Its entire system is fundamentally flawed. Even so, people are terrified of change and would rather keep on crawling down that same avenue of fucked up-ness than try something that clearly works in many other countries in the western world.


_____________________________

My store is http://e-stimstore.com

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 7:41:22 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
Anything penetrating through to the other side? All the right-wingers here are merely parroting an RNC talking point.

One credit I give the Right, when they roll out a talking point, all their followers march right along with it. Usually the path is: RNC - to FOX AND DOWD - to the CMMB via Sanity, Fatdomdaddy, or some other ditto-head.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 10/31/2013 7:49:38 AM >

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 8:46:51 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Of course but this isn't about what's better for the American people, its about stomping out a socialist principle. Its about visions of Stalin and the Iron curtain by those people detached from reality. ;)
America isn't going through a temporary malfunction. Its entire system is fundamentally flawed. Even so, people are terrified of change and would rather keep on crawling down that same avenue of fucked up-ness than try something that clearly works in many other countries in the western world.


Glad to see that you're not asserting the other side doesn't think their beliefs are best for the American people.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to MariaB)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 10:14:00 AM   
MariaB


Posts: 2969
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Of course but this isn't about what's better for the American people, its about stomping out a socialist principle. Its about visions of Stalin and the Iron curtain by those people detached from reality. ;)
America isn't going through a temporary malfunction. Its entire system is fundamentally flawed. Even so, people are terrified of change and would rather keep on crawling down that same avenue of fucked up-ness than try something that clearly works in many other countries in the western world.


Glad to see that you're not asserting the other side doesn't think their beliefs are best for the American people.



Well pardon my French for understanding and having an interest in world politics!

You, along with all those extreme right wing politicians have no interest in what works in other parts of the world. You are the perpetually incurious and remain willfully ignorant.

I just look on with interest whilst living in a modern social democracy.


_____________________________

My store is http://e-stimstore.com

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 10:21:35 AM   
graceadieu


Posts: 1518
Joined: 3/20/2008
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

Your food is safe to eat? really? the fact that various chemicals (over 200 of them) can be hidden in the ingredient list as "spices", the fact that Monsanto almost was exempted from the law & have influence to get preferential treatment.. did you miss the Monsanto Protection Act?


Our food is a lot safer to eat than it was before the FDA. Look at China, where they don't have the kind of controls that the FDA puts in place, and the constant reports of tainted formula and milk and so forth that kill hundreds of people. Or a lot of third-world countries where you have to drink bottled water and have a good chance of getting food poisoning if you eat uncooked produce.

The FDA can't prevent everything (especially with the limited funding they get), but when something is proven to be harmful (and GMO has not been proven to be harmful to the consumer, only to the farmer that gets fucked over by Monsanto), it's pulled. When people get sick from eating food tainted with e. coli, for example, the FDA does a very good job tracking down the source and dealing with it.

And having the FDA means that drug companies can't sell you stuff like radioactive water or heroin as medicine, like they used to in this country.

quote:

Social Security is also not what promised cuz of govt mismanagement


Social Security has (so far) been very successful at fulfilling it's promise of reducing poverty among the elderly, widowed and disabled.

The problem with social security is that people are living longer and having less children. It used to be that people usually only lived past retirement age for a few years, if at all, and workers hugely outnumbered retirees. Now, the huge baby boomer generation is retiring and is expected to live for decades more, and they only had like 2.5 kids each, so the ratio of workers:retirees is much smaller.

quote:

rules are gonna be changed to short-change those retiring & dump much of the burden on the kids of today


Because people are living longer and having less children, the current SS payroll tax is soon not going to bring in enough revenue to cover the level of benefits that were promised after the current retirement age. So yes, in order to make sure that Social Security is sustainable and that workers today will get anything when they retire, the government has some hard choices to make: raise payroll taxes, raise the retirement age, and/or cut benefits.

quote:

changes to retirement plans


Which has nothing to do with the government.

quote:

If you think the govt is doing a good job, well, did you miss the shutdown?


Do you forget how crappy it was to have even a little less government services for a mere two weeks? That should give you a hint as to how much the federal government does for us.

quote:

did you miss the 2007 depression (which the US is still struggling with)?


Sure. I remember the recession that happened because the GOP cut government regulation of the financial sector. Yeah, those rules were "burdensome" to the banks and seemed pointless to them - because it kept them from fucking us all over to make a few bucks.

quote:

did you miss the NSA spying?


The NSA is unethical, without a doubt. But they are clearly extremely competent at spying on people.

< Message edited by graceadieu -- 10/31/2013 10:24:03 AM >

(in reply to tj444)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 10:29:54 AM   
graceadieu


Posts: 1518
Joined: 3/20/2008
From: Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

quote:

If a parent company owned both providers and insurers, is there any doubt they have accountants working on maximizing that?

Yep, and that kind of stuff definitely happens. For example, one of the biggest prescription benefit management companies in the US, Caremark, is owned by CVS. I've heard some insurers own medical supply companies, too, for the same reason.


How do we fix that?



Government regulation? I mean, really, more robust anti-trust regulation is the only way I can see to do that.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 10:53:41 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Of course but this isn't about what's better for the American people, its about stomping out a socialist principle. Its about visions of Stalin and the Iron curtain by those people detached from reality. ;)
America isn't going through a temporary malfunction. Its entire system is fundamentally flawed. Even so, people are terrified of change and would rather keep on crawling down that same avenue of fucked up-ness than try something that clearly works in many other countries in the western world.

Glad to see that you're not asserting the other side doesn't think their beliefs are best for the American people.

Well pardon my French for understanding and having an interest in world politics!


I don't know French, so I wouldn't have responded if it was in French.

quote:

You, along with all those extreme right wing politicians have no interest in what works in other parts of the world. You are the perpetually incurious and remain willfully ignorant.


Incurious? Me? Why the fuck do you think I'm here?!? I don't know how many of my posts you've read (honest statement there), but I'm always asking questions, especially ones where I'm actually looking for an informative answer.

quote:

I just look on with interest whilst living in a modern social democracy.


You do that.

You have, once again, labelled those that don't agree with your politics as the ones that aren't looking out for the good of the People. It will surprise you, then, once you gain clarity that both parties are pushing for policies that they believe are for the good of the People.

Regardless of what bullshit you read and use to "inform" yourself with, both parties generally want the same ends, but only vary in methods to get there.




_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to MariaB)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 10:57:07 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: graceadieu
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

quote:

If a parent company owned both providers and insurers, is there any doubt they have accountants working on maximizing that?

Yep, and that kind of stuff definitely happens. For example, one of the biggest prescription benefit management companies in the US, Caremark, is owned by CVS. I've heard some insurers own medical supply companies, too, for the same reason.

How do we fix that?

Government regulation? I mean, really, more robust anti-trust regulation is the only way I can see to do that.


Guess what, I've been saying that we need to separate the care providers from the insurers for well over a year now. It tends to get dismissed by most on here, though.

Thanks for the honest answer. I'm glad that I'm not the only one that thinks along those lines.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to graceadieu)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 11:06:28 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

Guess what, I've been saying that we need to separate the care providers from the insurers for well over a year now. It tends to get dismissed by most on here, though.


Nothing like a rigged game. One thing I have noticed about the hospitals in the BALTO area --- it just looks like the money is rolling in by how fancy and upscale the buildings and facilities are. From what I have seen of health care, it's a profit making machine.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 11:19:07 AM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim
Well, since you seem to know the insurance companies never leave a plan alone surely it's not a stretch to assume Sabelius and Obama knew that also and, therefore, knew that most plans would not meet the grandfather exemption and, therefore, THEY DID INDEED LIE. Given that Obamacare mandates what the insurance companies MUST include in their policies, blaming this on the insurance companies is BULL$HIT.

That fact that the insurance companies make those changes, then the onus is on those insurance companies, not the president.
Ergo, the president didn't lie - the insurance companies moved the goalposts.


Not exactly, freedomdwarf. The insurance companies were forced to move them because of Obamacare. This was not a free choice. They had no choice other than to change the policies.

Again, the policies only lost grandfather status if they failed to come into compliance with the ACA or raised premiums while eliminating coverage. Simply obeying the ACA regs is not sufficient!

Simply not true.


Oh really? You don't like it, so therefore its not true. How immature of an answer! Have you bothered to read the whole ACA from cover to cover? All 2409 pages? No? What's your excuse this time? I've read the document. Its online in several places. Easy to access with a goggle search (i.e. 'Affordable Care Act Text PDF').

DK is mostly correct here. What he left out was the definitions of what constitutes a plan that falls out of being grandfathered and must be updated to comply fully with the current laws on the books. It is a fairly lengthy definition over about thirty pages in different parts of the whole document. Now if all of this is 'simply not true', by all means, present the facts to us. Make sure to include the actual page numbers from the ACA.


I've asked you to quote the page and number for a variety of features of OBAMACARE, to substantiate a point.
You have yet to do it once. The one time you were tested on this a few threads back you admitted to not knowing something about ACA. By which I am forced to conclude that your putative reading of the ACA is either non factual or irrelevent as you don't understand.

The simple fact of the matter is that routine, customary, and usual changes that occur in the insurance market every year are not possible under obamacare.

And the inescapable conclusion, obvious to everyone but you, is that millions of people would lose their health care, despite the promise "if you like your healthcare you can keep it"

Of course you can't keep it. Because if you're adding the government into the mix plus millions of more people those people have got to be paid for. And if you keep your old insurance you can't be paying for the new people can you..

Of course not.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 11:21:21 AM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: graceadieu
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

quote:

If a parent company owned both providers and insurers, is there any doubt they have accountants working on maximizing that?

Yep, and that kind of stuff definitely happens. For example, one of the biggest prescription benefit management companies in the US, Caremark, is owned by CVS. I've heard some insurers own medical supply companies, too, for the same reason.

How do we fix that?

Government regulation? I mean, really, more robust anti-trust regulation is the only way I can see to do that.


Guess what, I've been saying that we need to separate the care providers from the insurers for well over a year now. It tends to get dismissed by most on here, though.

Thanks for the honest answer. I'm glad that I'm not the only one that thinks along those lines.




If you've followed the news - there has been almost a 3 fold increase in consolidation due to provisions in the ACA.
Fewer doctors in small practice; more doctors on salary.

Fewer providers = higher prices.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 11:31:00 AM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Well that's the preamble, not the rules entire.

But its sufficient to show that a $5.15 change in copays - in any area - will cause an insurance plan to lose grandfather status.


WRONG!

quote:

On the other hand, fixed-amount cost-sharing
requirements (such as copayments and deductibles) do not take into
account medical inflation. Therefore, changes to fixed-amount cost-
sharing requirements (for example, moving from a $35 copayment to a $40
copayment for outpatient doctor visits) may be reasonable to keep up
with the rising cost of medical items and services.

The rule actually states that the copay can increase by the rate of medical inflation plus 15%. So if $5.15 is below that threshold it is allowed. If it is more than that it is clearly gouging the consumer which is bad.



Wrong yourself.
You quoted the wrong section.

Here's the correction line:

For fixed-amount copayments, a
plan or health insurance coverage ceases to be a grandfathered health
plan if there is an increase since March 23, 2010 in the copayment that
exceeds the greater of (A) the maximum percentage increase or (B) five
dollars increased by medical inflation.

Since medical inflation is under 2%, (google it) increasing the copay for an ambulance ride $5.15 loses grandfathered status.

How can you even argue this - 14 million people are losing insurance.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 12:24:22 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
Hey, but all they need to do is raise the premiums which is not grandfathered, and they aint doing that, or raising the copays, they are flushing the old policies, on their own initiative, nothing doing with ACA. 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 12:44:21 PM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Hey, but all they need to do is raise the premiums which is not grandfathered, and they aint doing that, or raising the copays, they are flushing the old policies, on their own initiative, nothing doing with ACA. 


Do you really not understand?

The insurance companies have one choice: keep the plans virtually identical to as they were on March 23, 2010 (including prices, doctors, copays, formularies ) or cancel them. They may not materially change the plans and continue to offer them.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 12:52:59 PM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
So there were no regulations put in place under Obamacare that impacted grandfathered plans? None?


The ACA explains what is defined as being grandfathered into the law. I'm not going to try to repost it here, since its a serious amount of material. Just using a search for 'grandfathered' in the document doesn't help. Since one has to understand the section first, before understanding how things are grandfathered. An there are A LOT of sections in the ACA.

That said, the regulations only come into effect.....IF......the owner of the insurance plan (i.e. an insurance company) makes changes to the plan that would place it outside of the definition of 'grandfathered'. The ACA pointed out that some (and I'm paraphrasing here) 40-67% of plans (created/maintain before March 31,2010) would not be able to be grandfathered. Well, the actual number seems to be along the lines of 80%. Still that maybe more due to the insurance company simply updating their plans under the law, then the law itself removing their grandfathered status from them.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: OBAMA LIED!!! - 10/31/2013 12:56:47 PM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
So there were no regulations put in place under Obamacare that impacted grandfathered plans? None?


The ACA explains what is defined as being grandfathered into the law. I'm not going to try to repost it here, since its a serious amount of material. Just using a search for 'grandfathered' in the document doesn't help. Since one has to understand the section first, before understanding how things are grandfathered. An there are A LOT of sections in the ACA.

That said, the regulations only come into effect.....IF......the owner of the insurance plan (i.e. an insurance company) makes changes to the plan that would place it outside of the definition of 'grandfathered'. The ACA pointed out that some (and I'm paraphrasing here) 40-67% of plans (created/maintain before March 31,2010) would not be able to be grandfathered. Well, the actual number seems to be along the lines of 80%. Still that maybe more due to the insurance company simply updating their plans under the law, then the law itself removing their grandfathered status from them.


You can't repost the material the regulations "since its a serious amount of material" that causes a policy to lose grandfather status.

And then you think that insurance companies are cancelling the policies for other reasons.

Sure, you know. Insurance companies routinely make money by not selling a product. Makes sense - in the world where we have to pay a tax for not using it.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 80
Page:   <<   < prev  2 3 [4] 5 6   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: OBAMA LIED!!! Page: <<   < prev  2 3 [4] 5 6   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.111