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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/19/2014 6:39:48 PM

Musicmystery

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Nope. Still a false dilemma.

It's still not the only option for oil, and it's still not the only option for energy.

I have a windmill, btw, for electricity. Passive solar construction for heat.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/19/2014 7:30:14 PM

Sanity

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Sure, you dine exclusively on home grown alfalfa sprouts... But how often do you jet down to Palm Springs for a round of golf

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/19/2014 7:35:25 PM

Musicmystery

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Nonetheless, it's still not the only option for oil, and it's still not the only option for energy.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/19/2014 7:49:33 PM

MrRodgers

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
The President has little ability to impact the price of gasoline. There's plenty of shit to pile on Obama, but this isn't one of those turds.

Bullshit
Placing oil fields off limits through executive order, putting off the pipeline decision forever, directing his EPA goons and his IRS goons etc to crack down on every aspect of the energy industry, etc, are but a few of the ways Obama has driven fuel prices (and food prices, and electricity prices etc) to a six year high

US oil production is at an all time high at about 11 million bbls. a day. So talk about bullshit. Gas exports to prop up the price are at or near all time highs.
Obama has done none of the above as also reflected by all time high oil production from the gulf and in fact more off shore leasing then at any time. The pres. can't force them to drill and the oil co. doesn't want to yet, it may bring the price of oil down hey ??
Get a grip man.

Unless something drastic has happened in the last 3 months, we aren't much over 8.2 million bpd.

http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=pet&s=mcrfpus2&f=m

Ok one link included and the one I read before may have included ALL oil related liquids.

Here

Petroleum production, including crude oil and related liquids, known as condensate, and natural gas liquids (NGLs) such as ethane, was 11.27m barrels per day in April, almost equalling the peak of 11.3m b/d reached as an average for 1970. Recent growth rates suggest that it has now exceeded that figure.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 4:16:02 AM

Tkman117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tkman117

They do get a few hundred to a couple thousand jobs to refine the stuff, but most of the money is going to the top, with the pollution being shared by everyone. Yay...

Why shouldn't the money go to the people taking the most risk... Where does it say that if you sit around and get stoned all day you get to make as much as the guys who work their asses off to get ahead

Who are you to say takes the most risk? The guys who ship oil south or the guy working his ass off in a dangerous environment filled with chemicals to refine the stuff just so his boss who doesn't have to get his hands dirty can make a shit ton of chash? Who the fuck are you to judge what a person does with their life?

quote:

As far as sharing pollution goes, what's the alternative - living in caves? We also get to share the fuel and the other products, like the keyboard under your fingers

I didn't realize lacking a few extra hundred gallons would put the people in texas into caves. I knew they were uneducated, but that's just funny

But seriously, are you really that uneducated about capitalism? Capitalism creates alternatives, and there are alternatives out there right now. Wind, solar, biofuels, hydrogen cells, etc. A slow, gradual transition from fossil fuels to greener energy tech will ensure that energy production won't miss a beat (if we did a sudden and massive change to green, of course there would be massive problems with the infrastructure, hence the need of a gradual intelligent shift over time) and it won't get rid of the air pollution over night, but it would solve many problems years down the road if nothing changes.

quote:

Unless people plan on giving up everything that they get from oil, they risk being exposed as hypocrites

The power that runs my computer mostly comes from Nuclear or Hydroelectric from Niagara falls. In terms of electronic devices, I have for all intents and purposes given up oil and I'm still typing this message, proving that hypocrites such as I only only exist in your empty head.

< Message edited by Tkman117 -- 6/20/2014 4:17:15 AM >

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 5:59:23 AM

Sanity

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No, there is no replacement for what oil does for us anywhere in the near future. You're not going to move a freight train with wind...

And that you believe that the Canadian shale reserves only contain a few hundred gallons explains much.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:06:40 AM

Tkman117

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Are you really that dense? Trains all over the world use electricity, not oil/gas to run.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_locomotive

And I never said anything about shale, where the hell did you get that BS?

< Message edited by Tkman117 -- 6/20/2014 6:07:59 AM >

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:17:16 AM

DaddySatyr

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"Electric" locomotives that run in places where there are no over-head electric lines generally run on electricity that is produced by a diesel engine.

Also, most electricity produced in this country is produced using coal. So, in a big way, trains still run on coal (especially the electric ones that run on over-head lines like the Northeast Corridor Line).

Screen captures still RULE! Ya feel me?

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:17:18 AM

Musicmystery

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He really is -- deliberately obtuse at least.

He believes that if you keep saying something, it magically becomes a fact.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:23:32 AM

Tkman117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

"Electric" locomotives that run in places where there are no over-head electric lines generally run on electricity that is produced by a diesel engine.

Also, most electricity produced in this country is produced using coal. So, in a big way, trains still run on coal (especially the electric ones that run on over-head lines like the Northeast Corridor Line).

Screen captures still RULE! Ya feel me?

So maybe thats a hint that you should start moving away from coal to more green tech, like my province of Ontario. We've largely banned the production of new coal facilities and we're shutting down the old ones as the years go by. Alternatives can be a good thing if you just settle your hard on for dirty fuels.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:41:09 AM

Musicmystery

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Much as I'm no fan of coal, it just isn't as easy as that.

In real life, things are complex.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:46:42 AM

Tkman117

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I know, but at least the effort to begin a transition could be made. Not expecting a quick over night fix, but a solid idea and/or plan in the works would make all the difference.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 6:56:03 AM

Musicmystery

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If you think no effort is being made, then you need to spend the rest of the month catching up.

Holy fuck.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 7:40:53 AM

Tkman117

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Well, considering big news about replacing coal with renewables isn't filling the headlines, maybe you could fill me in? I dont pay attention to everything americans do on a daily basis, you people aren't that interesting.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 7:50:09 AM

Musicmystery

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Actually, it's just that you're that ignorant.

And judgmental from that place of ignorance.

But I'll get you started.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 8:07:06 AM

Tkman117

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Lol, so instead of actually pointing me in the right direction you claim I'm ignorant when you have failed to demonstrate a lack of ignorance on your part? Funny. And ya, I agree with you, judgemental and ignorant to a t. But you know what, google aint gonna change that, it can take me to any number of sites which could be true or false, I dont know, I'm "ignorant". If you really want to change my mind, send me somewhere nice and sunny with a lot of good news and science. Because otherwise it just looks like a bad day from up here with all that BS you guys have to deal with every day, so it's hard to see what few good things actually go on in your country.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 8:12:35 AM

Musicmystery

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You're asking me to school you on decades of development.

No. You're a student . . . you know how to find information if you want to.

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 8:19:58 AM

Tkman117

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Decades of development that led where....to further coal use? More subsidies to the oil and gas industry? Is that the information you were talking about? Because if so, I'm not so ignorant and my judgement isn't as unfounded as you think. The US is high on coal and oil, if they've been phasing out coal for renewables I'd love to hear it.

And we're all students, we never stop learning and we never know everything about something. If you're not a student then you're simply stewing in your own opinions, refusing to accept anything new, but I know that's not true about you.

< Message edited by Tkman117 -- 6/20/2014 8:21:22 AM >

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 8:48:56 AM

Musicmystery

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I have many friends, clients, and business associates in Canada. My primary assistant lives in Nova Scotia. So I know your arrogant, willful ignorance doesn't reflect Canada or how it's educational system has apparently failed you.

You are decades behind in your understanding of coal. You also aren't interested in learning about it unless someone spoon feeds those decades to you.

If you were representative, I'd be looking at a future Canada filled with victims unable to address their problems and unable to learn unless outside people come and feed it to them and create policies that lift Canada in their wake. That's a pale shadow of what I know Canada to actually be.

You whine about negative fallout. Consider this -- Iraq is only slightly smaller than Canada in population (it's the next smallest country, #38 after Canada, #37), and, being oil rich, has a GDP of $210 billion, while Canada has a GDP of $1.8 trillion. How can a nation roughly the same size, competing with oil wealth, be 9 times wealthier, each and every year?

It's because Canada is very close to a very large market and supplier, and forges close ties with those US markets. In fact, we buy 76% of your exports.

Imagine 3/4 of your economy, your jobs, gone. That's the effect the US has on your economy -- it's 4 times what it would be without us.

You also import 50% of your goods from us -- and far more cheaply than it would be to get them from across the oceans. Imagine half your goods climbing in price. That's what you'd have without the US.

So whine away. But in the fall -- talk to your academic adviser about taking some economic courses. You know, so someone can spoon feed you this information.

The US traditionally prides itself on initiative. You might learn a few things from that as well.

/school

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RE: Canada OKs oil pipeline to the Pacific Coast... - 6/20/2014 9:04:30 AM

Tkman117

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Lol, that's exactly the point I was trying to make in the other thread. If you guys fail, so do we, I'm not disagreeing with you on that. And I was only asking you to spoon feed because you clearly know something I don't, and I can't seem to find it.

And I find it funny how you tell me to whine away when you went out of your way to write all that ^^^ when it's something I already understand. Hey man, not being #1 can be hard, wouldn't hurt to learn a little humility. I know, you're gonna say that's hypocritical of me to say, but I already accept that Canada isn't the best, we have a lot of problems and the US is our best trading partner and our best ally. We can both do better.

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