RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (Full Version)

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Aylee -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:17:35 PM)

Okay. . . the browser messed up and so I ended up writing my response twice, so you get two forms of me answering the question.



thompsonx -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:19:45 PM)

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Well, first their was the excuse of "we don't want to be accused of racism." A little weird since neither Muslim or Pakistani is a race.

Then:

There were only 88 a year.

So far you are the only punkassmotherfucker who has made this excuse and you said "I guess that makes it okay"



thompsonx -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:22:13 PM)


ORIGINAL: Aylee

Well, first their was the excuse of "we don't want to be accused of racism." A little weird since neither Muslim or Pakistani is a race.

Did it escape your notice that pakistanis are not white? Did it escape your notice that most brits are white? Or are you just terminally stupid?




Kirata -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:30:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

They have now found a form of love which they didnt get from their family.

You are one sick motherfucker.

K, come on. You *must* know he didn't mean it the way you imply.

Nowhere in the report is the abuse and gang-rape of underage girls characterized as "a form of love." I know what you think he intended to say, that the girls believed they were loved. But that is not in fact what he actually said, and if he had simply misspoken he would not be trying to defend his sick claim by pointing to the report to back it up. Sorry, no cigar.

K.



crazyml -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:45:04 PM)

The intended meaning was very clear to me. I am surprised that you failed to understand the intended meaning, a mistake that you must surely have made, since had you properly understoodwhat he had written then your selective quoting and apparent outrage would be you being a lying little stain of a man.

The tragedy of this hateful episode in the UK's history is that many of these young girls were fooled into believing that their abusers cared for them. Many of them were selected because they were vulnerable and needy. That neediness is what made do many of these victims so vulnerable.





Aylee -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:45:47 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

They have now found a form of love which they didnt get from their family.

You are one sick motherfucker.

K, come on. You *must* know he didn't mean it the way you imply.

Nowhere in the report is the abuse and gang-rape of underage girls characterized as "a form of love." I know what you think he intended to say, that the girls believed they were loved. But that is not in fact what he actually said, and if he had simply misspoken he would not be trying to defend his sick claim by pointing to the report to back it up. Sorry, no cigar.

K.



You are just mean Kirata. When was the last time you saw a young girl not being loved enough by her parents and took her home to rape and share with your friends?

Show some love man!



subrosaDom -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:48:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

ORIGINAL: subrosaDom

As for Maoism, you're right.

Right????I asked you a question nothing more. If you do not know the answer then shut the fuck up.

Apparently the sarcasm escaped you.



What could I possibly say that is bad about a philosophy that destroyed individual freedom,

Perhaps you might elucidate about the individual freedoms that the nationalist under chaing kai scheck possessed that they lost under mao?



eliminated the arts

Chiang Kai-shek was a totalitarian, too, contrary to popular belief. One could argue if he would have been as bad as Mao. He certainly didn't kill 30 to 50 million people. He certainly didn't ban all art.

So far we only have your ignorant unsubstantiated opinion and not a bit more.

You are obviously well-read enough to be familiar with the Cultural Revolution. That is hardly unsubstantiated. It is well known that all Western art and music was banned, that instruments and works of art were destroyed, that musicians and artists were allowed only to create "Revolutionary" art or simply better to toil in the fields or perhaps in the prison camps.

and made everyone prisoners of the state.

With the whole country in prison who were the guards? Who produced the food for all of these prisoners? How did they produce a nuclear weapon? Who built the schools that taugh the scientists how to chuck crap into outer space?
So there were no prisons? Did you consider that being sent into the country to work the fields when previously you were an intellectual was essentially the same? Do you choose to deny this? That's perhaps one step above Holocaust Denial, but not much more.

Maybe I was wrong







PeonForHer -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:56:03 PM)

FR

Fucking hell, I knew this thread would turn into trash. Seriously, PS, I applaud your trying, but this is turning into just the manure-flinging contest that I thought it would.

Some points I think worth making:

1. Most of the perpetrators involved in this were young, Pakistani males who were nominally Muslim. I say 'nominally' because they're young, not well-educated, not devout and b) *brought up in the UK which has a Christian tradition*. They are westernised and have the macho 'gangster' attitude that goes with that in certain young men, but they're also from a background that is deeply sexist. It took a combination of *all* these things to make them the trash that they are.

2. It's clear that they got away with it in a large part because they were shielded by their race. But this is only partly about 'political correctness' and the power it holds. It's about power, full stop. That much is clear from the fact that powerful and influential whites have been getting away with it for decades, too - as has been coming to light over the past few years. Savile's assaults *alone* number in the hundreds. Other celebs are already in jail as a result of Operation Yewtree's investigations.

And this is all *on top of* continuing, relentlessly-repeated, soul-destroying revelations about child abuse in the Catholic Church. And amongst former cabinet ministers. And amongst those whose profession it is to 'care' for children.

Child abuse is endemic here. Something is clearly rotten. But, to me, it only scratches one of the surfaces to lay into Islam. It's not racism that's the fundamental problem, nor political correctness - it's a lack of concern for children, and lack of the guts it takes for the police and other authorities to do their frigging jobs properly. There will always be people who'll abuse their power. There are supposed to be institutions in any democracy that help to guard against that. These people have fucked up, on so many fronts. They have been stodgy, lazy, incompetent, uncaring turds. Against the power of the church, or celebrities, or political correctness, they've just gone home, had a nice cup of tea with biscuits, and put it out of their minds. I absolutely do blame these people, as well as the perpetrators. They simply haven't done their jobs.

3. And re that last, we may not have seen all the 'fronts', yet. Catholic churchmen, celebrities, now Pakistani gangs in Rotherham. But, here's the thing: why should we assume this is the end of it? How many other great big issues of organised child abuse are going to transpire?

4. Call it all evil if that helps. Fine. Of course it's evil. But calling it evil in and of itself solves sod all. It doesn't eliminate the problem. I would like the problem to be eliminated. Anyone who *really does* see that as the prime target, please offer your ideas. If I can work out something I see sensible and practicable as a plan, I will bully my MP mercilessly until he does the same in the House of Commons. (That does actually work here in the UK, so long as you're prepared to hassle your MP so much he'll do what you want just to make you go away.)



crazyml -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 2:56:40 PM)

Well of course that's a hilarious posting, and I hope it gave you plenty of chuckles.

But, in actual fact, that is what happened to some of these girls. So I'm glad you can eke some amusement out of the rape and abuse of young women, it's a little lost on me though.

And, importantly, on a site like this, how many vulnerable (sometimes naive, sometimes plain stupid, but also sometimes lost and desperately needy) women (and men) find themselves preyed upon by abusers?

Hilarious? Nope.



PeonForHer -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 3:00:23 PM)

quote:

Nowhere in the report is the abuse and gang-rape of underage girls characterized as "a form of love." I know what you think he intended to say, that the girls believed they were loved. But that is not in fact what he actually said, and if he had simply misspoken he would not be trying to defend his sick claim by pointing to the report to back it up. Sorry, no cigar.

K.


Jeez, K, please stop pushing this. It's wrong. It's tantamount to saying that PoliteSub is a paedo himself. However much you might dislike the man he doesn't do 'sick'. I think you know that. Please retract this.



thompsonx -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 3:04:43 PM)

ORIGINAL: subrosaDom

Chiang Kai-shek was a totalitarian, too, contrary to popular belief. One could argue if he would have been as bad as Mao.

Why was it that so many choose mao?


He certainly didn't kill 30 to 50 million people.

What validation do you have for mao murdering that many ?
How many did chaing murder?




He certainly didn't ban all art.

Nither did mao

So far we only have your ignorant unsubstantiated opinion and not a bit more.

You are obviously well-read enough to be familiar with the Cultural Revolution.

I have read western propaganda and I have read chinese propaganda concerning that period. Tell us now that you favor the grants that maplethorp got or shut the fuck up about artistic freedom.



That is hardly unsubstantiated.

Perhaps in your zip code propaganda is considered substantiated but not many people live there.


It is well known that all Western art and music was banned,

Known by whom?



that instruments and works of art were destroyed, that musicians and artists


Much as native american art and culture were systematically dismantled in an effort to aculturize them to the new sherrif in town.


were allowed only to create "Revolutionary" art or simply better to toil in the fields or perhaps in the prison camps.


Actually it was more like the wpa in the u.s. Artists creaed art and musicians created music.

and made everyone prisoners of the state.

With the whole country in prison who were the guards? Who produced the food for all of these prisoners? How did they produce a nuclear weapon? Who built the schools that taugh the scientists how to chuck crap into outer space?


So there were no prisons?


You are the one with the rosy scenario not me so I just ask you to explane yourself and so far all you have done is parrot back propaganda I have heard for the past 50 years.

Did you consider that being sent into the country to work the fields when previously you were an intellectual was essentially the same?

Not in my zip code. Duke cunningham doing 8 large in the federal pen is prison. Working for a living is not.


Do you choose to deny this?

I have only asked you to tell me what the fuck you do not like about mao and so far you have not offered up shit except your ignorant unsubstantiated opinion and some rather dated propaganda. So either back your shit up or shut the phoque up about what a turd someone is that you know fuck all about.



crazyml -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 3:07:13 PM)

Tragically, I agree that this is unlikely to be the last discovery of organised child abuse.

I would say that while the different episodes you list all have some really nasty things in common, they're all distinguished in other ways.

In the case of Rotherham, I do think that a fairly prevalent view among some fundamentalist Muslims that non-Muslim girls are "trash" contributed to the abuse. I saw this attitude to non-Muslim girls quite a lot at Uni in the 1980's, to the point where we organized night buses to get students that would otherwise have had to walk through a certain part of town home safely.

As a parent, I have to say that I find the sexualisation of young people disturbing to the point of it being sickening, and that is something that is by no means unique to the UK.

I think there are lessons to be drawn from this by everyone, whatever their country, nationality, or political persuasion. I sincerely hope that there isn't another episode here in the UK or elsewhere (and if it's "elsewhere" I hope I'll be able to offer up an example to those from other nations who appear to be quite pleased this has happened in the UK, by not being the kind of pointless wanker who would try to score points from something like this).



Kirata -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 3:29:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Jeez, K, please stop pushing this. It's wrong. It's tantamount to saying that PoliteSub is a paedo himself. However much you might dislike the man he doesn't do 'sick'. I think you know that. Please retract this.

I'm not "pushing" it. I expressed my opinion. You questioned it, so I responded. But speaking more directly to the point of your post, I am emphatically not saying that PS is a paedo, and I don't even know how you got there. But let's not extend the matter with further discussion.

K.




Kirata -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 3:47:15 PM)


I'm not sure all those comparisons really work. Lots of nasty shit gets hidden. But when something this bad comes to the attention of the police, and they do nothing (well not always nothing, see below) because they're afraid of offending "cultural sensitivities" or being called "racist," the only solution I can think of is to dump the PC shit and return to the real world.

Police went to a house outside which a father was demanding the release of his daughter, who was inside with a group of British Pakistani adults. Officers found the girl, 14, who had been drugged, under a bed. The father and his daughter were arrested for racial harassment and assault respectively. Police left, leaving three men at the house with two more girls. ~The Times, September 24, 2012

No direct link because the story is paywalled, but quoted on multiple sites.

K.




Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 4:04:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

They have now found a form of love which they didnt get from their family.

You are one sick motherfucker.

K, come on. You *must* know he didn't mean it the way you imply.

Nowhere in the report is the abuse and gang-rape of underage girls characterized as "a form of love." I know what you think he intended to say, that the girls believed they were loved. But that is not in fact what he actually said, and if he had simply misspoken he would not be trying to defend his sick claim by pointing to the report to back it up. Sorry, no cigar.

K.



Good to see you read the pages I mentioned K........ Oh wait, I didnt expect that, did I. Carry on being an arsehole, because I will surely carry on pointing it out.



Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 4:10:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Jeez, K, please stop pushing this. It's wrong. It's tantamount to saying that PoliteSub is a paedo himself. However much you might dislike the man he doesn't do 'sick'. I think you know that. Please retract this.

I'm not "pushing" it. I expressed my opinion. You questioned it, so I responded. But speaking more directly to the point of your post, I am emphatically not saying that PS is a paedo, and I don't even know how you got there. But let's not extend the matter with further discussion.

K.




To interject, I dont feel he was suggesting that. I do feel he hasnt read the whole report, nor the pages I mentioned.



Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 4:12:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

Peon. I meant it in exactly the way he thought. It says as much in the report on page 37. I think its section 5.


Yeah, but you didn't put the word "love" in inverted commas, PS. Fatal. Here, that means you condone it. Love is by definition 'always a good and desirable thing', remember?


My bad, I didnt expect those out for my head not having the brains to interpret my post.



Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 4:19:36 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Well, first their was the excuse of "we don't want to be accused of racism." A little weird since neither Muslim or Pakistani is a race.


Love the excuse of the bigots, "Muslim is not a race" Lets not forget these weasle words mean just that.

"I am talking about Pakistani Muslims but its not racism" This is nothing more than the cry of racists to make themselves feel better.



Kirata -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 4:36:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

Peon. I meant it in exactly the way he thought. It says as much in the report on page 37. I think its section 5.

Yeah, but...

You're going to hurt yourself bending over backwards like that.

K.




Lucylastic -> RE: Rotherham child abuse and the cover up (8/30/2014 4:49:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

And what happened in Rochdale didn't rock the country?

Shit like this is evil. But none dare call it evil? Instead we see excuses being made.



Who the *hell* is making excuses, Aylee? What are you talking about?


It is only a minority.

There were only 88 a year.

They were giving a form of love.

The Christians have been worse throughout history.

And heck, at least they were not being fostered to conservatives.

I personally believe that people that commit these acts have violated the social contract and therefore no longer receive the protections of the social contract and have forfeited the protections of it. Kill them or eject them from society.


And i have stated often that rapists of kids should in the absence of a death penalty, never be allowed out of prison, be medically castrated, and have their hands cut off. Wether they be white, black brown green with orange spots or christian, muslim, jewish, sikh, etc etc amen.

I was responding in my post to one dumbfukers post, not the whole nightmare issue of race. Or religion .
If you knew anything....the form of grooming was part of the build up to the acts....a lot of these girls WERE from broken homes, looking to be cared about. After they were snared with friendship, were they abused. Yes like battered women but worse.

Before 1993 there was a huge blow up in the uk, when numerous families had their kids taken away from them, claiming they had been sexually abused....like in philadelphia, and elsewhere, they were found to be victims of " false memories"
From stupid regression therapy, recovered memories. It told unknown damage, not only to the kids, and their families, but also to social service workers. Abusers got away with it largely, kids were scarred and doubted, the psyche community was put into doubt by everyone, the police, parents etc ad nauseam, schools started by law having to report bruises, dejection and questionable issues with children in their care. Doctors had to report signs of abuse. It ate everything up, it shit on the kids that were badly abused, it made people afraid of their spouses being vindictive, in divorce and custody battles, yes it happened before that, but the 90s was the start of the paranoia about false memory syndrome. Of course on the other hand it shielded way too many tragic abuse stories.

Its not an excuse. Its part of history.
And it still happens, innocent people being framed, abusers getting away with such nasty horrendous crimes.
No one thinks this report is anything less than a huge horror. A blight on society, everywhere it happens. It should not have happened. To suggest otherwise is a lie.



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