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RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 5:00:33 PM   
Lucylastic


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Considering the other threads on "fire" here, is anyone but me wondering where the hell the "state sanctioned violence" idea is suddenly the most important thing for thinking against this plan/idea??

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Profile   Post #: 121
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 5:02:26 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

The government has an option for ensuring compliance that pretty much no one else does. Government ensures compliance with their rules and policies through state-sanctioned violence.

No one thinks that the doctors are going to ensure compliance. The government can. I just want to know the method.


I am not sure whether to cry at your ignorance or laugh at your stupidity.

(in reply to Aylee)
Profile   Post #: 122
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 5:07:06 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Considering the other threads on "fire" here, is anyone but me wondering where the hell the "state sanctioned violence" idea is suddenly the most important thing for thinking against this plan/idea??


I am fine with "State sanctioned violence" provided they let you carry it out sweetiepie.

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 123
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 5:09:00 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LiveSpark


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

So, since you are in the UK can you tell us all how the "close monitoring to ensure they are eating better and exercising more," is going to work?

How does the government ENSURE healthy eating and exercising?


I will explain it, just as soon as you show me anywhere were the government has said they are going to ensure fuck all, let alone made it compulsory. Hardly any point me educating you on UK matters when you cant even follow your shock horrow story for what it actually is.

Your big problem is, you cant even read the link in your own fucking OP properly.

If you knew fuck all about fuck all, this is an idea put forward by Simon Stevens, who is Chief Executive of NHS England. Just for fun, do you know much about that giant United Health Group, the American firm that Stevens was President of ? Do you know anything about the gropus diabetes health plan, do you wonder where Stevens may have got this idea from in the first place ?

http://www.unitedhealthgroup.com/newsroom/articles/news/unitedhealthcare/2013/0110uhcstudydiabetes.aspx

While the NHS isnt run by the Government per se, it (NHS) doesnt set government policy. YOUR link and therefore the crap you spew as UK policy, is just an idea put forward by Stevens. Do you need a grown up to join all the dots for you ?



Collarchat hasn't seen fit to add a "like" button so


Thank you........ One would think there wasnt a need to state the obvious, but our friends in the GOP seem to need some help. All this, despite having Google at hand.

(in reply to LiveSpark)
Profile   Post #: 124
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 5:10:28 PM   
LiveSpark


Posts: 808
Joined: 12/25/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: LiveSpark


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

So, since you are in the UK can you tell us all how the "close monitoring to ensure they are eating better and exercising more," is going to work?

How does the government ENSURE healthy eating and exercising?


I will explain it, just as soon as you show me anywhere were the government has said they are going to ensure fuck all, let alone made it compulsory. Hardly any point me educating you on UK matters when you cant even follow your shock horrow story for what it actually is.

Your big problem is, you cant even read the link in your own fucking OP properly.

If you knew fuck all about fuck all, this is an idea put forward by Simon Stevens, who is Chief Executive of NHS England. Just for fun, do you know much about that giant United Health Group, the American firm that Stevens was President of ? Do you know anything about the gropus diabetes health plan, do you wonder where Stevens may have got this idea from in the first place ?

http://www.unitedhealthgroup.com/newsroom/articles/news/unitedhealthcare/2013/0110uhcstudydiabetes.aspx

While the NHS isnt run by the Government per se, it (NHS) doesnt set government policy. YOUR link and therefore the crap you spew as UK policy, is just an idea put forward by Stevens. Do you need a grown up to join all the dots for you ?



Collarchat hasn't seen fit to add a "like" button so


Thank you........ One would think there wasnt a need to state the obvious, but our friends in the GOP seem to need some help. All this, despite having Google at hand.


Experience tells me you could draw a detailed diagram and it wouldn't help. Kudos for trying.

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(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 125
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 5:17:11 PM   
LiveSpark


Posts: 808
Joined: 12/25/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Considering the other threads on "fire" here, is anyone but me wondering where the hell the "state sanctioned violence" idea is suddenly the most important thing for thinking against this plan/idea??


I don't think thinking is a part of their reaction. They just reflexively react that way to anything not thought up by the GOP.

_____________________________

I've been here as MontrealPhoenix, zephyr and
TheFireWithinMe.

I also have the sarcasm gene which is NOT to be taken seriously.

If you fall I'll always be there to catch you ~ Floor

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 126
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 6:10:59 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
Yes... that directive is to make professional notes on the patients records by the doctor.
The whole idea of that is for the locum or any other doctor to be aware that the patient has been advised about their weight gain and that they have been advised to do something about it and also whatever follow-up actions have been taken thus far.
It is also of great benefit when a patient is seeing another doctor, either temporarily (whilst away from home) or are in the process of relocating.The government have nothing to do with the info being recorded, nor do the NHS in general.
In the US, that info would be abused by private insurance companies to wriggle out of payments by adding to the exclusions in the policy.
Because we don't have that problem, the info is just for doctors and other medical staff to be aware of.
It is basically allowing for continuity of patient information regardless of where that patient is or which medical professional they are seeing at the time.
Many doctors are diligent and record it all anyway, others are not so diligent in what they record.
A good example would be if you were referred to a dietician and/or occupational therapist for treatment.
Each element would provide reports to the patient's doctor and their findings/progress can be recorded in the confidential records.
That way, if a certain type of procedure or diet or whatever didn't work for that particular patient, the next dietician/therapist knows what has been tried and what the results were.


WTF have physicians been doing up to now?!? Haven't they been taking notes and updating patient records?!? FFS, the last time I had an appointment with the same Doctor (my GP has recently left the practice and I have only had one appt. since, so there has only been one with this last person), he referred to my records to follow up on something we'd talked about the last time, and he even knew if my weight, BP, and HR had changed since then. Interestingly enough, when my first GP in this area retired, the guy that took over had my records.

Wanna know something else crazy? I was able to get my dental records from when I was a kid sent up to my current dentist (same State, but different cities). This was way back in the late 1990's, too. Fucking insane how this shit's been going on, yet government thinks they need to force the issue...

quote:

Do I have to keep stressing that patient confidentiality is not compromised??
Nobody is reporting anything to anyone except personal records being recorded by the patient's doctor.
The government and the NHS are not involved in keeping or maintaining these records.
And the word "ensured" that people are picking on, was a bit of a misnomer and a bad choice.
Nothing is ever "ensured" at all, by anyone, in any sense of the word.
Monitored (if they participate) and recorded, yes.


Are you sure the NHS isn't being informed? To whom are GP's identifying the patients who have gained weight?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)
Profile   Post #: 127
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 6:15:33 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
For years I've been saying that the NHS needs to catch on to the rest of Europe and start being more pro active regarding preventative medicine. Preventative medicine is good, preventative medicine saves lives and preventative medicine guarantees that people will live longer.


Wait, what? The NHS isn't all about preventative medicine yet?!? I thought that was one OMG benefit of a nationalized health care system!

Say it ain't so!!


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to MariaB)
Profile   Post #: 128
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/27/2014 6:16:43 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
If you are admitted to hospital in the UK with an illness that could be related to your obesity, you are offered advice regarding your weight as well as a support system to help you lose the lbs. All they are doing is offering that support and advice before you're admitted into hospital.


Why haven't they been doing this all along?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to MariaB)
Profile   Post #: 129
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 3:11:44 AM   
MariaB


Posts: 2969
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
For years I've been saying that the NHS needs to catch on to the rest of Europe and start being more pro active regarding preventative medicine. Preventative medicine is good, preventative medicine saves lives and preventative medicine guarantees that people will live longer.


Wait, what? The NHS isn't all about preventative medicine yet?!? I thought that was one OMG benefit of a nationalized health care system!

Say it ain't so!!



Whilst its miles ahead of America, it has a lot of catching up to do with the rest of Europe. Whilst the NHS is good, its far from perfect. Did you believe it was or did I just unsuspectingly give you the chunk of ammunition you needed ?!?!



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(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 130
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 3:14:09 AM   
MariaB


Posts: 2969
Joined: 4/3/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
If you are admitted to hospital in the UK with an illness that could be related to your obesity, you are offered advice regarding your weight as well as a support system to help you lose the lbs. All they are doing is offering that support and advice before you're admitted into hospital.


Why haven't they been doing this all along?



I don't know!!
I'm not going to get into a tit for tat debate with you DS because you don't get the British medical system, not because you haven't tried but because you don't want to. I honestly can't be bothered to argue with deaf ears.


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Profile   Post #: 131
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 3:31:21 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
For years I've been saying that the NHS needs to catch on to the rest of Europe and start being more pro active regarding preventative medicine. Preventative medicine is good, preventative medicine saves lives and preventative medicine guarantees that people will live longer.


Wait, what? The NHS isn't all about preventative medicine yet?!? I thought that was one OMG benefit of a nationalized health care system!

Say it ain't so!!




Another dopey post....... did you miss the part I have highlighted in Marias post.

AS for your previous post about being able to get your dental records from as far back as the late 1990s. Wow dude, thats fucking awsome, I can only get mine from as far back as the day I was born in 1953.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 132
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 3:37:12 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
I have been leaving a few clues for some of our right wing friends about a decent healthcare system. NHS Wales and NHS Scotland have both had obesity healthcare plans in operation for a few years (2010 from memory) As far as I can see, no one has been jailed or even questioned by the cops for continuing to eat a MacDonalds or KFC. Although Mister William Wallace of Sterling was given a police caution for eating a fucking doughnut, thats just wrong man.

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 133
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 3:38:56 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
It seems someone has done a break down on the benefits of preventing obesity.

http://stateofobesity.org/cost-containment/

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 134
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 4:13:39 AM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
Yes... that directive is to make professional notes on the patients records by the doctor.
The whole idea of that is for the locum or any other doctor to be aware that the patient has been advised about their weight gain and that they have been advised to do something about it and also whatever follow-up actions have been taken thus far.
It is also of great benefit when a patient is seeing another doctor, either temporarily (whilst away from home) or are in the process of relocating.The government have nothing to do with the info being recorded, nor do the NHS in general.
In the US, that info would be abused by private insurance companies to wriggle out of payments by adding to the exclusions in the policy.
Because we don't have that problem, the info is just for doctors and other medical staff to be aware of.
It is basically allowing for continuity of patient information regardless of where that patient is or which medical professional they are seeing at the time.
Many doctors are diligent and record it all anyway, others are not so diligent in what they record.
A good example would be if you were referred to a dietician and/or occupational therapist for treatment.
Each element would provide reports to the patient's doctor and their findings/progress can be recorded in the confidential records.
That way, if a certain type of procedure or diet or whatever didn't work for that particular patient, the next dietician/therapist knows what has been tried and what the results were.


WTF have physicians been doing up to now?!? Haven't they been taking notes and updating patient records?!? FFS, the last time I had an appointment with the same Doctor (my GP has recently left the practice and I have only had one appt. since, so there has only been one with this last person), he referred to my records to follow up on something we'd talked about the last time, and he even knew if my weight, BP, and HR had changed since then. Interestingly enough, when my first GP in this area retired, the guy that took over had my records.

Wanna know something else crazy? I was able to get my dental records from when I was a kid sent up to my current dentist (same State, but different cities). This was way back in the late 1990's, too. Fucking insane how this shit's been going on, yet government thinks they need to force the issue...

The doctors have been making notes, yes.
But most of those notes are "clinical" notes.
That would be your weight, BP, ailments, medications etc.
What they haven't done in the past (until recently) is making notes on things that might help with preventative medicine.
So, while most have been recording your weight, cholesterol etc, and probably made verbal comments on losing that weight or cutting out fats, they have not included those comments on the official notes and certainly not noted what other health clinics and plans were available for the patient to follow up on and whether they did so or not.

And as I also said in my earlier comment, part of the exercise was to update the computer systems so that the new info was interchangeable between them.
By making the systems more compatible, it saved a lot of time by not having to print-off and send this info by post because it can now (in most circumstances) be sent electronically.
Many of the older systems did not have the necessary capacity to store such extraneous and wordy info. Only in recent years has the hardware (hard drives/offline backups etc) offered the capacity and affordability to expand the software to include lots of extra info.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

Do I have to keep stressing that patient confidentiality is not compromised??
Nobody is reporting anything to anyone except personal records being recorded by the patient's doctor.
The government and the NHS are not involved in keeping or maintaining these records.
And the word "ensured" that people are picking on, was a bit of a misnomer and a bad choice.
Nothing is ever "ensured" at all, by anyone, in any sense of the word.
Monitored (if they participate) and recorded, yes.


Are you sure the NHS isn't being informed? To whom are GP's identifying the patients who have gained weight?

Do you understand who or what the NHS actually is??
It is a general umbrella named government department run and overseen by an MP who's job it is to allocate funding and ensure that things are coordinated across the country when it comes to supplies etc.
Beyond that, each and every doctor, hospital, clinic etc is a separate entity with their own accounts, managers, staff and budgets just like any other commercial enterprise.
The only difference is that these institutions are funded by the NHS, do not have to make a profit (and most don't), and their supplies are funded and organized/delivered from one central point - the NHS system.
That means that all the staff wages, facilities etc are paid for by the NHS within strict budgetary limits/allocations. Unlike the US "government funded" system where it's all private (including the grossly obscene salaries and profits) and the government just pay what they are invoiced.

And as I said earlier - the patients and their (new) extended notes are reported on the individual patient records; they are not reported or recorded outside of that environment.
As Maria commented, it is for the presentation of preventative medicine and procedures in a pro-active health plan.
This is something the Europeans have been doing for some time and we are catching up.

This sort of thing doesn't happen much in the US because it relies on:
1) the patient participating (and if they don't, they risk an additional exclusion);
2) the patient being able to afford the extra clinic/doctor visits and meds;
3) the insurance policy covering such preventative measures rather than just clinical treatments.
And from what I understand from my Americans friends I speak to, #3 isn't in most of their policies so it would cost them thousands of $'s to participate.


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(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 135
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 8:03:09 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
For years I've been saying that the NHS needs to catch on to the rest of Europe and start being more pro active regarding preventative medicine. Preventative medicine is good, preventative medicine saves lives and preventative medicine guarantees that people will live longer.

Wait, what? The NHS isn't all about preventative medicine yet?!? I thought that was one OMG benefit of a nationalized health care system!
Say it ain't so!!

Whilst its miles ahead of America, it has a lot of catching up to do with the rest of Europe. Whilst the NHS is good, its far from perfect. Did you believe it was or did I just unsuspectingly give you the chunk of ammunition you needed ?!?!


Part of the sell for a nationalized health care system was that it would move from reactive medicine to preventative medicine. That the NHS is having, in your opinion, to focus on moving more towards preventative medicine, just goes to show that it's not necessarily a hallmark of a nationalized system.

No one is truly going to argue that preventative care isn't better, less costly, and doesn't have better outcomes. But, it's not necessarily because of a nationalized system. There are plenty of people in the US (and it was a topic addressed in a college Health class I had back in the early 90's) that take a preventative care approach to their lives, even though we don't have a nationalized system. It's a personal choice to do so or not.

There are things that can be done that don't require going to a doctor. Does an obese person really not know that being that fat isn't good? You have to be willfully ignorant to not know that being active is better for you than not being active, and that how much you eat, and what you're eating, makes a big difference. Everyone doesn't have to know the intricacies of how the body breaks down starches, proteins and fats for use or storage. There could be a great reduction in health care spending simply by people doing things for themselves that don't require outside medical care.

It won't solve the need for all health care, but it will reduce it, and it will also help reduce the intensity of care needed, all of which tends to be less expensive.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to MariaB)
Profile   Post #: 136
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 8:06:43 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
If you are admitted to hospital in the UK with an illness that could be related to your obesity, you are offered advice regarding your weight as well as a support system to help you lose the lbs. All they are doing is offering that support and advice before you're admitted into hospital.

Why haven't they been doing this all along?

I don't know!!
I'm not going to get into a tit for tat debate with you DS because you don't get the British medical system, not because you haven't tried but because you don't want to. I honestly can't be bothered to argue with deaf ears.


Obviously, you're clueless about what I get and what I don't get.

Why does the NHS have to make a program for GP's to do this? My GP's have been doing this for the last 15 years. Why haven't GP's in the UK been doing this all along? The NHS started in 1948, right? Why has it taken 66 years to get the point where GP's are going to start keeping track of patient health markers?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to MariaB)
Profile   Post #: 137
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 8:27:25 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
For years I've been saying that the NHS needs to catch on to the rest of Europe and start being more pro active regarding preventative medicine. Preventative medicine is good, preventative medicine saves lives and preventative medicine guarantees that people will live longer.

Wait, what? The NHS isn't all about preventative medicine yet?!? I thought that was one OMG benefit of a nationalized health care system!
Say it ain't so!!

Another dopey post....... did you miss the part I have highlighted in Marias post.
AS for your previous post about being able to get your dental records from as far back as the late 1990s. Wow dude, thats fucking awsome, I can only get mine from as far back as the day I was born in 1953.


I guess I wasn't clear enough. My bad. I transferred my childhood dental records in the late 1990's to my current dentist. That just goes to show you that records have been kept and transferable for at least 20 years here, without the need for a nationalized health care system.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 138
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 8:38:32 AM   
Aibo


Posts: 110
Joined: 1/28/2006
Status: offline


@DesideriScuri: I hope we're agreeing here: reducing the health care cost by going proactive is of utmost importance, and regardless of what kind of framework it runs under. national or commercial or any mix - which is what we got currently where I am located.

One very interesting study have been done comparing the scene now that commercial alternatives have turned up - and that is that increased the overall cost. The conclusion of the study was that the commercial ones 'sold' unnecessary tests and treatments on patients since that is a way to earn more money.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 139
RE: Doctors told to report patients who put on weight - 12/28/2014 8:44:48 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
The doctors have been making notes, yes.
But most of those notes are "clinical" notes.
That would be your weight, BP, ailments, medications etc.
What they haven't done in the past (until recently) is making notes on things that might help with preventative medicine.
So, while most have been recording your weight, cholesterol etc, and probably made verbal comments on losing that weight or cutting out fats, they have not included those comments on the official notes and certainly not noted what other health clinics and plans were available for the patient to follow up on and whether they did so or not.


Why two sets of notes?

Why haven't they been telling patients what's available to help them? Why does it take a full-blown system initiative to have this kind of thing done?

quote:

And as I also said in my earlier comment, part of the exercise was to update the computer systems so that the new info was interchangeable between them.
By making the systems more compatible, it saved a lot of time by not having to print-off and send this info by post because it can now (in most circumstances) be sent electronically.
Many of the older systems did not have the necessary capacity to store such extraneous and wordy info. Only in recent years has the hardware (hard drives/offline backups etc) offered the capacity and affordability to expand the software to include lots of extra info.


Obviously, as technology improves, IT systems will have to be upgraded. That's not exactly surprising at all. That's not what was going on here, either.

quote:

Do you understand who or what the NHS actually is??
It is a general umbrella named government department run and overseen by an MP who's job it is to allocate funding and ensure that things are coordinated across the country when it comes to supplies etc.
Beyond that, each and every doctor, hospital, clinic etc is a separate entity with their own accounts, managers, staff and budgets just like any other commercial enterprise.
The only difference is that these institutions are funded by the NHS, do not have to make a profit (and most don't), and their supplies are funded and organized/delivered from one central point - the NHS system.
That means that all the staff wages, facilities etc are paid for by the NHS within strict budgetary limits/allocations. Unlike the US "government funded" system where it's all private (including the grossly obscene salaries and profits) and the government just pay what they are invoiced.


Yes, I do understand what the NHS is, and have a decent grasp (regardless of what many of you think) of the health care system in the UK.

quote:

And as I said earlier - the patients and their (new) extended notes are reported on the individual patient records; they are not reported or recorded outside of that environment.
As Maria commented, it is for the presentation of preventative medicine and procedures in a pro-active health plan.
This is something the Europeans have been doing for some time and we are catching up.


Why are there two sets of notes? Why hasn't that been done all along? Nationalized health care systems have been sold as being more about preventative medicine and being proactive. I think here is proof that this is not necessarily a benefit of that system.

quote:

This sort of thing doesn't happen much in the US because it relies on:
1) the patient participating (and if they don't, they risk an additional exclusion);
2) the patient being able to afford the extra clinic/doctor visits and meds;
3) the insurance policy covering such preventative measures rather than just clinical treatments.
And from what I understand from my Americans friends I speak to, #3 isn't in most of their policies so it would cost them thousands of $'s to participate.


1) Patient participation is the patient's responsibility, here or there. That has little to do with the system.
2) And here we have a case where lower costs for goods and services means more people can afford it (why are you labeling it as "extra?")
3) Then, they have shitty insurance. It works in insurance's favor to cover preventative care because it helps reduce the need for more costly procedures. Insurance companies aren't out to spend as much as possible. They're out to spend as little as possible.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)
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