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RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:43:08 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

So you managed to quote and all without saying shit.

Could you answer the question : do you think it's reasonable to show up at,let's call it a "new" ,neighbors hose....for something as benign as a barbecue,with or wearing ,a damm gun ?

Do you think it is smart to start off with an accusatory attitude toward an armed person you don't know?
Please point out when I said he did everything right, you can't because I didn't. You are also demanding that I back down from something I didn't say.

No,I'm asking you straight up.....you are in a situation where you are cold meeting people for the first time ,at their home,do you feel it is socially acceptable to show up on their doorstep with a 9 mm strapped to your waist ?
Yes or no a simple question.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 181
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:43:40 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

I don't see a clear right or wrong in this situation.

Mike may well have been exceptionally rude to the guy, verbally, maybe even confrontational. He may have even handled the situation differently than you or I would have.

But he was well within his rights to handle the situation as he did. The matter was resolved, peaceably enough, even if they aren't bffs now.

I never questioned whether he was in his rights, unless it was hyperbole the guy carried open which I consider to be bad form in any case, but just because he had the right doesn't mean he didn't go overboard. More flies with honey than vinegar.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to JVoV)
Profile   Post #: 182
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:45:30 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: BamaD
Do you think it is smart to start off with an accusatory attitude toward an armed person you don't know?

So if an armed person was on your front porch you would not be confrontational. That is contrary to every position you have posted re: guns and personal space.
Do I think it is smart....you bet your ass, the best defense is offense. You seem to miss the central point. Why would a person shows up at a social function like a back yard bar-b-q with a sidearm on their hip?



Thank you...someone gets the fucking point.
Showing up on someone's doorstep with a gun on your hip is ,right from the get go,confrontational.
YOu do not go to a complete strangers house for a social function armed and for all that stranger knows dangerous.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 183
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:47:27 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

I don't see a clear right or wrong in this situation.

Mike may well have been exceptionally rude to the guy, verbally, maybe even confrontational. He may have even handled the situation differently than you or I would have.

But he was well within his rights to handle the situation as he did. The matter was resolved, peaceably enough, even if they aren't bffs now.

I never questioned whether he was in his rights, unless it was hyperbole the guy carried open which I consider to be bad form in any case, but just because he had the right doesn't mean he didn't go overboard. More flies with honey than vinegar.

No hyperbole Bama,as I live and breath a 9 mm in a hip holster....for a burger

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 184
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:48:09 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


Hallucination might be the belief that servicemen would fire on or bomb their own countrymen.

I am pretty sure it was macarthur,eisenhower,patton and the u.s. army that evicted american citizens with rifles and bayonet from peacably assembling to seek redress of their greviences in washington dc.

In the state of Colorado, half of the sheriff departments have publicly stated they won't enforce their stupid recently enacted gun laws. That might tell you something.

It tells me that half the cops in colorado will be looking for a job. When one becomes a cop arent they required to swear an oath to enforce the law? Or are they allowed to selectively enforce laws say like black people walking in the middle of a residential street.


I'm not familiar with what you stated in your first paragraph so you'll have to enlighten me.

If the sheriffs were selectively enforcing discrimination laws you might have a point. And as you well know, sheriffs are elected by individual counties. I highly doubt they'll be out of a job. What obligation do they have to uphold an unconstitutional law ?

You aren't familiar with the Bonus army ?
You really need a remedial American History course


I'm not familiar with the Bonus Army. Why don'tcha tell us all about 'em.

The short version is they were WWI veterans camping out near DC and demanding that the government give them a bonus for having served to help them get through the depression. Hoover sent in the army to clear them out (under Mac Arthur) in violation of Federal law prohibiting the use of the military against U S citizens in the U S.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to lovmuffin)
Profile   Post #: 185
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:50:17 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: BamaD
Do you think it is smart to start off with an accusatory attitude toward an armed person you don't know?

So if an armed person was on your front porch you would not be confrontational. That is contrary to every position you have posted re: guns and personal space.
Do I think it is smart....you bet your ass, the best defense is offense. You seem to miss the central point. Why would a person shows up at a social function like a back yard bar-b-q with a sidearm on their hip?



Thank you...someone gets the fucking point.
Showing up on someone's doorstep with a gun on your hip is ,right from the get go,confrontational.
YOu do not go to a complete strangers house for a social function armed and for all that stranger knows dangerous.

Not in the situation you described, when you had invited them over, as usual thompsonx left out that very important factor.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 186
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:51:42 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

I don't see a clear right or wrong in this situation.

Mike may well have been exceptionally rude to the guy, verbally, maybe even confrontational. He may have even handled the situation differently than you or I would have.

But he was well within his rights to handle the situation as he did. The matter was resolved, peaceably enough, even if they aren't bffs now.

I never questioned whether he was in his rights, unless it was hyperbole the guy carried open which I consider to be bad form in any case, but just because he had the right doesn't mean he didn't go overboard. More flies with honey than vinegar.

No hyperbole Bama,as I live and breath a 9 mm in a hip holster....for a burger

As I said open carry is bad form in any case, if I carried into someones home they would only know it if they searched me.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 187
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:52:03 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: BamaD
Do you think it is smart to start off with an accusatory attitude toward an armed person you don't know?

So if an armed person was on your front porch you would not be confrontational. That is contrary to every position you have posted re: guns and personal space.
Do I think it is smart....you bet your ass, the best defense is offense. You seem to miss the central point. Why would a person shows up at a social function like a back yard bar-b-q with a sidearm on their hip?



Thank you...someone gets the fucking point.
Showing up on someone's doorstep with a gun on your hip is ,right from the get go,confrontational.
YOu do not go to a complete strangers house for a social function armed and for all that stranger knows dangerous.

Not in the situation you described, when you had invited them over, as usual thompsonx left out that very important factor.

Social function.......Bama ,yes or no.
Do you think its acceptable ?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 188
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:55:31 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		The short version is they were WWI veterans camping out near DC and demanding that the government give them a bonus for having served to help them get through the depression. Hoover sent in the army to clear them out (under Mac Arthur) in violation of Federal law prohibiting the use of the military against U S citizens in the U S.

Wasn't it a bonus that they had been promised?
Eisenhower was so impressed with how so many people could have got to be in one place at one time. The following year he tried to duplicate it with an army convoy from california to dc. He failed miserably where walter williams (the demonstration organizer)succeded in spades, with no money. The knowledge eisenhower gained from this caused him ,as president, to innitiate the interstate highway system.

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 189
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 7:57:10 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		As I said open carry is bad form in any case, if I carried into someones home they would only know it if they searched me.

Why do you feel you are entitled to carry serepticiously into someone's home?

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 4/7/2015 7:58:14 PM >

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 190
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 8:00:43 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		Not in the situation you described, when you had invited them over, as usual thompsonx left out that very important factor.

I posited a completely different situation I left nothing out. Try keeping your snark to yourself unless you would like some in retun.

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 191
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 8:01:08 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: BamaD
Do you think it is smart to start off with an accusatory attitude toward an armed person you don't know?

So if an armed person was on your front porch you would not be confrontational. That is contrary to every position you have posted re: guns and personal space.
Do I think it is smart....you bet your ass, the best defense is offense. You seem to miss the central point. Why would a person shows up at a social function like a back yard bar-b-q with a sidearm on their hip?



Thank you...someone gets the fucking point.
Showing up on someone's doorstep with a gun on your hip is ,right from the get go,confrontational.
YOu do not go to a complete strangers house for a social function armed and for all that stranger knows dangerous.

Not in the situation you described, when you had invited them over, as usual thompsonx left out that very important factor.

Social function.......Bama ,yes or no.
Do you think its acceptable ?

If I don't know them I leave it in the car.
And you are still trying to prove something I never claimed.
I never said he was right, particularly open carry.
On the other hand when someone tries to slip up on me in the middle of the night (which is what thomsonx was referring to ) I was less confrontational at the outset than you were in your version of what happened.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 192
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 8:06:17 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline 		FR

Interesting read: PBS on the Bonus Army

* * *

And a sequel, courtesy of Wikipedia:

During the presidential campaign of 1932, Franklin D. Roosevelt had opposed the veterans' bonus demands.[23] But when they organized a second demonstration in May 1933, he provided the marchers with a campsite in Virginia and provided them three meals a day. Administration officials, led by presidential confidant Louis Howe, tried to negotiate an end to the protest. Roosevelt arranged for his wife Eleanor to visit the site unaccompanied. She lunched with the veterans and listened to them perform songs. She reminisced about her memories of seeing troops off to World War I and welcoming them home. The most she could offer was a promise of positions in the newly created Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC).[22] One veteran commented: "Hoover sent the army, Roosevelt sent his wife". In a press conference following her visit, the First Lady described her reception as courteous and praised the marchers, highlighting how comfortable she felt despite critics of the marchers who described them as communists and criminals.[22]

Emphasis mine; I love that quote.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 193
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 8:07:54 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		I'm not trying to prove nothing.other than refute your silly assertion that I acted a)confrontational or b) acted like an asshole.
The guy showed up at someone's house wearing a weapon....if I had barred entry completely and cancelled the barbecue .....he's still the asshole in the story.
That's all I'm trying to make you understand.
Why you are having an issue with this is beyond me,civil people don't go armed over to other people's house's for social occasions.Certainly not to someone's house that they don't know.

< Message edited by slvemike4u -- 4/7/2015 8:08:30 PM >

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 194
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 8:21:12 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

I'm not trying to prove nothing.other than refute your silly assertion that I acted a)confrontational or b) acted like an asshole.
The guy showed up at someone's house wearing a weapon....if I had barred entry completely and cancelled the barbecue .....he's still the asshole in the story.
That's all I'm trying to make you understand.
Why you are having an issue with this is beyond me,civil people don't go armed over to other people's house's for social occasions.Certainly not to someone's house that they don't know.

I think you were both being jerks, you don't have to agree but neither of us is going to change the others mind.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 195
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 8:33:49 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Then I have no other choice to conclude you feel it's entirely reasonable to bring the weapon to the house...but wouldn't do so quite so conspicuously .
Which still makes you a)wrong b)insensitive to the rights of others ad c) quite a jerk

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 196
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 9:02:23 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Then I have no other choice to conclude you feel it's entirely reasonable to bring the weapon to the house...but wouldn't do so quite so conspicuously .
Which still makes you a)wrong b)insensitive to the rights of others ad c) quite a jerk

No choice except for the fact that I said I would leave it in the car.
Which means you didn't read what I actually said (no surprise there) so you are A. wrong B. wrong and C. wrong.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 197
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 9:14:17 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		But you continued to assert that his error was wearing it open carry...you also object to my insistence he leave it in the car.
So ABC in your post was......wrong.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 198
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 9:17:46 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

if I had barred entry completely and cancelled the barbecue .....he's still the asshole in the story.



(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 199
RE: Gun goes off in Altoona church during Easter Vigil ... - 4/7/2015 9:19:35 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

But you continued to assert that his error was wearing it open carry...you also object to my insistence he leave it in the car.
So ABC in your post was......wrong.

wrong
I objected to open carry because I consider it unwise and it makes some people uncomfortable. I did not say you were wrong to have him leave it in the car but in the way you handled it. And I said that I would not take a firearm to the house under those circumstances. You are once again misinterpreting everything I said so none of my abc were wrong.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 200
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