quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml

Yeah. I was kind of expecting some confirmation that the parents weren't breaking the law.

If there was a judgement that the CPS had misinterpreted the law, then I would say the parents were fine.

If there is a dispute which is in the course of being adjudicated / appealed, then they are fuckwits.

I am keen to see what source Aylee has.

quote:

In Montgomery, CPS officials have said they are guided in part by a state law that says children younger than 8 must be left with a reliable person who is at least 13. But the law refers only to enclosed spaces such as buildings or cars, and makes no mention of children outside, in a park or on a walk.

quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml

Thanks for your offer, it is appreciated, but I doubt we'd ever agree on this.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

as I said, if you want to have that conversations, feel invited to send me a private message.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

as I said, if you want to have that conversations, feel invited to send me a private message.

Why the need for a private conversation, Bounty? If the Bible is of any use whatsoever in its wisdom regarding the bringing up of children, why not share it with us all, here? I'd be interested - not least because as far as I'm concerned the Bible, to me, is just a lot of rantings by bearded looney nutcases from two thousand years ago and at best useless or downright harmful when it comes to advice about anything whatsoever. So please, do, share the Bible's wisdom, as you see it, about child-rearing here, in public, on this forum. I'm sure we'd all love to see it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

as I said, if you want to have that conversations, feel invited to send me a private message.

Why the need for a private conversation, Bounty? If the Bible is of any use whatsoever in its wisdom regarding the bringing up of children, why not share it with us all, here? I'd be interested - not least because as far as I'm concerned the Bible, to me, is just a lot of rantings by bearded looney nutcases from two thousand years ago and at best useless or downright harmful when it comes to advice about anything whatsoever. So please, do, share the Bible's wisdom, as you see it, about child-rearing here, in public, on this forum. I'm sure we'd all love to see it.

Cause this thread is supposed to be about free range parenting instead of bible based parenting?

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant

Genesis 22 FTW

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

as I said, if you want to have that conversations, feel invited to send me a private message.

Why the need for a private conversation, Bounty? If the Bible is of any use whatsoever in its wisdom regarding the bringing up of children, why not share it with us all, here? I'd be interested - not least because as far as I'm concerned the Bible, to me, is just a lot of rantings by bearded looney nutcases from two thousand years ago and at best useless or downright harmful when it comes to advice about anything whatsoever. So please, do, share the Bible's wisdom, as you see it, about child-rearing here, in public, on this forum. I'm sure we'd all love to see it.

quote:

The proposed legislation from state Rep. Stephanie Chang, a Detroit Democrat, would require homeschooled children to be inspected twice per year by a licensed social worker or law enforcement officer. The bill would also require homeschooling parents to register their children — like dogs or sex offenders — with the superintendent of the school district in which they reside. Michigan is one of eleven states that do not require homeschooling parents to report to state or local authorities.

Chang cited the case of Stoni Ann Blair and Stephen Gage Berry as a reason for planning the legislation. Investigators believe Stephen was 9 when he died in August 2012 and that Stoni was 13 when she died the following May. Their mother, who is accused of torturing and killing them and then stuffing their bodies in the freezer, had said she homeschooled them.

“We all failed Stoni and Stephen because Michigan does not maintain a list of homeschooled children and so we have no way to identify and then protect any child who could be at risk for abuse,” Chang said. “Most homeschool parents have their child’s best interest in mind, and many do a fine job homeschooling, but with Stephen and Stoni, that wasn’t the case...”

That’s a common thread in most of these tragic stories. In nearly every case — almost without exception — the family had a history of contact with child welfare officials because of allegations of abuse. And in almost every case — almost without exception — the authorities dropped the ball. In the case of the children in Detroit, the state had investigated allegations of abuse in 2002 and 2005 and the mother was referred for counseling. In the Ohio case, family members called authorities multiple times but nothing was done...

It’s not the sick, twisted individuals like Stoni and Stephen’s mother who will be caught up in the state’s dragnet. Instead, it’s law-abiding parents who are exercising their constitutional right to home educate their children — and doing an admirable job of it — who will be harmed by these intrusive regulations. In addition to the creepy registry, they’ll be forced to live under a presumption of guilt and will be required to “prove” twice per year to some (allegedly qualified) government official that they are not abusing their children...

if the proposed legislation in Michigan becomes law, an estimated 50,000 children will be added to the caseloads of already overburdened social workers, law enforcement officers, and truant officers who will be tasked with tracking these newly “registered” children in much the same way they monitor parolees and sex offenders, requiring them to periodically report their whereabouts and show up for meetings and inspections. Instead of spending scarce resources on known cases of child abuse and neglect, they’ll be forced to cast a wide net over thousands of law-abiding families without probable cause — or any cause — to suspect there’s abuse in those homes...

We don’t solve the murder problem by putting body cameras on all gun owners — just to keep some from murdering. We don’t solve the problem of thievery by frisking everyone who exits a store — just in case someone has pocketed an eyeliner or a package of batteries. In the same way, we don’t surveil all homeschooling families — treating them like de facto criminals and subjecting their children to intrusive “registries” and inspections — just so we can net a handful of bad actors.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

a sister issue to the free range parenting, home schooling:

"Michigan Lawmakers Want Homeschooled Children Registered Like Dogs and Inspected by Social Workers"

(a lot of editing. the article is much longer)

quote:

The proposed legislation from state Rep. Stephanie Chang, a Detroit Democrat, would require homeschooled children to be inspected twice per year by a licensed social worker or law enforcement officer. The bill would also require homeschooling parents to register their children — like dogs or sex offenders — with the superintendent of the school district in which they reside. Michigan is one of eleven states that do not require homeschooling parents to report to state or local authorities.

Chang cited the case of Stoni Ann Blair and Stephen Gage Berry as a reason for planning the legislation. Investigators believe Stephen was 9 when he died in August 2012 and that Stoni was 13 when she died the following May. Their mother, who is accused of torturing and killing them and then stuffing their bodies in the freezer, had said she homeschooled them.

“We all failed Stoni and Stephen because Michigan does not maintain a list of homeschooled children and so we have no way to identify and then protect any child who could be at risk for abuse,” Chang said. “Most homeschool parents have their child’s best interest in mind, and many do a fine job homeschooling, but with Stephen and Stoni, that wasn’t the case...”

That’s a common thread in most of these tragic stories. In nearly every case — almost without exception — the family had a history of contact with child welfare officials because of allegations of abuse. And in almost every case — almost without exception — the authorities dropped the ball. In the case of the children in Detroit, the state had investigated allegations of abuse in 2002 and 2005 and the mother was referred for counseling. In the Ohio case, family members called authorities multiple times but nothing was done...

It’s not the sick, twisted individuals like Stoni and Stephen’s mother who will be caught up in the state’s dragnet. Instead, it’s law-abiding parents who are exercising their constitutional right to home educate their children — and doing an admirable job of it — who will be harmed by these intrusive regulations. In addition to the creepy registry, they’ll be forced to live under a presumption of guilt and will be required to “prove” twice per year to some (allegedly qualified) government official that they are not abusing their children...

if the proposed legislation in Michigan becomes law, an estimated 50,000 children will be added to the caseloads of already overburdened social workers, law enforcement officers, and truant officers who will be tasked with tracking these newly “registered” children in much the same way they monitor parolees and sex offenders, requiring them to periodically report their whereabouts and show up for meetings and inspections. Instead of spending scarce resources on known cases of child abuse and neglect, they’ll be forced to cast a wide net over thousands of law-abiding families without probable cause — or any cause — to suspect there’s abuse in those homes...

We don’t solve the murder problem by putting body cameras on all gun owners — just to keep some from murdering. We don’t solve the problem of thievery by frisking everyone who exits a store — just in case someone has pocketed an eyeliner or a package of batteries. In the same way, we don’t surveil all homeschooling families — treating them like de facto criminals and subjecting their children to intrusive “registries” and inspections — just so we can net a handful of bad actors.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2015/04/20/michigan-lawmakers-want-homeschooled-children-registered-like-dogs-and-inspected-by-social-workers/

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

a sister issue to the free range parenting, home schooling:

"Michigan Lawmakers Want Homeschooled Children Registered Like Dogs and Inspected by Social Workers"

(a lot of editing. the article is much longer)

quote:

The proposed legislation from state Rep. Stephanie Chang, a Detroit Democrat, would require homeschooled children to be inspected twice per year by a licensed social worker or law enforcement officer. The bill would also require homeschooling parents to register their children — like dogs or sex offenders — with the superintendent of the school district in which they reside. Michigan is one of eleven states that do not require homeschooling parents to report to state or local authorities.

Chang cited the case of Stoni Ann Blair and Stephen Gage Berry as a reason for planning the legislation. Investigators believe Stephen was 9 when he died in August 2012 and that Stoni was 13 when she died the following May. Their mother, who is accused of torturing and killing them and then stuffing their bodies in the freezer, had said she homeschooled them.

“We all failed Stoni and Stephen because Michigan does not maintain a list of homeschooled children and so we have no way to identify and then protect any child who could be at risk for abuse,” Chang said. “Most homeschool parents have their child’s best interest in mind, and many do a fine job homeschooling, but with Stephen and Stoni, that wasn’t the case...”

That’s a common thread in most of these tragic stories. In nearly every case — almost without exception — the family had a history of contact with child welfare officials because of allegations of abuse. And in almost every case — almost without exception — the authorities dropped the ball. In the case of the children in Detroit, the state had investigated allegations of abuse in 2002 and 2005 and the mother was referred for counseling. In the Ohio case, family members called authorities multiple times but nothing was done...

It’s not the sick, twisted individuals like Stoni and Stephen’s mother who will be caught up in the state’s dragnet. Instead, it’s law-abiding parents who are exercising their constitutional right to home educate their children — and doing an admirable job of it — who will be harmed by these intrusive regulations. In addition to the creepy registry, they’ll be forced to live under a presumption of guilt and will be required to “prove” twice per year to some (allegedly qualified) government official that they are not abusing their children...

if the proposed legislation in Michigan becomes law, an estimated 50,000 children will be added to the caseloads of already overburdened social workers, law enforcement officers, and truant officers who will be tasked with tracking these newly “registered” children in much the same way they monitor parolees and sex offenders, requiring them to periodically report their whereabouts and show up for meetings and inspections. Instead of spending scarce resources on known cases of child abuse and neglect, they’ll be forced to cast a wide net over thousands of law-abiding families without probable cause — or any cause — to suspect there’s abuse in those homes...

We don’t solve the murder problem by putting body cameras on all gun owners — just to keep some from murdering. We don’t solve the problem of thievery by frisking everyone who exits a store — just in case someone has pocketed an eyeliner or a package of batteries. In the same way, we don’t surveil all homeschooling families — treating them like de facto criminals and subjecting their children to intrusive “registries” and inspections — just so we can net a handful of bad actors.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2015/04/20/michigan-lawmakers-want-homeschooled-children-registered-like-dogs-and-inspected-by-social-workers/