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ORIGINAL: kdsub

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The war on drugs is an abject failure,I would be interested to hear whether or not those who are for these executions will agree with that simple statement.

Why is is a failure? Without the efforts of drug enforcement the drug problem could be ten times worse. So objectively it could be a huge success at at least holding back the flood of drugs that could addict and kill many more thousands. I would say this way of looking at it is closer to the truth than yours. Neither of us know for sure.

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It seems that someone thinks that it's a successful strategy that many tens of thousands of people actually die in the Narco Wars in Mexico Guatelmala etc to prevent the " flood of drugs that could addict and kill many more thousands."

Can't even do basic arithmetic so it's no surprise that thinking for themselves is a bit too much to ask.

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ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It seems that someone thinks that it's a successful strategy that many tens of thousands of people actually die in the Narco Wars in Mexico Guatelmala etc to prevent the " flood of drugs that could addict and kill many more thousands."

Can't even do basic arithmetic so it's no surprise that thinking for themselves is a bit too much to ask.

Tens of thousands glad you don't engage in hyperbole.

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It seems that someone thinks that it's a successful strategy that many tens of thousands of people actually die in the Narco Wars in Mexico Guatelmala etc to prevent the " flood of drugs that could addict and kill many more thousands."

Can't even do basic arithmetic so it's no surprise that thinking for themselves is a bit too much to ask.

Tens of thousands glad you don't engage in hyperbole.

There's nothing hyperbolic about ascribing "many tens of thousands" of deaths to the Narco Wars. It is widely reported that over 100,000 violent deaths have occurred in Mexico alone. That's without adding in the many more deaths in other Central and South American countries or any of the US deaths. All down to that disastrous failure - the 'War on Drugs'.

If you are aware of these ghastly statistics, your comment sounds callous. If you are unaware, you now know that I was if anything understating the case.

Need I add that one actual death is far worse than any amount of potential deaths?

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It seems that someone thinks that it's a successful strategy that many tens of thousands of people actually die in the Narco Wars in Mexico Guatelmala etc to prevent the " flood of drugs that could addict and kill many more thousands."

Can't even do basic arithmetic so it's no surprise that thinking for themselves is a bit too much to ask.

Tens of thousands glad you don't engage in hyperbole.

There's nothing hyperbolic about ascribing "many tens of thousands" of deaths to the Narco Wars. It is widely reported that over 100,000 violent deaths have occurred in Mexico alone. That's without adding in the many more deaths in other Central and South American countries or any of the US deaths. All down to that disastrous failure - the 'War on Drugs'.

If you are aware of these ghastly statistics, your comment sounds callous. If you are unaware, you now know that I was if anything understating the case.

Need I add that one actual death is far worse than any amount of potential deaths?

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ORIGINAL: BamaD

Are you counting the vast numbers killed by the cartels?

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It is sad that some are questioning the rehabilitation of the two young men who were executed. Especially so as it is unlikely those doing the questioning have the slightest idea whether their rehabilitation is genuine or otherwise. One person in a position to form an educated opinion is the governor of the prison where they spent 10 years awaiting their executions:
"It was always hard at the time to elicit sympathy for the two organisers of this mid-level smuggling attempt. But a decade on there is no doubt that if Indonesia executes Chan and Sukumaran, it will be killing different men. They have admitted their crimes and expressed remorse. They are leaders at Bali’s Kerobokan prison, organising classes in everything from computers to philosophy. They have learnt Indonesian and counsel other prisoners.
Their reform is at the heart of their last attempts to save their lives, and it is the plea of their desperate families. Why kill two young men who have had a decade to change, to contribute, to reform? It is not just their lawyers and families who say so. In a highly unusual intervention, then governor of the prison, Siswanto, told an appeal hearing in 2010 that the pair were model prisoners whose lives should be spared. Their reform was “not a camouflage act”, he said.
“They are still young. They deserve to be given time to fix their past behaviour. I personally cannot accept it if they are executed.”

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/27/bali-nine-hard-won-public-sympathy-appears-no-match-for-judicial-resolve
"

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ORIGINAL: kdsub

Yea... then when you get high and kill a love one or innocent because of your "no one has the right to tell me" you may change your mind... Despite what you think the majority of addicts have no control and are often killers of innocent's and themselves. Plus the cost of rehabbing and medical care drives up insurance to those that already have problems paying it... AND lets not talk about the families destroyed dealing with addicted relatives.

Your type of attitude is what makes demand for the drugs in the first place... you are weak and childish to take mind altering drugs in the first place... can't you make it in the real world...NORMAl... is your pleasure worth even ONE life?

Butch

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Ok, execute them.

But then there are as likely a few million, political, military and capitalist/fascists profiteering scum that should also be shot. Probably at least a few of which in the Indonesian govt., courts and police.

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ORIGINAL: JVoV

First of all, travelling out of the safety of your home country to knowingly commit a crime leaves you at the mercy of the arresting country/locality. Not even our own Constitution follows us around the world.

How a government chooses to penalize its criminals is completely out of our control. And that's how it should be, so that countries can decide for themselves what crimes are severe enough for incarceration and/or the death penalty.

If anything, drug dealers should unite and boycott Indonesia. Their people & government would thank you.

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ORIGINAL: JVoV

First of all, travelling out of the safety of your home country to knowingly commit a crime leaves you at the mercy of the arresting country/locality. Not even our own Constitution follows us around the world.

How a government chooses to penalize its criminals is completely out of our control. And that's how it should be, so that countries can decide for themselves what crimes are severe enough for incarceration and/or the death penalty.

If anything, drug dealers should unite and boycott Indonesia. Their people & government would thank you.

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ORIGINAL: kdsub

Yea... then when you get high and kill a love one or innocent because of your "no one has the right to tell me" you may change your mind... Despite what you think the majority of addicts have no control and are often killers of innocent's and themselves. Plus the cost of rehabbing and medical care drives up insurance to those that already have problems paying it... AND lets not talk about the families destroyed dealing with addicted relatives.

Your type of attitude is what makes demand for the drugs in the first place... you are weak and childish to take mind altering drugs in the first place... can't you make it in the real world...NORMAl... is your pleasure worth even ONE life?

Butch

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ORIGINAL: Sanity

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Yea... then when you get high and kill a love one or innocent because of your "no one has the right to tell me" you may change your mind... Despite what you think the majority of addicts have no control and are often killers of innocent's and themselves. Plus the cost of rehabbing and medical care drives up insurance to those that already have problems paying it... AND lets not talk about the families destroyed dealing with addicted relatives.

Your type of attitude is what makes demand for the drugs in the first place... you are weak and childish to take mind altering drugs in the first place... can't you make it in the real world...NORMAl... is your pleasure worth even ONE life?

Butch

Whats really weird is how (mostly those on the left, certainly not Libertarians) are in the middle of a decades long war on "big tobacco" or peoples' rights to enjoy a little nicotine before they die... While at the same time we are hearing this cacophony of pro-legalizing drugs sentiment from many of them

If you are really going to legalize heroine, why cant I have my twenty cent pack of cigarettes back