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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 10:25:34 AM   
thompsonx


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The point is that you gave a grossly exagerated number of slaves transported to the U S and he was correcting you.

You and he are full of shit. Show me where I have posted a number for the imported slaves? I have posted well documented statements of how many were here at specific times in history. 

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 10:27:45 AM   
thompsonx


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Actually the thread is about why anyone would object to saying that all lives matter since that includes black lives. Unless you are using the Royal we you are wrong again.

It has been pointed out to you and the other morons that hijacking a phrase is what the discussion is about. 

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 10:27:58 AM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

We have pretty good records that show that by 1825 there were about 4 million black slaves in the u.s.

According to the U.S. Census, there were 1.5 million in 1820 and 2 million in 1830. That's a helluva discrepancy. The highest recorded count before slavery ended was 3.9 million in 1860.

http://www2.census.gov/prod2/decennial/documents/1860a-02.pdf

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 9/28/2015 10:34:04 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 10:35:19 AM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

ORIGINAL: BamaD

Actually the thread is about why anyone would object to saying that all lives matter since that includes black lives. Unless you are using the Royal we you are wrong again.

It has been pointed out to you and the other morons that hijacking a phrase is what the discussion is about. 


You have given nothing to show how slavery contributes to black deaths today or why a black man getting shot while trying to beat a white cop to death is worse than the mass killings of blacks by black gangbangers.
Do black lives only matter if they die at the hands of white people?
Are you saying that blacks can't be held responsible for killing other blacks because 200 years ago some white person owned some black person?
Are you saying that blacks have a genetic inferiority keeping them from civilized behavior?
One is stupid, the other is racist.
Correcting a phrase to make it inclusive. So you admit this thread isn't about slavery.

< Message edited by BamaD -- 9/28/2015 10:42:46 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 11:38:58 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

We have pretty good records that show that by 1825 there were about 4 million black slaves in the u.s.

In 1820 there were 1.5 million. In 1830, 2 million. The highest recorded count before slavery ended was 3.9 million in 1860.

http://www2.census.gov/prod2/decennial/documents/1860a-02.pdf

This from your cite:
The first negro slaves were imported into Virginia in 1619,where they numbered about 2000 in 1670.

 As for two million in 1825 vs 4 million, the census numbers seem pretty reliable. I stand corrected .

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 9/28/2015 11:40:33 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 11:45:52 AM   
thompsonx


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You have given nothing to show how slavery contributes to black deaths today or why a black man getting shot while trying to beat a white cop to death is worse than the mass killings of blacks by black gangbangers.

That would be the two reports submitted by the doj...you know the ones you refuse to read because they contain what you do not want to read.



Are you saying that blacks have a genetic inferiority keeping them from civilized behavior?

That seems to be your position.



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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 12:42:32 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

This from your cite:

The first negro slaves were imported into Virginia in 1619,where they numbered about 2000 in 1670.

My cite for the "under a thousand" number was the Wiki page on slavery in the colonial United States:

The first Africans to be brought to English North America landed in Virginia in 1619. These individuals appear to have been treated as indentured servants, and a significant number of enslaved Africans even won their freedom through fulfilling a work contract or for converting to Christianity. Some successful free people of color, such as Anthony Johnson, acquired slaves or indentured servants themselves. To many historians, notably Edmund Morgan, this evidence suggests that racial attitudes were much more flexible in 17th century Virginia than they would subsequently become. A 1625 census recorded 23 Africans in Virginia. In 1649 there were 300, and in 1690 there were 950. ~Source

That said, I found the sentence you quoted at the 1860 U.S. Census link, but I don't know where their count comes from and it isn't sourced. The Wiki figure references Wood, Origins of American Slavery, 1997. At encyclopedia.com, the numbers parallel Wood's: 23 in 1625, and 300 in 1650.

K.


< Message edited by Kirata -- 9/28/2015 1:02:00 PM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 12:51:00 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Well, however many they were, their lives mattered, and thats the issue, n'est ce pas?

BTW, they didn't matter to me, inasmuch as I didn't know them.

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 1:19:59 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

ORIGINAL: BamaD
You have given nothing to show how slavery contributes to black deaths today or why a black man getting shot while trying to beat a white cop to death is worse than the mass killings of blacks by black gangbangers.

That would be the two reports submitted by the doj...you know the ones you refuse to read because they contain what you do not want to read.



Are you saying that blacks have a genetic inferiority keeping them from civilized behavior?

That seems to be your position.




A I have already said, lo those many pages ago that there was a report critising the lack of black representation on the Ferguson PD and some of their practices.
B You insist on harping on that part but dismiss the clearing of Wilson as a racist plot so you must think that Obama and Holder were part of the racist plot.
C No, that is not my position. I say that the massive dissproportionate unemployment among black youths is the major contributing factor. That along with people like you telling black youth that any crime they commit is somehow the fault of white people because 200 years ago there were slaves.
That somehow they have to kill each other because someplace there is a white racist.
If you were really concered about black lives and not your racist fantasies you would realize that reducing black on black crime by 1% would save more black lives than anything you can do to cops.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/28/2015 1:49:42 PM   
kdsub


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quote:

All the land taken from the cherokee by the english was taken at the point of a gun. Do a little research


I think you had better do the research I have... this is simply not true... Through treaty land was purchased by the English as were purchases by individuals and groups. No one is justifying the treatment of Cherokee and other indigenous people. But not all land was taken by force and some land was sold or freely given up. It is clearly stated in the treaties by England where land was purchased from the Cherokee... It is simple to find and you can do it if you choose... if not you have no credence in your ramblings.

When hostilities broke out innocent settlers who had purchased land from the Cherokee were murdered and driven from their homesteads.

Butch

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/29/2015 3:22:45 AM   
bounty44


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Status: offline 		i love the "do a little research" barb. one would think, since he believes so vehemently in his position, despite evidence to the contrary, that he'd be very eager to reference what it is he (thinks) he knows...

< Message edited by bounty44 -- 9/29/2015 3:24:14 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/29/2015 9:44:53 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline 		Then...there's this very proud member of the BLM Movement:

http://m.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/woman-investigated-online-police-threats/nnnDZ/

http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2015/09/25/black-lives-matter-activist-arrested-for-threats-against-police-and-white-people/

But nobody in that group is dangerous to white folks, right?

< Message edited by CreativeDominant -- 9/29/2015 9:45:43 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/29/2015 10:05:00 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		Well i guess it is not worth holding his feet to the fire... this is just a side bar that has little to do with the OP... But it does show he is not interested in the truth... just argument with no integrity. He is just not worth the time and I don't know about you but I am done responding to him.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/29/2015 1:38:22 PM   
Kirata


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From: USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Well i guess it is not worth holding his feet to the fire... this is just a side bar that has little to do with the OP... But it does show he is not interested in the truth... just argument with no integrity. He is just not worth the time and I don't know about you but I am done responding to him.

This business of blaming the state of our inner-city neighborhoods on "racism" only serves to infantilize blacks, absolving them of responsibility for the conditions that exist on their streets and in their schools, and is in itself a pernicious form of racism.

Don't Judge Blacks Differently

K.

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/29/2015 2:01:00 PM   
CreativeDominant


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Joined: 3/11/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Well i guess it is not worth holding his feet to the fire... this is just a side bar that has little to do with the OP... But it does show he is not interested in the truth... just argument with no integrity. He is just not worth the time and I don't know about you but I am done responding to him.

This business of blaming the state of our inner-city neighborhoods on "racism" only serves to infantilize blacks, absolving them of responsibility for the conditions that exist on their streets and in their schools, and is in itself a pernicious form of racism.

Don't Judge Blacks Differently

K.

Dont you guys get it? The only ones who can be racist are the ones in power = white men.

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/29/2015 8:08:59 PM   
MercTech


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Status: offline 		One point in the argument over the number of slaves in the United States. There was a huge jump in the number of slaves in the U.S. with the Louisiana Purchase.

A few years after the the U.S. took over governing the Gulf Coast territories; the importation of slaves was forbidden. The slave traditions of the French and Spanish plantations ended up spreading north into areas where formerly slavery was an odd aberration. After the ejection of Native American tribes to the plains west of the Mississippi; huge land grants in the Mississippi Territories were used as a mechanism to retire the federal debts from the War of 1812. Many of the grants were to military taking a land grant in lieu of back pay. But, many larger tracts went to financiers to pay off debts for war supplies. Where does one get workers for large farms that had to be cleared and developed? Well there was a ready market to purchase labor from the Spanish and French plantations from what had formerly been West Florida and New France.

Just noting some things about the history of the Mississippi Territories that doesn't make it to the average history book.

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/30/2015 7:17:15 AM   
thompsonx


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A I have already said, lo those many pages ago that there was a report critising the lack of black representation on the Ferguson PD and some of their practices.

The practice of extortion





B You insist on harping on that part but dismiss the clearing of Wilson as a racist plot so you must think that Obama and Holder were part of the racist plot.


Officer wilson was not cleared. If you had actually read the doj report you would not keep repeating that lie. He was found to be unindictable. Not as you have falacioulsy stated as "innocent" "not guilty" "cleared".
You are the only one claiming obama and holder are part of the klan and some racist plot.

C No, that is not my position. I say that the massive dissproportionate unemployment among black youths is the major contributing factor.

Why are they unemployed?



That along with people like you telling black youth that any crime they commit is somehow the fault of white people because 200 years ago there were slaves.


Where have I said that?



That somehow they have to kill each other because someplace there is a white racist.

This is just you being stupid and trying to conflate racism with garden variety criminality.


If you were really concered about black lives and not your racist fantasies you would realize that reducing black on black crime by 1% would save more black lives than anything you can do to cops.

How does reducing black on black crime stop racism by the cops?

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/30/2015 7:21:15 AM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

All the land taken from the cherokee by the english was taken at the point of a gun. Do a little research


I think you had better do the research I have... this is simply not true... Through treaty land was purchased by the English as were purchases by individuals and groups.


Treaty land???? My research indicates that the treaty was the result of armed conflict. The looser in this armed robery gets to "sell" his land to your ancestors?


No one is justifying the treatment of Cherokee and other indigenous people. But not all land was taken by force and some land was sold or freely given up.


When was the last time you gave up property freely?





< Message edited by thompsonx -- 9/30/2015 7:38:52 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/30/2015 7:22:37 AM   
thompsonx


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i love the "do a little research" barb. one would think, since he believes so vehemently in his position, despite evidence to the contrary, that he'd be very eager to reference what it is he (thinks) he knows...


Perhaps you are not from around here. American history is usually taught in the u.s. from grammar school on.

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 9/30/2015 7:39:18 AM >

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RE: On the All Lives Matter Issue - 9/30/2015 7:25:34 AM   
thompsonx


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Status: offline 		ORIGINAL: kdsub

Well i guess it is not worth holding his feet to the fire...

Your opinions of how the native americans "freely gave up" thier lands to your ancestors is amusing.


this is just a side bar that has little to do with the OP... But it does show he is not interested in the truth... just argument with no integrity. He is just not worth the time and I don't know about you but I am done responding to him.

Any time you feel unqualified or unable to substantiate your assinine opinions with fact, closing your mouth is probably the wisest course of action.


(in reply to kdsub)
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