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RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 1:46:24 PM   
Phydeaux


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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML.
quote:

Segregation in the North was a different disease than segregation in the Deep South
Different flavors of racism? LMFAO!!



Sigh. Why don't you go google de facto and de jure segregation.

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 221
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 2:36:51 PM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML.
quote:

Segregation in the North was a different disease than segregation in the Deep South
Different flavors of racism? LMFAO!!



Sigh. Why don't you go google de facto and de jure segregation.

Don't have to. de facto segregation occurred nationwide in addition to de jure segregation. Plessey vs. Ferguson permitted it. Racism is racism no matter how you slice it. Americans have been indulging in a variety of creative explanations and dodges since the Birth of the Nation. And they continue today with such dodgy parsing of de jure vs. de facto. Like a shotgun blast to the left side of the brain is different than a gunshot blast to the right side of the brain. Tis a charade, the clowns and elephants are in town. Racism is as racism does however and wherever it marginalizes people of color.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 222
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 3:15:57 PM   
DominantWrestler


Posts: 338
Joined: 7/4/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Spot on article. Should be a thread just to discuss.
Here are the next two articles in the series. http://www.slate.com/articles/life/history/features/2014/the_liberal_failure_on_race/affirmative_action_it_s_time_for_liberals_to_admit_it_isn_t_working.html
http://www.slate.com/articles/life/history/features/2014/the_liberal_failure_on_race/madison_avenue_the_failure_of_integration_in_advertising_and_what_it_says.html


The author of those articles is Terry Colby

1. Terry Colby graduated Vestavia high school in '93. Vestavia was established in Alabama during the 70s and still to this day retains the "Rebels" as their mascot

2. After seeing Bush fail, Colby got behind the Obama campaign, and after helping Obama win came to realize that in New York at age 33, he does not have a black friend, nor had one growing up, nor know a person who knew more than one or two black people

3. In the mean time, he writes a couple books mostly painting dead celebrities in a positive light (Belushi and Michael Jackson amongst others) to gain popularity

4. In 2013, at age 38 or so, he enters into the public conversation about race after Obama won a second time

5. One year after entering the conversation on race, he publishes an article dedicated to bashing democrats

This guy is power hungry. He moves to New York, one of the monetary and economic capitals of the world looking to get rich. Bush was horrible, and recognizing opportunity, he jumps on the Obama campaign. After winning, he realizes he does not, nor has had, a black friend. After Obama wins again, he enters the conversation on race because it will have strength for atleast 4 years. After a year, he publishes a piece attempting to bash Democrats

I will say Bounty, this is one of your better thinly veiled, though highly biased, citations

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 223
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 3:20:10 PM   
bounty44


Posts: 6374
Joined: 11/1/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML.
quote:

Segregation in the North was a different disease than segregation in the Deep South
Different flavors of racism? LMFAO!!



Sigh. Why don't you go google de facto and de jure segregation.


the irony there, perhaps lost on him, is, he's "LMFAO" at not just a fellow liberal, but a relatively hard core dyed in the wool AND pretty articulate, well read one with a sense of history.

in terms of verisimilitude, im going with the guy who wrote the article.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 224
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 3:24:58 PM   
DominantWrestler


Posts: 338
Joined: 7/4/2010
Status: offline 		And what percent of the hundreds of billions of dollars spent on defense would cover those buses? And as usual, nit picking minutia does not improve your logic

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 225
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 3:28:51 PM   
bounty44


Posts: 6374
Joined: 11/1/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWrestler

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Spot on article. Should be a thread just to discuss.
Here are the next two articles in the series. http://www.slate.com/articles/life/history/features/2014/the_liberal_failure_on_race/affirmative_action_it_s_time_for_liberals_to_admit_it_isn_t_working.html
http://www.slate.com/articles/life/history/features/2014/the_liberal_failure_on_race/madison_avenue_the_failure_of_integration_in_advertising_and_what_it_says.html


The author of those articles is Terry Colby

1. Terry Colby graduated Vestavia high school in '93. Vestavia was established in Alabama during the 70s and still to this day retains the "Rebels" as their mascot

2. After seeing Bush fail, Colby got behind the Obama campaign, and after helping Obama win came to realize that in New York at age 33, he does not have a black friend, nor had one growing up, nor know a person who knew more than one or two black people

3. In the mean time, he writes a couple books mostly painting dead celebrities in a positive light (Belushi and Michael Jackson amongst others) to gain popularity

4. In 2013, at age 38 or so, he enters into the public conversation about race after Obama won a second time

5. One year after entering the conversation on race, he publishes an article dedicated to bashing democrats

This guy is power hungry. He moves to New York, one of the monetary and economic capitals of the world looking to get rich. Bush was horrible, and recognizing opportunity, he jumps on the Obama campaign. After winning, he realizes he does not, nor has had, a black friend. After Obama wins again, he enters the conversation on race because it will have strength for atleast 4 years. After a year, he publishes a piece attempting to bash Democrats

I will say Bounty, this is one of your better thinly veiled, though highly biased, citations


its not the least bit surprising there's not one thing you posted, the foremost of which might be the asinine reference to the high school he went to, that disqualifies the author from speaking the truth about the matter as he views it.

nor is it surprising, along with your continual presumption, that you've not addressed in any way shape or form, the actual content of the man's writing.

the author's name is TANNER Colby. here's a little bio:
tannercolby.com/bio


< Message edited by bounty44 -- 2/4/2016 4:16:42 PM >

(in reply to DominantWrestler)
Profile   Post #: 226
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 4:17:40 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML
Asians are quite successful in Dade schools although they are less than 1.0% of the student population. Fuck your math. In 2010/2011 school year black (non Hispanic) constituted 24.5% of Dade's student population, not 13%. More of your fucked up math.

Does Miami-Dade County spend the same amount, per student at every school (based on level of the school) in the County?

I honestly don't know. Let google be your friend.


You bitched about TPS students having less spent on them than others, yet you don't know what Miami-Dade Co. spends on their students?!? WTF?

Miami-Dade Co. Schools spent $8512/pupil in 2012.

In comparison to Lucas Co School Districts, That puts them $448/pupil LESS than the lowest spending public school district in Lucas County. And you were bitching about Toledo being second highest?!? LMMFAO!!!


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 227
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 4:26:30 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
Magnet schools, and other schools get supplimental funds.
Failing schools get increased funds.


So, no. One elementary school's per pupil spend may not be the same as another elementary school.

My question wasn't worded quite correctly. At each school level, are all the pupils in that level getting the same per pupil spend? Obviously, that answer is "no."


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 228
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 4:29:30 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML
Racism is racism no matter how you slice it.


Obviously, you either don't believe that, or you don't know what racism is.




_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 229
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 4:43:43 PM   
DominantWrestler


Posts: 338
Joined: 7/4/2010
Status: offline 		Who would have thought a southern sell out would bash Democrats on race. Besides, much of what he said had already been refuted. This is almost as bad as quoting the Zionist used by Bush to justify the Middle East wars on matters of Islam. Face it, you need biased sources to make your case

And his website was one of maybe 5 or 6 sources I pulled the information from

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Profile   Post #: 230
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 5:12:31 PM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
Magnet schools, and other schools get supplimental funds.
Failing schools get increased funds.


So, no. One elementary school's per pupil spend may not be the same as another elementary school.

My question wasn't worded quite correctly. At each school level, are all the pupils in that level getting the same per pupil spend? Obviously, that answer is "no."



Ya. Failing schools get boatloads of money thrown at them.
Magnets get around 10% bonus. Stem schools are more expensive. But except for these kinds of adjustments they all start out equal. (Oh, there's also a multiplier for cost of living by zip code, iirc. So cities are more expensive than rural etc)

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 231
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 5:17:05 PM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML.
quote:

Segregation in the North was a different disease than segregation in the Deep South
Different flavors of racism? LMFAO!!



Sigh. Why don't you go google de facto and de jure segregation.

Don't have to. de facto segregation occurred nationwide in addition to de jure segregation. Plessey vs. Ferguson permitted it. Racism is racism no matter how you slice it. Americans have been indulging in a variety of creative explanations and dodges since the Birth of the Nation. And they continue today with such dodgy parsing of de jure vs. de facto. Like a shotgun blast to the left side of the brain is different than a gunshot blast to the right side of the brain. Tis a charade, the clowns and elephants are in town. Racism is as racism does however and wherever it marginalizes people of color.


And so another liberal dances in the delusion of his own private fantasy land.

The suprieme court says its different - but once again you know better.
Logic says its different - but once again. you know better.

Its an interesting world you live in - a bit morbid tho - with north america depopulated by 600 million civil war deaths, and japan suffering 2 million deaths due to atomic weapons.

I suppose you think Gore won too.

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 232
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 6:10:00 PM   
DominantWrestler


Posts: 338
Joined: 7/4/2010
Status: offline 		Phydeaux, aren't you always complaining about the pettiness here?

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 233
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/4/2016 11:35:18 PM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWrestler

Phydeaux, aren't you always complaining about the pettiness here?



Look mate, the man is claiming de facto and de jure segration are the same thing. Its as if he's blind and can't see the words are not the same; they are not synonyms. In fact the reason we have two separate classifications is, in fact, to separate, characterize and perhaps remedy two different problems - that have different etiologies, and different solutions.

Its like saying apples and banannas are the same - despite every ounce of language and experience declaring them different.

You are absolutely right - I hate pettiness. However, when you have a fellow whose entire argument is - (paraphrasing) nanny nanny boo-boo, its the same because I say so - what grounds really is there for discussion?

(in reply to DominantWrestler)
Profile   Post #: 234
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/5/2016 8:12:57 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWrestler

Phydeaux, aren't you always complaining about the pettiness here?



Look mate, the man is claiming de facto and de jure segration are the same thing. Its as if he's blind and can't see the words are not the same; they are not synonyms. In fact the reason we have two separate classifications is, in fact, to separate, characterize and perhaps remedy two different problems - that have different etiologies, and different solutions.

Its like saying apples and banannas are the same - despite every ounce of language and experience declaring them different.

You are absolutely right - I hate pettiness. However, when you have a fellow whose entire argument is - (paraphrasing) nanny nanny boo-boo, its the same because I say so - what grounds really is there for discussion?
This is what I said, asshat: "Don't have to. de facto segregation occurred nationwide in addition to de jure segregation. Plessey vs. Ferguson permitted it. Racism is racism no matter how you slice it."

I'll ask you to stop misrepresenting my words. I never said de jure segregation was the same as de facto segregation. The point I made is it doesn't matter because they are both a form of racism.

Did you ditch your critical reading skills along the way to your path of white privilege. What matter the way you kill a man, homicide is still homicide. The man is dead. Racism is racism no matter if it is de jure or de facto. People of color are in both cases classified as inferior. You offer a pathetic nitpicky defense of this nation's mightiest historical blunder.

Billie Holiday's anguished musical protest to the lynching of blacks

Southern trees bear strange fruit
Blood on the leaves and blood at the root
Black bodies swinging in the southern breeze
Strange fruit hanging from the poplar trees

Pastoral scene of the gallant south
The bulging eyes and the twisted mouth
Scent of magnolias, sweet and fresh
Then the sudden smell of burning flesh

Here is fruit for the crows to pluck
For the rain to gather, for the wind to suck
For the sun to rot, for the trees to drop
Here is a strange and bitter crop

Instead of openly lynching black men today, our corrupt legal system is incarcerating them in great numbers.

And in the case of comparing the nuclear bombing of Japanese cities to 500 years of thug murders why are you so inept to understand I was comparing the amount of kills/per nanosecond of time. The death of any number of people by barbarians in the past is a lame event when compared to what we can do today; there would be no future 500 years if all the nuclear capacity were unleashed.





(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 235
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/5/2016 8:29:10 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML
Racism is racism no matter how you slice it.


Obviously, you either don't believe that, or you don't know what racism is.


Jesus on a bicycle, DS, any form of racism dehumanizes one group of individuals by another who think they are superior. American history is forever stained by the continuation of institutional racism and by those individuals who make lame excuses for it because they carry it in their hearts for one distorted philosophy or another. "Blacks are mentally inferior." "Blacks are just too lazy to pull themselves up." "Blacks would rather live off welfare than work." "Black quarterbacks and coaches are not smart enough for the NFL" "Blacks were happy in their slavery in the benevolent old Southland" "The South fought the war between the states for states rights not to keep slavery." yatta, yatta, on it goes. Dumb, bigoted, dumb, bigoted, dumb.

Please, don't tell me what I believe or don't believe; nor what I know or don't know. That kind of remark makes you look silly.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 236
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/5/2016 9:11:28 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline 		@DS

quote:

There were gays in the military. They weren't "out," but they were still in it. But, "forced integration" of the military would have been forcing gays to join against their wills.

Plessy v. Ferguson being overturned wasn't "forcing integration." It was removing forced segregation.

Why can't you see the difference?


Your definition of forced integration of gays in the military is hilarious. Sorry.

The military was forced to accept (integrate) the gays who were in and who wished to join. When I was drafted they actually asked us if we were homosexual. The military was forced to de facto integrate gays who were serving. I don't know if there was a law or regulation against being gay or doing sodomy.

Brown vs Board was based on the 14th Amendment right to equal protection under the Law. Separation was inherently unequal.

"Today, education is perhaps the most important function of state and local governments. Compulsory school attendance laws and the great expenditures for education both demonstrate our recognition of the importance of education to our democratic society. It is required in the performance of our most basic public responsibilities, even service in the armed forces. It is the very foundation of good citizenship. Today it is a principal instrument in awakening the child to cultural values, in preparing him for later professional training, and in helping him to adjust normally to his environment. In these days, it is doubtful that any child may reasonably be expected to succeed in life if he is denied the opportunity of an education. Such an opportunity, where the state has undertaken to provide it, is a right which must be made available to all on equal terms."

Granted the Court did not have armed troops to enforce its will but they seemed pretty damned insistent to me.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 237
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/5/2016 10:03:33 AM   
Phydeaux


Posts: 4828
Joined: 1/4/2004
Status: offline 		Ah, lying. The penultimate refuge of liberals everywhere.

Fortunately forum posts maintain an accurate account of what you actually said:



quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML.
quote:

Segregation in the North was a different disease than segregation in the Deep South
Different flavors of racism? LMFAO!!



Sigh. Why don't you go google de facto and de jure segregation.



Here you were ridiculing bounty's assertion that segration in the north was different than segration in the south. Which you laughed at -poo pooing the assertion that they were different.

Suggesting that it was all racism.

So in your next post, you continue your jive..
quote:

Don't have to. de facto segregation occurred nationwide in addition to de jure segregation. Plessey vs. Ferguson permitted it. Racism is racism no matter how you slice it. Americans have been indulging in a variety of creative explanations and dodges since the Birth of the Nation. And they continue today with such dodgy parsing of de jure vs. de facto. Like a shotgun blast to the left side of the brain is different than a gunshot blast to the right side of the brain. Tis a charade, the clowns and elephants are in town. Racism is as racism does however and wherever it marginalizes people of color.


See, I've highlighted your own words for you. See the words - dodgy parsing? It means you find the classification of segregation into two types to be a irrelevant, suspect mincing of words. Once again, those are your words. You can't now claim you didn't say them once someone reveals their manifest idiocy.

Not all segragation is the same; not all segregation is racist. Muslims and conservative Jews segregate by sex at prayer services. Is that evil??

People tend to CONGREGATE with like minded people. Most black churches are, yanno, black. They are segregate by de facto segregation - but it isn't evil, and it isn't racism.


As for

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

An interesting bit of history. Muslim thugs were reputed to have killed 2 million travelers over 500 years

No big deal. Two bombs did that in nano-seconds over Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

quote:

And in the case of comparing the nuclear bombing of Japanese cities to 500 years of thug murders why are you so inept to understand I was comparing the amount of kills/per nanosecond of time. The death of any number of people by barbarians in the past is a lame event when compared to what we can do today; there would be no future 500 years if all the nuclear capacity were unleashed.



Yes, I understand what you were attempting to do.
The fact remains that you casually dismissed 2 million deaths as if in fact the deaths of 2 million people were unimportant.
The fact remains that you didn't understand the number of people that actually died - getting it wrong by at least a factor of 10 times.
The fact remains that
quote:

The death of any number of people by barbarians in the past is a lame event when compared to what we can do today;
is simply wrong. The fact that we can kill billions of people now is horrific; but it is separate and distinct from the fact that the muslims actually killed 100 million people. Equivalent to 1/3 the population of the united states - and you casually brush that off.

You ignore the lessons of history, and your feeble justifications deserve ridicule.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 238
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/5/2016 11:16:20 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline 		@DS


quote:

You bitched about TPS students having less spent on them than others, yet you don't know what Miami-Dade Co. spends on their students?!? WTF?

Miami-Dade Co. Schools spent $8512/pupil in 2012.

In comparison to Lucas Co School Districts, That puts them $448/pupil LESS than the lowest spending public school district in Lucas County. And you were bitching about Toledo being second highest?!? LMMFAO!!!

89% per student for Dade; 56.1% for Toledo Efficiency vs money down the toilet.

quote:

Does Dade Co. only have one School District? Lucas Co. has 9 public school districts.
A civic sham to avoid desegregation in Toledo.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 239
RE: Friedrichs v. California Teachers Association - 2/5/2016 11:36:00 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Here you were ridiculing bounty's assertion that segration in the north was different than segration in the south. Which you laughed at -poo pooing the assertion that they were different.

Suggesting that it was all racism.
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it is a fucking duck.

quote:

Not all segregation is the same; not all segregation is racist. Muslims and conservative Jews segregate by sex at prayer services. Is that evil??
If you would take the time to read Brown vs. Board you would see the decision was based on the 14th Amendment guarantee of equal protection under the law. To wit: when a state supplies public education to children it must do so without separation by color. School integration under BROWN has nothing to do with your idiotic ramblings about tribal gatherings, or the separation of men and women at prayer services. It is a prohibition against the STATE Why can't you get a grip on the topic.
quote:

Yes, I understand what you were attempting to do.
The fact remains that you casually dismissed 2 million deaths as if in fact the deaths of 2 million people were unimportant.
Only an idiot would fail to see I made a comparison of bodies/time.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 240
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