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Darkfeather -> RE: Why would someone do this? (3/23/2016 9:37:25 PM)
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Uh huh... yeah.
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ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar
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ORIGINAL: Darkfeather
See, beautiful, wonderful... A straight answer. Finally, someone willing to say, "suck it up guys". So take this to heard men (or women) seeing cold contact, go into it with absolutely no expectations of an answer
I have said from the start that you should not expect and answer, because you doing something you choose to do does not create the obligation on another person to respond.
Nobody should expect anything from a stranger they haven't had any previous interaction with, just because they chose to do something out of their desire.
There's certain situations in which its certainly nice, or polite, or courteous to respond positively to a stranger approaching you, but there is no obligation to do so, and as such you shouldn't expect it.
If you hold open a door for a random woman you don't know, it's certainly nice if she says 'thank you', but you should expect it, because she did not ASK you to hold open that door for her, and so she is in no way obligated to acknowledge your desire to do so.
In fact, she would be perfectly justified if she stopped walking the second you attempted to hold open that door for her, and refused to go through it unless she got to open it herself, if that's what she wants to do, because you are not entitled to expect her to respond positively for something she didn't desire you to do.
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I would argue the opposite. In polite society, it is absolutely expected to get/say please and thank you. If I hold a door for someone, I damn well expect a thank you. Do I get it, more often than not, no. But you better be sure, I expect it. To that end, if someone holds a door for me, guess what? I say thank you. A waiter brings me a menu, I say thank you. A cashier gives me change, I say thank you. Why, because its what ya do in polite society. We are talking about expectation versus result here... There are no laws forcing us to be polite, hell in some cities people take it as their right to be rude pricks. But to say we should not expect politeness? We should not go into every exchange with another human being, both offering and receiving common courtesy/politeness? No. Again, this is expectation versus result. I put it out there that everyone should expect politeness.
So your argument is that by your actions, you have the right to force your morals, values and ideals on others?
And that, by voluntarily doing something for somebody else they didn't ask you to do, you are now creating an obligation upon them to be grateful?
And BTW, your argument towards cashiers or waiters doesn't apply, considering that we're talking about private businesses where you create an obligation for them to do something for you. You create the obligation on the waitress and cashier to do something for you (which comes from their boss expecting them to provide you a service, which comes from their desire to earn a living). Considering that you engage with them on the terms that they should have to do something for you, it's obviously reasonable for them to expect you to be courteous and respect their work in return.
The same doesn't apply when you open a door for somebody. When you open a door, you don't do so in reply to an expectation of work you have placed on them. You do it because you feel like doing so.
As such, your desire to do so doesn't create an obligation on them to do anything in return. They didn't ask you to open the door. They didn't expect it. They didn't require it from you. And they didn't place the obligation on you to open the door.
As such, you doing so regardless of your own free will does not create an obligation on them. Sure, it's nice of them if they're courteous in return. But your act of free will does not place any sort of obligation on them, not even to be polite, because they didn't ask you to do something for them.
Bolded to really make these points... Bold 1, this is where you defend a person for not acting nice. Now, I have never said a person has to act nice, only the other person has an expectation of being treated nice. Note that you go on to say that expectation is false, where we don't even get the expectation of being treated nicely...
Bold 2, somehow my morals come into this discussion. I even underlined the word expectation, to emphasize the fact that it is not enforced on another but personal viewpoint. My expectations of a situation in no way dictates what the other person does, in most cases that person doesn't heven have a clue as to my own personal expectations. This is why I honestly said, you are the first person to even bring morals into this. And for some reason, still wanted to discuss morals...
After those two points, where it is obvious you see the world skewed towards people not having a personal or societal compelling to act nice/civil towards each other, I concluded that any further discussion would be pointless. And still do, by the way, since I actually have to go through this pointed explanation.
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