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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/5/2016 6:56:52 PM

Awareness

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GBaxter

I know it's a popular platitude we hear in BDSM, but as some female subs can be rather arrogant and condescending about it,
is a female sub, or a female switch's submission really a gift ?

No. Anyone who claims otherwise is an asinine ass-clown.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/5/2016 9:56:03 PM

Greta75

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alecta
You submit to his demands for you to sexually dominate him.
He submits to your demands to have a Dom outside the marriage.
He submits to your leadershi (dominance) in some things, you submit to his on others. And when he doesn't want you to just give in to what he wants, that's because he wants you to decide instead.
Don't you see?

In another words, you are simply saying all vanilla relationships usually are like two switches co-existing together. So they take turns to top and bottom each other. That probably is true.
What I realise is, in vanilla relationships, very often, I am the dominant one. I usually hook up with men who just accommodates to whatever I want and never liked to be the decision maker and seem to always push all decisions to me, and I got a habit even at work, if nobody steps up, I step up.

I was with my x-dom after my divorce, and we were getting a new place together, and it was like, I find myself being shock that he wanted to control things that no man I ever dated would think of controlling.

For example. Carpets. Colour, design, look, and where would we have carpets. We disagreed on that, as he came from a cold country and my country is like freaking burning hot and humid 24/7, 365 days a year, even if it's rainy, it's stuffy and like an oven! We don't need to carpet the whole damn house, and we need to walk barefoot on tiles to keep cool.

While he wants the whole house carpeted!

Plus us hot and humid weather are very bug prone. So carpets makes it very hard to keep the place clean.

Anyway, I lost that argument! End of the day, his da boss.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 10/5/2016 10:00:16 PM >

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/5/2016 10:14:29 PM

tamaka

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Lucky him.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 7:21:04 AM

Alecta

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
What I realise is, in vanilla relationships, very often, I am the dominant one. I usually hook up with men who just accommodates to whatever I want and never liked to be the decision maker and seem to always push all decisions to me, and I got a habit even at work, if nobody steps up, I step up.

Work is work, work personas are exempt (although HAVing a work persona is apparently indicative of having a manipulative personality, they say).

Submissive personality men in the vanilla world, Asia in particular (I'm from there), like going for stronger personality women because they feel that they would be "easy to cater to". They fear having to guess or take chances towards making the girl happy, just like they're afraid of making guesses and taking chances in general. Strong girls, in their minds, would tell them what they want so there's no guessing, and it's a sure thing. They don't see it as letting the girl take the lead, they see it as fulfilling all her expectations and therefore never having to take the chance of failing.

But I don't think not liking to be the decision-maker in vanilla/dating is a submissive trait per say, that, I think, is more tied into our expectations on dating, as women. Even for me, I despise when someone wants to take me out then turns around to ask me to plan everything. The way I see it, you're taking me out on a date. It's your job to plan and take risks, show me things that hopefully are new to me and that hopefully I will like, delight me and impress me. That's courtship!

If I wanted to go to a certain place I'd do it on my own or invite you (if I wanted your company there). If I wanted to court you, I would do the planning. Since you want to take me on a date, you should plan the date. It's about who wants whose attention more in this case, not Dominance or submission.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 7:51:36 AM

Greatlilbabygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

Lucky him.

Did you just come on here to spread negativity and snark? You literally added nothing of value to the conversation.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 8:08:05 AM

ohthat1percent

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If you want to be technical, neither are you in complaining to her.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 8:11:55 AM

Awareness

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quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
"Giving unconditional love" to someone is a big deal, no matter what word you use.

There's no such thing and nobody does that. All love is conditional.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 8:59:05 AM

tamaka

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greatlilbabygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

Lucky him.

Did you just come on here to spread negativity and snark? You literally added nothing of value to the conversation.

There is only no value added if the person who i take the time to comment to doesn't actually take the time to reflect upon the words/idea. There is a saying 'Less is more'.

For example, I suggested an idea to you for your own self reflection but instead of consider and actually try it (and maybe start a healthy process of asking yourself some tough questions) you immediately react with some quip about me taking your problem personally. Now does such an idea even make sense? Of course not. But for you it makes it so you don't even consider the value of the 'work' that i suggested you do... and yes self evaluation and self reflection is work.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 9:02:31 AM

tamaka

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greatlilbabygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

Lucky him.

Did you just come on here to spread negativity and snark? You literally added nothing of value to the conversation.

There is only no value added if the person who i take the time to comment to doesn't actually take the time to reflect upon the words/idea. There is a saying 'Less is more'. What you have taken as 'negativity and snark' might just be valuable insight if you take the time to process it. The saying goes, "Don't throw your pearls to the pigs" and your comment above is proof of why that is true.

For example, I suggested an idea to you for your own self reflection but instead of consider and actually try it (and maybe start a healthy process of asking yourself some tough questions) you immediately react with some quip about me taking your problem personally. Now does such an idea even make sense? Of course not. But for you it makes it so you don't even consider the value of the 'work' that i suggested you do... and yes self evaluation and self reflection is work.

< Message edited by tamaka -- 10/6/2016 9:04:53 AM >

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 9:30:49 AM

Greatlilbabygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ohthat1percent

If you want to be technical, neither are you in complaining to her.

Touche.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 9:32:09 AM

Greatlilbabygirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greatlilbabygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka

Lucky him.

Did you just come on here to spread negativity and snark? You literally added nothing of value to the conversation.

There is only no value added if the person who i take the time to comment to doesn't actually take the time to reflect upon the words/idea. There is a saying 'Less is more'.

For example, I suggested an idea to you for your own self reflection but instead of consider and actually try it (and maybe start a healthy process of asking yourself some tough questions) you immediately react with some quip about me taking your problem personally. Now does such an idea even make sense? Of course not. But for you it makes it so you don't even consider the value of the 'work' that i suggested you do... and yes self evaluation and self reflection is work.

That's not exactly how it went down, but ok, you keep on keeping on.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 5:45:42 PM

LaTigresse

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
"Giving unconditional love" to someone is a big deal, no matter what word you use.
There's no such thing and nobody does that. All love is conditional.

Exactly.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 5:55:47 PM

ThatDizzyChick

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quote:

There's no such thing and nobody does that. All love is conditional.

I disagree, my love of heavenly hash ice cream is unconditional. :)

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 5:58:56 PM

ohthat1percent

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I agree with Awareness, there is no such thing as unconditional love or submission - hell any interaction attached to emotions with people is conditional . And that's okay.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 6:22:32 PM

UllrsIshtar

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick

quote:

There's no such thing and nobody does that. All love is conditional.

I disagree, my love of heavenly hash ice cream is unconditional. :)

No it's not. It's conditional on it tasting good. If it were to change in some way you didn't approve of, you wouldn't love it anymore.

Just like your love for people is based on them being somebody you like, and if they were to change in some way you didn't approve of, you wouldn't love them anymore.

Your love is conditional upon the fact that the thing or person you love has some qualities you approve of exceptionally. Without those qualities, you no longer love them/it.

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I can be your whore
I am the dirt you created
I am your sinner
And your whore
But let me tell you something baby
You love me for everything you hate me for

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 6:36:18 PM

ThatDizzyChick

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Oh God, get a fucking sense of humour you pedantic twit.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/6/2016 10:56:48 PM

Greta75

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ohthat1percent
I agree with Awareness, there is no such thing as unconditional love or submission - hell any interaction attached to emotions with people is conditional . And that's okay.

When I take a scarred cat home, that basically spends her life in hiding, and is non-existence. Been with me for 15 years now. Yet I never see her. She only comes out from hiding to use her litterbox or to eat when I am not around. She is terrified of all human beings. She never recovered. Whenever she sees me, her eyes grew wide, her ears go down. She runs back to hide.
Yet I continue to care for her and feed her all these years.
To me, I love her unconditionally. She gives me nothing. Not even the eye candy of her presence. I can't touch her, I can't hold her. When I go drag her out to cut her nails or clean her ears, she shivers in so much fear, like I am killing her. It feels awful even trying to grab her to do anything, I feel she is soo traumatized by any type of handling.

My initial intention was not to keep her but to save her and get her adopted out, but seeing this scarred personality, I knew nobody will ever adopt her.

I experience unconditional love from my best friend. I give him nothing. He gives me everything. I seriously do absolutely nothing for him at all. Nothing. Zero.

I totally believe in unconditional love.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 10/6/2016 11:06:02 PM >

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/7/2016 11:04:21 AM

Awareness

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
I experience unconditional love from my best friend. I give him nothing. He gives me everything. I seriously do absolutely nothing for him at all. Nothing. Zero.

He's a pussy who wants to fuck you and you're a using bitch.

quote:

I totally believe in unconditional love.

For other people. You're not capable of love.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/7/2016 9:34:45 PM

Greta75

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
He's a pussy who wants to fuck you and you're a using bitch.

No Awareness. He hangs out with me without sex most of the time. He is now my best friend because we agree we are sexually incompatible but still enjoy each other's company. We never have sex anymore. And if there is sex, it's because I ask for it. And never him.

Seriously, he has nothing to gain by being with me. And can you imagine having sex with a woman who deprived you of everything you enjoy in sex? What does he gain?

My best friend can get any other woman he wants too. He is a confident man, gift of the gap, very PR, always says the right things, very slick, and I can't leave him alone for 5minutes without him chatting up some woman and charming her. It's like, he is very comfortable walking up to any stranger and starting a conversation. And it's like his total element.

I can point out any woman at a bar, and send him over, full faith in him engaging her.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 10/7/2016 9:44:01 PM >

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 10/7/2016 9:37:59 PM

Greta75

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
For other people. You're not capable of love.

It depends on what your definition of love is. Technically if all love is conditional, then nobody is capable of love, since the love only exists because of those very conditions. What happen when people change? And people evolve and change.
What happens when all the things you used to love about this person is no longer there?

Unconditional love must exist for relationships to last forever. Many don't last forever, because that love was conditional and unable to accept the changes, or they have changed themselves and their preferences change.

But then I would ask, how is it love at all, when it is in conditional of what that person can continually give you?

When I love someone, I never expect him to stay the same. I am committed to accepting him and all his evolutions, and work with it. I chose to love someone unconditionally. So it will keep staying unconditional. Unless being with him means my death or physical harm, then, I am no good to him bashed up and dead anyway.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 10/7/2016 9:55:04 PM >

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