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RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/26/2006 11:46:02 PM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

Do not hang your hand out the window of your car. Do not flick ash into the street. And for fuck's sake, do not discard still sparking butts onto the streets and highways! Use your ashtray, fuckwit.

Some of you smoking motherfuckers - with all your fucking self-righteous bullshit about your fucking rights to smoke - set an area near my home on fire. There's a cost in that - so pay up or shut the fuck up about your rights.



The only dumb mother fuckers are those people that want to regulate smokers in the open air while totally ignoring traffic and industrial pollution and other chemicals in the environment such as pesticides etc. which are many more times likely to give you health problems. Such attitude is no more than social facism. Now if you don't drive a polluting vheicle and give up everything that is made by industries that cause pollution, then come to me and complain about the odd cigarette I smoke. Until then you hypochrondriacs, who will probably die before me because of your bad psychological attitude to life, (which incidently appears to shorten life more than smoking) GET A LIFE!

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 1:31:33 AM   
bignipples2share


Posts: 611
Joined: 4/19/2004
Status: offline 		Okay, I've read both of these threads on smoking, from beginning to end.
I've heard that smokers senses are ruined by smoking. Food tastes and smells better when you don't smoke. So it's up to me to save the world from the personal afront my 93948748391 pound body will leave in their horrified minds from my over-eating if food tasted and smelled any better than it already does.
I recall the time I was loking at the Christmas displays in a store front window. Yes, I was smoking, the wind was blowing. A woman standing at least 5 feet from me started waving her arms around like she was trying to swat a fly. Fact was, she was trying to rid the air of my smoking and giving me dirty looks and saying how awful smoking was. Keep in mind, the wind was blowing in the opposite direction of her. I know this because my neck scarf told the full story as it was streaming constantly, straight out in the opposite direction. Now, this was a person I really wanted to stand on the other side of and blow smoke at, but I didn't.
I don't know how many times I've had to get up and leave an untouched meal or only one bite of food taken from our plates, because someone came into the restaurant wearing perfume that set my X off on a coughing sneezing jag that would not stop. Did we tell the person off? Did we make them leave? After all, we were there first and already had our meals, shouldn't they be made to leave? At least go home and shower? There is no purpose for anyone to use perfumes, other than they like it. I just could never see myself being so rude as to tell them they'd ruined our evening.
So, after banning smoking, will perfumes, aromatherapy, and scents be banned as well? Even though not all scents would cause this reaction in him, just some, however, there are many other people out there who also have a problem with scents. Is that next? After that, what's it gonna be? I just want to make a note of it, so I can prepare for these things, because I know, after ciggerettes are totally banned, something else is gonna make the list.
I'm also wondering when they're gonna chisel off all that God stuff off the buildings and monuments, since "In God We Trust" seems to have been banned, not that I'm religious or anything, just seems that banning prayer in school was first, now it's off the new money, and the list of banned things is gonna go on and on and on...........
hey..where's all my books?

~Big

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 1:48:42 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		I hate perfume. If you need perfume, have a shower, after all that is what French perfume was invented for, to disguise body odour. I remember years ago when I used to go to the city on the bus on Saturday night and the stop after I got on two women would get on reeking of perfume and make-up. My friend and I would have to open the bus window so we could breath and that was in days when you could smoke on buses. Give me smoke anyday and I didn't smoke in those days. Remember, if you need perfme, shower!

(in reply to bignipples2share)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 2:03:20 AM   
bignipples2share


Posts: 611
Joined: 4/19/2004
Status: offline 		Meat, I do shower. On a daily basis too! lol. I happen to like the smell of many perfumes when used in moderation, though it's extremely rare that I personally wear it. 
I've gotta say, there's nothing better than the scent of a man fresh out of the shower. I prefer my man with no cologne, I wanna smell HIM.
~Big

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 3:30:21 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rongreenw
Why don't you anti-smoking people admit the truth. 
This is nothing to do with tobacco, smoke, or its effect on you.
You just want to bully people into stopping doing something because you don't like it.


Nope. I just want to stop people from acting completely like morons in public spaces. In their own homes I seriously do not give a fuck what they do - we can only hope that some kind of Darwin effect takes hold and impales these fucktards on their own remote controls.

Throwing butts from cars onto the highway is almost surely about to become a fairly serious criminal offense given the brush fires that have been raging all over California. When you simply stop to consider that some nitwit caused a brushfire because of their total selfish disregard for anyone or anything but themselves, it's a little hard to sympathize.

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
The only dumb mother fuckers are those people that want to regulate smokers in the open air while totally ignoring traffic and industrial pollution and other chemicals in the environment such as pesticides etc...


What makes you think that any of us on the anti-smoke side of the equation aren't trying to limit the effects of our lives on the environment? In general, I am very apt to support all manner of green leaning ideas and causes. So there is no ignoring of those issues going on at all - so I am calling bullshit on your straw man. As to whether it is hypocrisy or not all I can say is that I am 100% positive I haven't caused any brushfires lately - are you?

FWIW, I drive very minimally, but I do use electricity and have modern electronic conveniences in my home. I suspect you do too. So, I am still ahead of you smoking fucktards in that respect also as I am leaving probably less of a footprint of my existence on this planet than are you.

Seriously, beyond some utterly bullshit self-righteous nonsense about freedom and the supposed pleasures of smoking super-engineered tobacco with over 600 additives to more easily introduce nicotine into your bodies and hook you on it for life - what have you smokers got on your side? When I see a smoker I see:

A. an idiot
b. an easily duped consumer
c. an addict
d. a draw on the overall cost of healthcare to the public
e. a person with nearly no self-control
f. a person that smells and looks bad
g. a person that will taste bad

In sum, a person I don't want anywhere near me.

Smoke 'em if you got 'em. Maybe you will set yourselves on fire and we can then lament the pollution rising from your burning corpses. I wouldn't piss on you to put out the flames.

Have a nice day.


< Message edited by Chaingang -- 7/27/2006 3:34:21 AM >

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to Rongreenw)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 5:04:13 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		To be honest, I am glad I don't live in the same country as you, I'm glad I live in a liberal country were the self righteous are seen as the people they are, social facists who have a problem seeing other people enjoying themselves. If I had my way, I'd force all our residual puritans to emigrate to the Americas where they can be happy telling everyone else what to do.

Smokers pay for their own healthcare through tax and insurance so don't come with that bullshit. Hell we more than pay, we should get a tax refund!

Why I live here.
1. I can smoke without puritans feeling the need to dictate what is good for me.
2. If I want to smoke cannabis, I go to the local coffee shop and buy it and blow it in a policeman's face if I so desire.
3. If I want to buy cookies I can go to the local baker and ask for some to be cooked up.
4. I can drink without any puritanical restrictions of when and where I can drink and what I can drink and how old I have to be and the beer is much stronger than in the US.
5. Sex and fetish shops are just ordinary businesses on the high street.
6. Local protstitues are just ordinary business women selling their wares.
7. BDSM is nothing more than a sexual preference.

Why I wouldn't live in the States. People like you! I can now understand why California is boring, boring, boring.

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 5:18:19 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline 		I guess that's why most everyone wants to live here. In fact, many of them DO live here...

But thanks for not coming here yourself, it decreases the surplus population of smoking morons possibly causing brushfires.

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 5:21:55 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		I wouldn't live there if you paid me. If you wasn't so moronic you would worry more about controling guns since the amount of people that kill other people with guns. I have yet to see someone kill someone by lighting a cigarette.

People go theere for the money, you don't naively think it is for the culture? I'm happy to see the back of money grubbers.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 7/27/2006 5:32:38 AM >

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 6:03:02 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: maybemaybenot

I have a question for the anti smoking group and I am asking this seriously.
Where can we smoke?
I don't smoke in resturants or bars. It's illegal here. I don't smoke in my non smoker friends' homes. I don't smoke in my own home when I have non smokers over. I use my patio. I don't smoke at my non smoking friends homes or on thier property, unless I have permission to use their porch/patio. I don't smoke at work or on the companies property. Against their rules.

Sooooo, I smoke in my car, when I have no non smokers with me and I smoke in my home. And yes, I do smoke outside at resturants and bars. I have more than once been given dirty looks by non smokers who pass by, little digs have been said, parents have used *me* as a poster child of evil, to their children as they pass by. < i am sure it's not me, but any smoker who they can use as an example>
So, tell me, where can we smoke in peace ?

                          mbmbn


I would call you a polite smoker, as I was when I was a smoker. I guess I should not  be surprised that most people responding to this thread that smoke are demanding the right to smoke in my inside airspace. I have no trouble with smoking outside, in your car... I would let a friend smoke on my patio. I would not freak out over a little even coming into my home. I do not want to ban cigarettes completely. I just want my life to be free of them. I want to be able to go out without smelling like them for example. The smell makes me nauseous now that I do not smoke.

I understand being a smoker, and if you want to know why people glare at you then just read some of the other responses on this thread, because rude people who smoke think they are entitled to do it wherever they want no matter the consequence to others.. it is the rude smokers that made it harder for you.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to maybemaybenot)
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RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 6:31:38 AM   
ShiftedJewel


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quote:

it is the rude smokers that made it harder for you.


And it's rude non-smokers that make it harder on the rest of them.

_____________________________

Don't ask, trust me, you won't like the answer... no one ever does.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 6:32:54 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

beyond some utterly bullshit self-righteous nonsense about freedom


Yeah, you wouldn't want anything like freedom to get in the way of your personal idea of what is right. After all somebody may outlaw ignorant profanity and you couldn't say this; "...you smoking motherfuckers - with all your fucking self-righteous bullshit about your fucking rights to smoke" then you couldn't communicate.

btw - I'm a non-smoker
btw2 - Lightning, and humans camping caused the two largest fires in CA this year. Outlaw camping! Why should people have the right to sleep outside?

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 6:35:55 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		Nice one Merc. He was getting to me with his sanctomony.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 6:36:41 AM   
twicehappy


Posts: 2706
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


These sources of pollution at least have postive outcomes even if I personally think the price is too high for planet Earth. For example because of shipping I am able to buy food at the store, because of diesel the farmer can grow more crops to feed more people, because of coal we have electricity to run oxygen machines for smokers to extend their lives after they have burned up their lungs...On the other hand your second hand smoke had not one positive outcome for ANYONE, except the tobacco companies that profit from the pain and suffering they cause...

So while you ridicule the person that does not want to smell or breath your fumes on the road, at least the other fumes she is breathing have SOME redeemable value.. yours have none


Wow, do not feel like i am picking on you but......  

Tabaaco has actual profitted each and every American walking in the land of the free today.


1776: AMERICAN REVOLUTION Along "Tobacco Coast" (the Chesapeake), the Revolutionary War was variously known as "The Tobacco War." Growers had found themselves perpetually in debt to British merchants; by 1776, growers owed the mercantile houses millions of pounds. British tobacco taxes are a further grievance. Tobacco helps finance the Revolution by serving as collateral for the loan Benjamin Franklin won from France--the security was 5 million pounds of Virginia tobacco. George Washington once appealed to his countrymen for aid to the army: "If you can't send money, send tobacco." During the war, it was tobacco exports that the fledgling government used to build up credits abroad. And, when the war was over, Americans turned to tobacco taxes to help repay the revolutionary war debt.
 
 
And it was also the cash crop that provided the financial stabilty that allowed many colonies in both the South and along the Chesapeake to flourish thus becoming states eventually.

So prominent is the place that tobacco occupies in the early records of the middle Southern States, that its cultivation and commercial associations may be said to form the basis of their history. It was the direct source of their wealth, and became for a while the representative of gold and silver; the standard value of other merchantable products; and this tradition was further preserved by the stamping of a tobacco-leaf upon the old continental money used in the Revolution." --19th century historian (DB

Let's not even get into the fact that taxes on tabacco finance everything from grade schools to space shuttle launches.

_____________________________

Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations.

The human heart is not a finite container but an ever expanding universe with all the stars contained there in.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 6:59:02 AM   
Rongreenw


Posts: 7
Joined: 7/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rongreenw
Why don't you anti-smoking people admit the truth. 
This is nothing to do with tobacco, smoke, or its effect on you.
You just want to bully people into stopping doing something because you don't like it.


Nope. I just want to stop people from acting completely like morons in public spaces. In their own homes I seriously do not give a fuck what they do


It's lucky you don't because it's absolutely none of your business.

quote:



- we can only hope that some kind of Darwin effect takes hold and impales these fucktards on their own remote controls.

so stay indoors for the rest of your days, shaking your fist at the TV and finding a new soapbox to leap on. you'll never have to deal with the satanic smokers of doom again.
quote:

 
Throwing butts from cars onto the highway is almost surely about to become a fairly serious criminal offense given the brush fires that have been raging all over California.

stupid people.  of course, all smokers do this don't they, the same as all drivers kill children at school crossings.  live in the real world, wouldya?
quote:



When you simply stop to consider that some nitwit caused a brushfire because of their total selfish disregard for anyone or anything but themselves, it's a little hard to sympathize.

No, really?  From your posts I thought you were advocating people are free to do what they like providing they do it responsibly. 
quote:




What makes you think that any of us on the anti-smoke side of the equation aren't trying to limit the effects of our lives on the environment?
In general, I am very apt to support all manner of green leaning ideas and causes. So there is no ignoring of those issues going on at all - so I am calling bullshit on your straw man. As to whether it is hypocrisy or not all I can say is that I am 100% positive I haven't caused any brushfires lately - are you?


Last week someone robbed a store near me.  He had arms and legs.

You presumably have arms and legs chaingang, are you a store robber?

quote:



FWIW, I drive very minimally, but I do use electricity and have modern electronic conveniences in my home. I suspect you do too. So, I am still ahead of you smoking fucktards


Not on the evolutionary scale you're not, no.  Although you are on your use of swearing, something I personally find objectionable (but I'm not trying to stop you from doing it.  It's a F.R.E.E. country, geddit?)
quote:



in that respect also as I am leaving probably less of a footprint of my existence on this planet than are you.
Seriously, beyond some utterly bullshit self-righteous nonsense about freedom and the supposed pleasures of smoking super-engineered tobacco with over 600 additives to more easily introduce nicotine into your bodies and hook you on it for life - what have you smokers got on your side?


Welcome to the free world, Joe.  Isn't it great?

quote:



When I see a smoker I see:

A. an idiot
b. an easily duped consumer
c. an addict
d. a draw on the overall cost of healthcare to the public
e. a person with nearly no self-control
f. a person that smells and looks bad
g. a person that will taste bad



We'll all change to keep you happy, how's that?

quote:



In sum, a person I don't want anywhere near me.



I strongly suspect they aren't that keen on being around you, either.

quote:



Smoke 'em if you got 'em.


Thanks for the permission, I was going to anyway.

quote:



Maybe you will set yourselves on fire and we can then lament the pollution rising from your burning corpses. I wouldn't piss on you to put out the flames.



You have anger issues that are totally unrelated to smoking.

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 7:01:44 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Do not feel like I am picking on you either, but that has zero to do with pollution. 

I have already stated, you want to smoke, smoke away

I am just glad I have the right to go out to eat without breathing it where I live, and I am especially happy that most of my fellow Californians feel the same way. I never thought I had the right to smoke wherever I liked and to pollute other people's air space, and I guess the reason why is because I have been around mostly nonsmokers in my life. I hated the idea I was stinking up someone else's clothing and hair, and making them cough. Im just polite that way, it is inside me to care how others feel, Im not a "fuck you if you don't like it" kinda person when it comes to how my behavior impacts others. I was annoyed when I would go out of my way to avoid impacting others with my tobacco and they still bitched, but hey, they have the right to say what they want about my habit, it is America after all. It isn't like their words can make me sick and give me a headache and make me cough.. like my smoking does to them.

I guess it comes down to what kinda person you are, whether you smoke or not in the presense of kids and old people. Im the kinda person that is responsible for my behavior and knows I do not have the right to inflict my nasty habit on others.

Like I said, Im glad I was able to quit, one of the many blessings is that my Dom will not date smokers because he doesn't like the way they taste even if they do it outside... I may have missed an opportunity to be his submissive if I was sucking down ciggys still...

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 7/27/2006 7:03:20 AM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to twicehappy)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 7:05:18 AM   
SweetSubTrisha


Posts: 13
Joined: 8/30/2004
Status: offline 		I wonder which does more harm to our society... a 'polite smoker' or this kind of hatred of a group of people who for the most part, have little effect on others. (Not every smoker tosses lit cigarettes out of car windows.)  Is it not possible that the person who tossed out the lit cigarette, who caused a fire, does not even smoke and simply used it as a device to start a fire?   Who's to say?  Certainly not me. 

<<"Smoke 'em if you got 'em. Maybe you will set yourselves on fire and we can then lament the pollution rising from your burning corpses. I wouldn't piss on you to put out the flames. ">>


(in reply to ShiftedJewel)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 7:12:11 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
After all somebody may outlaw ignorant profanity...


That's not how rights work.

You don't want to see sex films, don't watch them.
Strong words offend you, don't read them.
Loud music over 90 decibels - how do you not hear it?
Smoke in an enclosed public space - how do you not breath it?

When your right to do a thing crosses on the rights of another to simply be left alone, then you have no right.

Please note that I am not attacking a smokers status as a smoker, or to do as they will in their own homes and other spaces. I am attacking the notion that a smoker cannot be regulated in places where they are bound to infringe upon the rights of others to be let alone and free of a smoker's polluting interferences. I don't care if some dude is standing their wearing a "Marlboro" or "Joe Camel" t-shirt, I care if he's standing there smoking in my presence where I cannot escape the pollution he is introducing to my immediate environment.

Maybe it would likewise bother that same guy if I stood their cranking industrial music at 120 decibels at him with a boombox.

A joke to illustrate:
Two people sit in a waiting room.
"Mind if I smoke?"
"Not at all, do you mind if I fart?"

quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy
Tabaaco has actual profitted each and every American walking in the land of the free today. (sic)


I guess cotton, hemp and food crops had no value then?

Do you actually work for the tobacco industry, or what?

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 7:35:10 AM   
twicehappy


Posts: 2706
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy
Tabaaco has actual profitted each and every American walking in the land of the free today. (sic)


I guess cotton, hemp and food crops had no value then?

Do you actually work for the tobacco industry, or what?


I never said any other crop lacked a place in history, but it was tobacco that financed old Ben Franklin and the topic was second hand smoke not second hand cotton.

No i do not work for the tobacco industry; i am a retired hospice nurse who took up bike mechanics after retirement. And i actually only started smoking upon the death of my previous Master. What i am is an American who believes in making my own choices; i do not need big brother to decide for me whether or not i should smoke or drink or wear a lid when i ride.  


_____________________________

Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations.

The human heart is not a finite container but an ever expanding universe with all the stars contained there in.

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 7:40:46 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline 		Do not unto others as you would have others not do unto you. [N.B. The dumbass version of the Golden Rule is: Do unto others as you would have others do unto you. See the problem? The right is to be left alone, not to have unwanted attention foisted upon one.]

In other words, you leave me alone and I'll leave you alone. The degree to which we ignore this excellent advice is the precise degree to which we will have trouble.

That's how your rights work.

< Message edited by Chaingang -- 7/27/2006 7:42:28 AM >

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to twicehappy)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Second hand smoke? How about second hand fire? - 7/27/2006 7:46:01 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		Ah Those sort of rights. Jeez am I glad there is an ocean between me and you. There is nothing worse than petty little people who would like to wear big hats.

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 60
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