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Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 4:51:12 PM   
Level


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Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		What do you think of universal healthcare? If you live/lived in a country that had it, what were the trade-offs? Do/did you like it overall? Any horror stories? Good stories? Do you feel it is a drag on the economy?

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:05:29 PM   
LotusSong


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From: Domme Emeritus
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

What do you think of universal healthcare? If you live/lived in a country that had it, what were the trade-offs? Do/did you like it overall? Any horror stories? Good stories? Do you feel it is a drag on the economy?


If we learn from the mistakes and disadvantages of other socialized medicine set ups.. it could work.  But we American's don't learn from history very well.

All I have heard about is long waits. But then, when I had a hot gallbladder a few years back.. I had to wait in an ER 8 hours.. and was transfered to another hospital that "was expecting  me" and I'd get "right in".. to wait another 4 hours.  I finally had emergency surgery after  12 hours.  Soooooooooo it would probably be more of the same.  The illegals are getting "free" health care at our expense.. so why not us?  Oh wait.. we have that nasty little war costing a billion amonth.. maybe when it's over..

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:13:56 PM   
KenDckey


Posts: 4121
Joined: 5/31/2006
Status: offline 		I personally am not in favor of universal health care.   Whre I lived, you couldn't count on seeing the same doctor every time and the doctor was assigned by the state, not by your selection.   If you selected one you had to pay the total fees outright.

The universal healthcare system proposed by Hillary included fines and jail time for not going with the state doctor, state got to pick your doc, etc.

I have realatives that do not have healthcare because their employer does not provide it.  I feel for them and think that the government might offer through some HMO or something a form of affordable healthcare.  But to go totally universal no.  

In the words of President Kennedy  "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:16:31 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		the US will never have it.

any social net there is now - is/has/ or will be atttempted to gut it.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:18:56 PM   
sophia37


Posts: 1433
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Status: offline 		As an uninsured American with children, I'd like to see universal health isurance. Simple as that.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:21:44 PM   
Owned1


Posts: 847
Joined: 7/6/2005
From: Toronto, Ontario
Status: offline 		We have universal health care in canada.  You still maintain choice as to what MD you see, how often and what specialist you want to be referred to.

There is a problem with some waiting lists, however it is not simply related to the universality of the health care but more by the MD shortage, and availability of equipment.

Yes it is taxing on the govt, but think about the advantage the companies have.  Companies do not need to offer health care. Those that do offer extras such as dental, prescriptions eye care.

The govt is getting smarter in some ways and delisting some procedures, ie cosmetic surgeries unless it is disease related, this I have no problem with. 

The problem with health care everywhere is it is reactive rather than preventative.  There are many things the medical establishment can do to encourage preventative care, yes weight, smoking and drinking are a few but there are far more and more universal.  Suck as blood tests for men to check their prostate hormone levels, mammograms for women, just to name 2 the list can go on and on.  As well as health teaching at a young age.

I had the choice to move to the USA with my ex as that is where he was living at the time, but honestly my decision was to stay where everyone no matter what their status had equal opportunity to health care.  I could not live and work somewhere where people had to think about going to the MD and decide if they would do that or feed the kids that week.

Just my 3cents

Owned

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:23:40 PM   
pahunkboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sophia37

As an uninsured American with children, I'd like to see universal health isurance. Simple as that.


some states do cover lower incomed persons children.

each year tho- such programs are in jeopardy.

the state i live in, [pennsylvania] is pretty good.

expect heavy cuts tho-  the money isnt there--- [sorry]

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:24:19 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		When companies like GM finally figure out that they might actually be able to save themselves and compete with foreign automobile-makers if our government provided universal healthcare--that's when we'll have it.  As usual, we'll get something when corporations start clamoring for it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

the US will never have it.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:25:17 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
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From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		i heard that Ontario wont cover chiropracter visits.

ouch!

often they are the most appropriate treatment.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:26:53 PM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Sure we could have it!
But first we need to get rid of all the Illegal Aliens then do away with Foreign Aid and then we could afford it.
But, if you try to do those things the bleeding heart liberals will try to stop you so the reason we can't have it is because of "liberals."
But, they claim that they're "for" it!
Funny isn't it?

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:27:20 PM   
Level


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Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		Thanks for your answer, Owned (and everyone else too); you mention shortage of MDs and equipment, why do you think this is so?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:27:20 PM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
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Status: offline 		Universal healthcare is cheap at the price. Britain pays less than half of what America pays for healthcare and everyone has it. Yes there are problems, there will always be problems because healthcare is never ending and with new technology and drugs there is always something else to spend money on. However, it is there when you are seriously ill and you don't have to spend your life saving or lose your home to access desperately needed treatment. The poorest and most underprivileged members of society have equal access and that to me is a society worth living in. I'd gladly pay higher tax if I knew it was going to be spent on a healthcare system worth having and not some stupid war. Equal access to healthcare for all is one of the things that makes me proud to be a European, even with its faults.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:30:42 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Meat, in this country Illegal Aliens get free healthcare but our poorest do not!
How fucked-up is that?

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:31:20 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Sure we could have it!
But first we need to get rid of all the Illegal Aliens then do away with Foreign Aid and then we could afford it.
But, if you try to do those things the bleeding heart liberals will try to stop you so the reason we can't have it is because of "liberals."
But, they claim that they're "for" it!
Funny isn't it?


Britain gives free access to all including foreigners and and illegals. They don't have access to a general practitioner but they can go to accident and emergency at a hospital and get treatment without questions asked. I'd hate to see that change. We are all human beings and helping people in need is not what I see as a burden.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:31:57 PM   
Level


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

When companies like GM finally figure out that they might actually be able to save themselves and compete with foreign automobile-makers if our government provided universal healthcare--that's when we'll have it.  As usual, we'll get something when corporations start clamoring for it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

the US will never have it.



Evening, Lam. I think about $1,500 of the price of every new GM vehicle goes to pay for the health-care of their employees, so what you said makes some sense. But with the US (and other developed countries) heading towards trouble due to the graying of thier populations, can anyone afford universal care for much longer?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:32:53 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Meat, in this country Illegal Aliens get free healthcare but our poorest do not!
How fucked-up is that?


That is fucked but it is not the illegals that are the problem but the laws and econmomics that debar the poorest from treatment.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:34:49 PM   
Level


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Joined: 3/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Universal healthcare is cheap at the price. Britain pays less than half of what America pays for healthcare and everyone has it. Yes there are problems, there will always be problems because healthcare is never ending and with new technology and drugs there is always something else to spend money on. However, it is there when you are seriously ill and you don't have to spend your life saving or lose your home to access desperately needed treatment. The poorest and most underprivileged members of society have equal access and that to me is a society worth living in. I'd gladly pay higher tax if I knew it was going to be spent on a healthcare system worth having and not some stupid war. Equal access to healthcare for all is one of the things that makes me proud to be a European, even with its faults.


Good post, Meatcleaver. One thing on Britain's care costing so much less than ours, is due to American medicine being so heavily technologized (is that a word?). I read that we have more MRI machines in the greater Atlanta area than in all of Canada.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:37:04 PM   
meatcleaver


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Joined: 3/13/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level



Evening, Lam. I think about $1,500 of the price of every new GM vehicle goes to pay for the health-care of their employees, so what you said makes some sense. But with the US (and other developed countries) heading towards trouble due to the graying of thier populations, can anyone afford universal care for much longer?


I read somewhere that in Britain 80% of the cost of medical treatment someone accummulates in their life is in the last six weeks of their life. It is recognized here but something that is found uncomfortable to talk about that doctors have to make life and death decisions based on cost. Is it worth prolonging someones life when you know their is little chance of survival or do you use those resources on someone else who has a better chance of survival. Sooner or later this is going to have to be debated in public.

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:37:57 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Meat, in this country it is the Illegals that are causing the problems. We now hear that there are 20-30 million of them.
We simply cannot afford to pay.
God I can't wait till Bush gets the hell out of the White House!

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RE: Universal Healthcare - 8/26/2006 5:39:28 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		LOL_ i had 2 MRIs.  i recall someone suggesting the entire population should have one. LOL

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