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Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 2:37:55 AM   
RiotGirl


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Saw the word some where else.. and i was like hmmmm i was just talking about this recently.  Gawd and like i know so many ppl with the issues.  We can have such wise ppl here... sooooooo.

i've got my good share.  Just this last weekend actually, i had something happen with a friend.  Basically it felt like she had turned her back, walked away and with out even saying goodbye.  Which is fine with like general people, cos i dont let them in.  But HELL i love this girl.  So i got abit hurt and then i got pissed and got vicious and then she couldnt do nothing but bawl and well then i felt bad.  Though i was right, i didnt have to get vicious.  i can be a right witch when i'm hurt and i generally know exactly how to get to some one. 

So anyways.  i dun have these isses of having anyone close enough to me to where they can hurt me if they walk.  Generally i'm fine as generally no one is that close.  When i was 16 i used to literally cut everyone from my life and walk to teach myself not to care.  I'd do it randomly. 

Pretty much, everyone i've ever loved has walked on me.  Starting about the age of 4.  (you get abit tired of it and abit pissed off.. heh)  So pretty much, i'm generally pretty sure that no one will ever "stick"  I sorta just wait around for others TO walk.  There;s advantages and disadvantages.  Granted.  One of the disadvantages is becoming truely involved with others.  Cant do it.  And when i do.. well..... 

i'd like to get RID of the abadonment issue thing.  Not so i can let ppl in, but so well if i can control my responses to ppl that i have found myself to care about.  I dun want to think that those that i love - dun love me, are about to walk on me, have fogotten me, dont really care and i dun want to push them away to make them want to walk.  I guess i sort of want to be able to have faith in ppl that i want to have faith in.  Like my Dad.  Granted he walked on me when i was 4, but now he isnt.  And i shouldnt really spazz if he hasnt replied to my emails and its been 2 weeks. 

emotions beat logic any day.  Unfortunetly.  So i dun need to know logistically how to deal with it.  More so emotionally.  And dun tell me to "surround myself with good ppl"  Cos i still wont have faith.  Cos even if its not the person walking.. hell life gets in the way.  They could possibly die.  Or move or something.  People just dun stick and there are those that dooo and i'd like to not spazz and think they're walking when they arent.

Soooooooooooo if anyone has the same issue and has BEATEN it.  Advice?

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 4:54:11 AM   
MasterRobert1


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Was this woman someone who knew online or in real life?

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 5:10:31 AM   
pqwinny


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i thought i'd give the LA thing a try in response to your inquiry and see if i could do the insert links trick so i did a search using abandonment and at least 5 pages of links came up!  i figured that would be cut and paste over kill so you might wanna do the search yourself.

my experience is that it can get better ( a lot better with a lot of work) but it doesn't go away.

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 5:13:24 AM   
TNstepsout


Posts: 1558
Joined: 8/3/2005
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I'm not really sure what to tell you, but if you have really deep seated abandonment issues, I don't think advise from a message board will help. You will need some counseling, and perhaps and couple of years of it. It takes time to identify the things that trigger a learned reaction and to learn new ways of dealing with it. The problem is that your reactions are self-fulfilling. You think people will leave you, so you act like a spoiled brat and they get tired of the behavior and leave. So you have to learn to identify when your fears of abandonment are surfacing BEFORE you react, and then, little by little, learn new ways of protecting yourself.


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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 6:43:56 AM   
NINASHARP


Posts: 295
Joined: 4/23/2006
From: NJ/NYC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RiotGirl

Soooooooooooo if anyone has the same issue and has BEATEN it.  Advice?




The best advice I can give you, because I don't know anyone who hasn't lost someone due to death or relationship failure and felt a sense of abandonment, myself included, is that you trust yourself enough to handle the circumstances, if they do happen. If you go through life keeping everyone at arms length because you fear they will eventually hurt you in the long run, you might miss out on some really great friendships that would have been loyal to the end.  I try to give others a chance despite my past experiences. Maybe just maybe, I will find that not everyone in this world is gonna leave me by choice.  After all, isn't it better to have loved and lost than not to ever have loved at all?

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 7:30:02 AM   
juliaoceania


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I have those issues, but they are not from early childhood, they are from my teen years and on into adulthood. I just learned that everyone leaves (even death is a form of abandonment). I have been trying very hard to learn to trust in others. I do have quite a few people I trust, but trusting men is not easy for me. In fact I am learning in my present relationship just how hard it is to really trust. That is part of what abandonment does, it causes one to be distrustful.

I have noticed that when I am feeling very vulnerable and I cannot talk about what is bothering me because of trust, well I get really mad. I get extremely angry about every little thing... it is almost a primitive thing, so perhaps that is why you were so angry with this person. Of course it doesn't make it right to react on someone from pure emotion, but when someone hits on a deep issue we have, well as you said, emotion is not a logical thing.

I have dealt with many of my abandonment issues and I am a lot healthier for it. I do not know if I will ever totally not have this issue, but I can certainly understand how it functions to cause certain feelings in me so I can acknowledge that and not react from them.. maybe one day that issue will be totally gone.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 8:03:27 AM   
stockingluvr54


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Julia wrote "That is part of what abandonment does, it causes one to be distrustful."

Thats a tuff one and probably one of my bigger demons.... I'll be watching this thread closely....

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 8:18:29 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pqwinny

i thought i'd give the LA thing a try in response to your inquiry and see if i could do the insert links trick so i did a search using abandonment and at least 5 pages of links came up!  i figured that would be cut and paste over kill so you might wanna do the search yourself.

my experience is that it can get better ( a lot better with a lot of work) but it doesn't go away.

Awww :)  You'll learn to edit!

ANyway, it doesn't matter.  Riot's problems go far beyond any of the help that can be given on a chat forum.

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Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 9:03:58 AM   
onestandingstill


Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RiotGirl

Saw the word some where else.. and i was like hmmmm i was just talking about this recently.  Gawd and like i know so many ppl with the issues.  We can have such wise ppl here... sooooooo.

i've got my good share.  Just this last weekend actually, i had something happen with a friend.  Basically it felt like she had turned her back, walked away and with out even saying goodbye.  Which is fine with like general people, cos i dont let them in.  But HELL i love this girl.  So i got abit hurt and then i got pissed and got vicious and then she couldnt do nothing but bawl and well then i felt bad.  Though i was right, i didnt have to get vicious.  i can be a right witch when i'm hurt and i generally know exactly how to get to some one. 

So anyways.  i dun have these isses of having anyone close enough to me to where they can hurt me if they walk.  Generally i'm fine as generally no one is that close.  When i was 16 i used to literally cut everyone from my life and walk to teach myself not to care.  I'd do it randomly. 

Pretty much, everyone i've ever loved has walked on me.  Starting about the age of 4.  (you get abit tired of it and abit pissed off.. heh)  So pretty much, i'm generally pretty sure that no one will ever "stick"  I sorta just wait around for others TO walk.  There;s advantages and disadvantages.  Granted.  One of the disadvantages is becoming truely involved with others.  Cant do it.  And when i do.. well..... 

i'd like to get RID of the abadonment issue thing.  Not so i can let ppl in, but so well if i can control my responses to ppl that i have found myself to care about.  I dun want to think that those that i love - dun love me, are about to walk on me, have fogotten me, dont really care and i dun want to push them away to make them want to walk.  I guess i sort of want to be able to have faith in ppl that i want to have faith in.  Like my Dad.  Granted he walked on me when i was 4, but now he isnt.  And i shouldnt really spazz if he hasnt replied to my emails and its been 2 weeks. 

emotions beat logic any day.  Unfortunetly.  So i dun need to know logistically how to deal with it.  More so emotionally.  And dun tell me to "surround myself with good ppl"  Cos i still wont have faith.  Cos even if its not the person walking.. hell life gets in the way.  They could possibly die.  Or move or something.  People just dun stick and there are those that dooo and i'd like to not spazz and think they're walking when they arent.

Soooooooooooo if anyone has the same issue and has BEATEN it.  Advice?



I too have HUGE abandonment issues. For example at 16 when I told my mom my dad had been molesting me since the age of twelve she first didn't believe me and attacked me for thinking and saying such things. When he came home and admitted it I was asked to leave, not him. Being molested and then not only the lack of my Mom helping me, believing me, or defending me hurt me but to be cast out on my own so young caused me great pain indeed. I have accepted the responsibility was not mine & I can only control me. That has helped heal me a lot. Since then, like you, I have had others I let close to me abandon me too.
The pain of abandonment I can not prevent. Weather I let that control my ability to open up to someone again is my choice. That's where the success comes in for me. I can't be successful with all, but have been with many.

I go through periods where I just want to give up much like you and keep all out so they can't hurt me. I also know I desire & need the wonderfully deep friendships that can only come from taking the chance and opening your heart even though you fear it may hurt you later. For me it's a gamble I willingly take most days.
It's like riding a roller coaster. The more you ride on it the less it terrifies you as you get use to the high highs and the low lows. To me it's like the expression "It's better to have loved and lost than to have never loved at all". The love & friendship I get to participate in before the other person drops me off their plate is still worth the pain of abandonment for me most times.
Not all I've opened all of my heart to have hurt me or abandon me. That helps me keep the faith I can find more people like that. You have to learn to take the good and revel in it & take the bad to learn from it. I just could not keep everyone out. I think that would hurt me more to isolate myself. To me that would be the ultimate failure.
Suzanne

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 9:13:29 AM   
CrappyDom


Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
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LA is right, therapy is what is called for on such a serious issue but here goes my two cents

quote:

Pretty much, everyone i've ever loved has walked on me.  Starting about the age of 4. 


As a child there is nothing you can do

As an adult you have many choices you can make and yours appears to be

quote:

  

(you get abit tired of it and abit pissed off.. heh)  So pretty much, i'm generally pretty sure that no one will ever "stick"  I sorta just wait around for others TO walk.


Setting aside for the moment the issue of the people you choose, say you found Mr. Perfect Friend (Mr. PF) who is caring and sensative.   Well MR. PF sees that giant wall, hangs out for a while  hoping it comes down and when it doesn't he walks.  This is what we call a self fullfilling prophecy...

Then we go on to  how you see what you are doing...

quote:

Not so i can let ppl in, but so well if i can control my responses to ppl that i have found myself to care about.  I dun want to think that those that i love - dun love me, are about to walk on me, have fogotten me, dont really care and i dun want to push them away to make them want to walk.


Most aren't about to walk out on you, but if they are good people and they see your wall up day after day, they either lose interest or put up their own wall.  You then sense that wall and move away and again, the prophecy fullfils itself.

Bottom line is you need to learn that if people come into your life or leave it that is has much less to do with YOU than it has to do with THEM.  This requires that you learn to value yourself in a way you don't seem to have done.  Being tough and self reliant isn't the same thing as self love and I am not talking masterbation here.  You also need to learn that if someone decides you are not the friend/lover/whatever THEY need that it doesn't mean you are not worthy of their friendship but that they are looking for something else. 

As an over the top example, say you meet some hot uber dom and you get all hot and bothered by him.  You have a super hot session, millions of orgasms and you to stare at each other with puppie eyes and start dreaming of having a relationship.  Then he tells you that he wants you to serve as the human toilet for his two dogs or he is going to leave, you would probably tell him to leave but YOU WOULDN'T FEEL ABANDONDED, you would be able to realize, because it is such an extreme interest, that his leaving was about his interests not yours.

SO, you need to learn that on a less extreme level, that when people come and go it is about them and not because you are not worthy of having them as a freind/lover/whatever.

I edited this to add one thing.  You put up a giant wall and trust me, people can sense it.  So the people who DO want to be connected, who DO want to meet people they can make long term emotional committments to stear clear of you.  So, who doesn't care if another person has a wall up and never really makes emotional committments, another person just like you who is always willing to cut any ties with another because they were never there in the first place.

So it isn't about choosing "good" or "bad" people, it is about the people who choose to come into or stay out of your social circle.  You never even get the chance to choose people who might make a deep committment to you because they steer clear of you in the first place.  Now this is a broad generalization but like many broad generalizations it is often true.  Just like I am sure there are people, probably emotionally needy, who you steer clear of the minute you get a sense that they are "like that" whatever "like that" happens to be.

Good luck, you can do it.

< Message edited by CrappyDom -- 9/6/2006 9:18:53 AM >

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 9:22:57 AM   
Homestead


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I'm with Crappy on this one. The whol abandonment thing has alays ben a self fullfilling prophecy with girls who have directed it at me.  Which in turn,has given me issues with emotionally needy people.  It was so disturbing and dramatic to have to deal with, that I never want to be placed in that position again.

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 9:37:11 AM   
CrappyDom


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From: Sacramento
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Homestead,

You should read my post more carefully...if girls with walls are picking you then you...

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 9:42:08 AM   
ExSteelAgain


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From: Georgia
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RG, I don't know. I just want to welcome you back.

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 9:42:42 AM   
SexyRed


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CrappyDom, I just want to commend you on your reply; it was very insightful and well said.

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 10:25:52 AM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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Crappy,

I absolutely agree with what you posted. In the past I wanted and needed someone to "scale my wall" to get to my heart. I either wanted them to storm the gates of my fortress, or climb the wall, or tear it down. I did not want to let the drawbridge down and invite them in. I think that subconsciously I was confusing determination to get past my defenses with real love. I also think that when one feels abandoned it affects one's self love (at least in my case).. and you are right about the ability to protect oneself with a chip on the shoulder does not mean a person loves themselves, it can mean they are just afraid (as in my case for many years).

My first "uber-dom" tore down my defenses, but not out of loving kindness, but because it was what he wanted to do. The ability to tear walls down and manipulate someone into being vulnerable to you does not equal loving that person or being responsible for having them expose themselves to you. It is not an act of caring. I went through that and ended up compromising myself and in someways this  temporarily made my abandonment issues worse because I felt so exposed...

But I decided it was just too much energy to rebuild my defenses and set out again on the path of not letting people in, of dumping men before they could dump me, of playing games so I could feel I was "in control", and not being my authentic self. I had been my authentic self with my former dominant, and had the heartbreak of that authentic self being abandoned yet again... but I survived it!

I am finding there are still defenses that have yet to be breached by my Daddy, he finds these defenses and he does not tear them down, he does not manipulate me into not having them.... he gently points these out to me and even at times makes me say things in different ways that have the effect of making me feel like a vulnerable child, and then he validates that with loving kindness... I have to say, no one has ever given me that gift before and it is something I absolutely treasure.

If I was busy building walls, it would not only keep the pain out, but the joy too... I never want to go backwards, I can only go forwards now.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 11:09:28 AM   
RiotGirl


Posts: 3149
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterRobert1

Was this woman someone who knew online or in real life?


Real life.  Good friend of mine.  Gah, i'd do anything for her.  Heck, i spent more time with her lil sis's then their parents did. 

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 11:17:34 AM   
raiken


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Crappy that was a very insightful post. 
 
i only wish to add a different perspective.
 
In that sometimes, you need to become open to others and peek outside the wall.  This means that in order to receive, ya have to give a little, and when ya open up to give alittle ya become vulnerable.  Becoming vulnerable is one of the main things that keeps your wall up, and if you shut out the bad, the good stays out too, until you learn to develope better filters.  Developing better filters comes from daring to trust in yourself, your intuition, and in your perceptions of others.  In order to do that, again you need to become open, and give bits of yourself, little at a time, and begin to face your fears. 
 
Begin to trust in yourself and find the courage, that no matter who leaves or stays, you can become free of the fear that binds and controls you.  It is something you have to want more than anything else.    Once you begin to face your fears, you will find that they weren't as bad as you first thought.  Not everyone will leave, if you invite them in to stay awhile. *smile The first move has to be yours.  When you make that first move, will be the time when you really want to be healed and free of your fears, so deeply, that making a move will be your only choice.  It is about surrendering to your fears, to become free and whole.  Once that happens fear will no longer rule over your being.  This all begins within you.  Then...eventually, one baby step at a time, that door or wall will become a window. 
 
You can choose to stay in victim mode, and continue to let fear rule your being.  Or, you can choose to make a move, get some help and good counseling and begin again.  It depends on the strength of your desire to want to truly be free.  Go for the help and make a move, so the rest of your life will not be waisted in fretting over the past, which is done.  You don't have to be a victim to your fears.  No one does.  i wish you the best.

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 11:21:38 AM   
RiotGirl


Posts: 3149
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Interesting, very interesting.  Thank you Crappy. 

Self fullfilling prophecy.  Aye, but its a hard thing to "not" expect.  And i know it dun have much to do with me.  I generally lay it on the fact that their jerks and i dun want anything to do with them anyways.  (least its what i said to my friend)  See, i do have many "good" friends.  Very few that i am emotionally involved with.  I jist want to control that emotional response and well, i've yet to figure out how.  That and the negative thinking that starts to bombard me.  I'm trying to figure out how to counter act that. 

<wicked grin>  i guess what i want to know, is how to be able to say "if they come they come, if they go they go" when i'm emtionally involved.  I do it perfectly to a T when i'm not emotionally involved.  I dunno, maybe i've a hard time when i'm emotionally involved as that i've no control over things. 

i dunno, its a quandry i'm interested in working out.  Oh and no thanks to the counselars!  I do just fine seeking out my own information (like i am) and working it out myself. 

Thanks for the info Crappy - i'll keep it in mind

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 11:45:05 AM   
Kashan


Posts: 51
Joined: 6/30/2006
Status: offline
Wow. Sounds like you want to be even less emotionally involved. We all get hurt when someone we are emotionally attached to leaves. It's learning how to feel that pain without leaping into despair that's the trick. It is possible with practice. No one gets to a point where they can say hi and bye to someone they care about without being sad. It has nothing to do with abandonment issues. You are trying for something that doesn't exist.
However, you don't need to kick someone to the curb just because they aren't there when you want them. Often it has more to do with them and their life than yours. In the Four Agreements by Don Miguel Ruiz, one is never take anything personally. I suggest reading the book and pasting the short version to your bathroom mirror so you can remind yourself of it every day. I bet your friend just got caught up in something else and couldn't show up for you. It probably had nothing to do with you. You just chose to take it personally. So, um lighten up a bit. You are only human. We all make mistakes regularly. And try journaling if you find yourself slipping into the pit of despair.
Crappy, nice advice too. Same song different verse.

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RE: Abandonment issues - 9/6/2006 1:24:58 PM   
stockingluvr54


Posts: 673
Joined: 6/22/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: raiken

Crappy that was a very insightful post. 
 
i only wish to add a different perspective.
 
In that sometimes, you need to become open to others and peek outside the wall.  This means that in order to receive, ya have to give a little, and when ya open up to give alittle ya become vulnerable.  Becoming vulnerable is one of the main things that keeps your wall up, and if you shut out the bad, the good stays out too, until you learn to develope better filters.  Developing better filters comes from daring to trust in yourself, your intuition, and in your perceptions of others.  In order to do that, again you need to become open, and give bits of yourself, little at a time, and begin to face your fears. 
 
Begin to trust in yourself and find the courage, that no matter who leaves or stays, you can become free of the fear that binds and controls you.  It is something you have to want more than anything else.    Once you begin to face your fears, you will find that they weren't as bad as you first thought.  Not everyone will leave, if you invite them in to stay awhile. *smile The first move has to be yours.  When you make that first move, will be the time when you really want to be healed and free of your fears, so deeply, that making a move will be your only choice.  It is about surrendering to your fears, to become free and whole.  Once that happens fear will no longer rule over your being.  This all begins within you.  Then...eventually, one baby step at a time, that door or wall will become a window. 
 
You can choose to stay in victim mode, and continue to let fear rule your being.  Or, you can choose to make a move, get some help and good counseling and begin again.  It depends on the strength of your desire to want to truly be free.  Go for the help and make a move, so the rest of your life will not be waisted in fretting over the past, which is done.  You don't have to be a victim to your fears.  No one does.  i wish you the best.


WOW!  that was some pretty heavy duty stuff there and I think I got something outta that! Thanks.....

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