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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 5:56:21 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Remember, only you can prevent forest fires, but you are the one that creates them.

Smokey Bear.



I see.  So I am somehow the cause of all those fires started by lightning strikes.

Thanks for the valuable data point.

Sinergy

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 6:02:32 PM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy
Why would a rational person shoot an animal with no ability to have a level playing field like Bambi?

You want excitement of proving you are a superior carnivorous hunter, and the thrill of the hunt, go try to kill Hippos with a knife.


Did you actually read the thread or do you just not give a shit?

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 6:02:56 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		If you weren't here the world would still be struck by lightning and the forests would catch on fire as they have since our beginning of time

You are the cause of the interruption of their burning. What shall we think of this very thing.  Are you more important than a tree?

I don't wonder about this any more.

I am,
Ron


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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 7:29:34 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

Why folks??? Why would anyone take a shot at something that they had very little chance of hitting? Why would anyone take shots at a deer that is running full tilt through dense woods?



Why would a rational person shoot an animal with no ability to have a level playing field like Bambi?

You want excitement of proving you are a superior carnivorous hunter, and the thrill of the hunt, go try to kill Hippos with a knife.

Sinergy



]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

Sinergy:
Hunting on a "level playing field" is when you hunt something that can shoot back....bambi on the other hand is lunch....some people shop for lunch some people shoot it.

thompson

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 8:29:02 PM   
sweetnurseBBW


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Yes, my horses have to stay in the paddock up near the house also. I have heard about too many cattle/etc. that somehow looked like a deer. Personally I do not see much similarity but those city boys with too many beers in them and itchy trigger fingers occasionally do.



Several years ago a man illegally hunting on our land hit one of my prize stallions with a bow. The horse ended up ok. This year the deer have figured out to stay in the pasture with the horses and eat for free.

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 8:32:47 PM   
sweetnurseBBW


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From: North Carolina
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

BTW I also use the "I take personal responsibility for the death of the deer I eat instead of hireing an assasin to do the killing for me." argument. I hunt because it keeps me honest about the facts of life, that in order for me to live something else dies. Seperation from the killing doesn't make one noble, it takes them away from the natural order.



Thank you. I take this responsibility very seriously also. I am not a "sport" hunter. I have a great love for animals and nature. When I take the life of an animal it has a profound impact on me. It is not something that I do casually and it is not something that I take for granted.


We aren't sports hunters in this family either. We maybe get 2 deer a year. Used to only get one for us but since Pops cannot hunt anymore and loves venison so we get a deer for him. Irresponsible hunters will always give the reponsible ones a bad name.

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/16/2006 10:19:15 PM   
UtopianRanger


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

Why folks??? Why would anyone take a shot at something that they had very little chance of hitting? Why would anyone take shots at a deer that is running full tilt through dense woods?



Why would a rational person shoot an animal with no ability to have a level playing field like Bambi?

You want excitement of proving you are a superior carnivorous hunter, and the thrill of the hunt, go try to kill Hippos with a knife.

Sinergy



I’m pretty much in line with Synergy with a slight twist.  

You could put me in bar full of drunks / idiots and have one confront me /throw a punch, and in a heartbeat I’d brake his back……but I couldn’t hurt a majestic animal like a deer, bear or cat even if it attacked me { I’d fight back and get it off me, but not kill it}. However, I have been known to eat venison, elk and even bear when someone has invited me over for dinner.


Maybe I'm a hypocrite.....but it would be hard for me to kill a defenseless animal even if I was hungry.





 - R


< Message edited by UtopianRanger -- 11/16/2006 10:20:14 PM >

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 2:08:40 AM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger
I couldn’t hurt a majestic animal like a deer, bear or cat even if it attacked me { I’d fight back and get it off me, but not kill it}. However, I have been known to eat venison, elk and even bear when someone has invited me over for dinner.

Maybe I'm a hypocrite.....but it would be hard for me to kill a defenseless animal even if I was hungry. 


Well at least you know you're being hipocritical.

I can understand when someone says that they just don't have the stomach for the "actual hands on killing", really I can. It's definitely not for everyone. But I can't understand when people say that they could never hurt a poor defenseless animal and then go on to say that they eat meat, use animal products or products that are available to us only after animal testing. Whether they want to think about it or not....they are absolutely just as responsible for the death of poor defenseless animals as I am hunting.

The difference between hunting and purchasing mass raised and slaughtered animals is that at least in hunting, the animal actually gets to live a pretty decent life up to the moment of it's death. It doesn't get to be confined to stockyards or housing where it can't move freely, it doesn't get to be shoved into a slaughterhouse in a pile of terror and chaos by a bulldozer or other heavy equipment, tortured by electricity or beaten by men with clubs, trampled by other panic stricken animals.

I don't know....do you folks have yourselves convinced that if you don't have to see it or take part in it that their death is somehow not really your responsibility? Somehow more humane when it happens? It is a supply and demand industry....and your need, your demand and your usage lays the burden of the responsibility for the killing of those poor defenseless animals squarely on your doorstep....like it or not.



_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 3:11:38 AM   
MistressTexas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

Why would a rational person shoot an animal with no ability to have a level playing field like Bambi?

You want excitement of proving you are a superior carnivorous hunter, and the thrill of the hunt, go try to kill Hippos with a knife.

Sinergy



Ahh Sinergy... Evn at work with a stupid ass rookie and drivers driving me nuts.. you still make me laugh. I gotta ask though.. Hippos? why on earth hippos? Of all the huge dangerous beasts in the world, you choose hippos.  

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 3:44:58 AM   
twicehappy


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Good morning!

First off i am mad at you because you have snow and we do not!!!!!

Sounds like this other hunter was just a gun happy jerk, maybe he had too many beers for breakfast. Those are the kind of hunters i ran off my property year after year. They do not hunt in a responsible manner, no concern for a clean kill, hell they probably do not hunt for the meat, just the trophy. They show no respect for the sacredness of the act of taking a life or respect for the animal giving up it's life to feed them.

Keep at it you will bag yours yet.

I do not hunt i never did but i understand the need for it and allowed a few folks i knew to be respectful hunters  who hunted for the meat including my son in law and a few guys from the local Indian tribe hunt my land.

Even then there were winters i had to buy fodder and put it out daily or see the deer starve. Man has all but eliminated the deer's natural predators so it is our responsibility to see that the herds are thinned or the deer starve to death.





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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 4:38:51 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger

Maybe I'm a hypocrite.....but it would be hard for me to kill a defenseless animal even if I was hungry.



I felt the same before I lived in the French countryside and mixing with the locals I learnt how so much damage can be done when the local wild life is out of balance. After that I didn't feel so bad about killing something for the pot because it meant the rest of the wildlife would thrive. Many of the locals were poor peasant farmers so hunting for food meant they could use more of their little income on other things.

Of course, wildlife gets out of balance because the carnivores at the top of the food chain have been taken out of the equation by centuries of farming and the encroachment of humans. I still don't understand hunting for entertainment though.

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 5:16:57 AM   
servantforuse


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Status: offline 		The gun-deer season in Wisconsin opens this weekend. 600,000 licenses have been sold this year. The DNR has estimated that the deer population in Wisconsin is 1.7 million. About 300,000 deer are taken in an average hunt every year here. It would be a disaster in this State if the deer herd was not reduced each year...

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 6:02:38 AM   
caitlyn


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Status: offline 		Humans are part of nature, unless you believe we were beamed here from Alpha Centari.

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 6:04:49 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		If you peruse some of the boards, you will soon ascertain that there are those here who have come from farther away than that.


LOL,
Ron 

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 7:44:59 AM   
ownedgirlie


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Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin


Why folks??? Why would anyone take a shot at something that they had very little chance of hitting? Why would anyone take shots at a deer that is running full tilt through dense woods? Twice that day the same person unloaded their gun on running deer. 10 shots at two deer and they went home with no deer. It happens all the time....you're out there in the woods and you can hear the shots follow their progress as they run. Maybe they are using different "tree penetrating" ammo?


I didn't see your question acknowledged anywhere in this thread, which seems to have turned into a "to hunt or not to hunt" thread.

I believe the answer to your question is that they are not in it for the sport, they are in it for the kill.  They like blasting their guns and just want to see something fall...or even just stumble.    It's like those Internet hunting sites now - pay a fee and through your computer you can man a shotgun that's strapped to a tree with a webcam.  Hunting from your living room, go figure.

As for the hunting vs. slaughterhouse foods....I have seen the horrific way in which our food is raised. It's why I buy free range organic whenever possible.  Wanna see how conventional dairy cows are harvested?  Take a drive down Highwy 5 in California's central valley.  You can watch hundreds of cows stepping over each other as they live in mud and feces. 

(in reply to mistoferin)
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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 5:33:04 PM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
If you peruse some of the boards, you will soon ascertain that there are those here who have come from farther away than that.


Lol...I think you might be right. I also think that we might be their experiments! "Let's see how fast we can make a human brain implode!"

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 7:42:57 PM   
RiotGirl


Posts: 3149
Status: offline 		Erin, i'm sorry - i couldnt read the thread.  Watching the first 10 minutes of Braveheart earlier made me cry and i know your thread would make me cry.  <sniff sniff>  i cant believe you hunt.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say - i'm sure you dont hunt for sport.  That you actually "eat" it or donate it.  That you follow atleast the food chain.  I'm sure you make it useful - like the native americans did.  i've seen you on the boards for a couple of years now and i know you are a decent human being.  So i KNOW you'd do the decent thing and you cant fault any creature for doing what they naturally do.  Hunt, kill, eat. 

i'm still sad.  You do know that you can like take care of the deer?  Feed them?  Em get a little shelter going?  Killing doesnt have to be the option - (  You also know that each of them is a creature with feeling and emotions and love, and a life.  Right?  They've also have their own unique strand of DNA and there is no possible way to duplicate it excatly to make the same creature twice.  So you're sort of taking out a unique special creature.  Almost like any human being, dog, cat, ect. 

and i know what the food companies do.  I know where the meat on the shelves come from.  (althought i refuse to eat certian meats for certian reasons)  I know what happens to the poor chickens and i know what happens to the lab animals.  If boycotting these things would save a life, trust me i'd do it.  Wont work.  So i do my part and save every creature that i come across and if they're dying i do my best to make it in a loving and caring way - so their soul knows. 

hm and i'm against euthanasia of any animals too.  = (  Especially since i went sneaking about a police animal shelter trying to rescue a cat.  Their methods are horrid.  I'm all for animal rights and i know that one day people are going to realise.  That just like women and any other oppressed society that was thought once upon a time had no feelings, no rights and werent up to the standards - that humans will one day realise this about animals too.  One day, they'll be liberated as well and loved, cared for, protected, cherished and thought of just like us women today are thought of.  Some thing with meaning. 

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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/17/2006 10:31:36 PM   
Lorelei115


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From: Sin City
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quote:

i'm still sad. You do know that you can like take care of the deer? Feed them? Em get a little shelter going? Killing doesnt have to be the option - ( You also know that each of them is a creature with feeling and emotions and love, and a life. Right? They've also have their own unique strand of DNA and there is no possible way to duplicate it excatly to make the same creature twice. So you're sort of taking out a unique special creature. Almost like any human being, dog, cat, ect.


Ok then.. the deer population breeds out of control, decimating the local flora. Other creatures (also with feelings, emotions, love and a life) then starve to death in the cruelest way imaginable. Or are we supposed to build shelters and feed them, too?

Why can't people see that hunting is LESS cruel, not more? Until humans can reintroduce deer's natural predators, we are ALL there is to keep these populations in check! I am an animal lover to my core. I adore every last animal on this earth (except the spiders.. yuck) so when I know that by having responsible hunters out there like mistoferin, it actually helps keep the deer population healthier and happier, I support them 100%.

The phrase, "can't see the forest for the trees" comes to mind quite clearly here.

A little twitchy tonight, folks. Sorry for any offense given, but I stand by my words.



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But by the realization
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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/18/2006 2:06:41 AM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lorelei115
The phrase, "can't see the forest for the trees" comes to mind quite clearly here.


You really hit the nail on the head with that one. Gosh, I wish people would see the WHOLE picture. But I guess it's easier for them to view people like me as monsters. I guess it makes it easier for them to sleep at night if they don't have to deal with the "killing" part themselves.

I do what I do BECAUSE I love animals. I can't speak for all hunters....and yes, of course, there are some whose motivations are less than honorable....but there are an awful lot of us out here who care a great deal about animals, conservation and the environment.

The land that I hunt is a prime example. It is owned by a long time friend of mine. It is an 80 acre plot that is maintained FOR the deer. It is heavily wooded to provide habitat. Those of us who hunt the land have gone in and clear cut sections of it and planted white tail clover for the deer to eat. There are 9 YEAR ROUND feeders that have been installed. We all take turns hauling food out to fill those feeders and upkeep the land...in all kinds of weather.

The property owner is under pressure to sell that plot and could get a pretty penny for it. He refuses because he wants it kept as a haven for the animals. Hunting there is by invite only and there are only a few of us who are allowed. You screw up you will not be invited back (as is the case with the other hunter I described in my OP).

I do far more than the average person FOR animals. But time and time again I am accused of being basically heartless when it comes to hunting by people who don't make any real efforts to make a difference for them other than voice their opinions. They seem to frequently use the cute, beautiful, graceful animal thing. So I guess if deer were ugly they'd be fair game.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to Lorelei115)
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RE: A hunting story/Rant - 11/18/2006 8:54:37 AM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

When I lived in rural France I shot foxes to protect the poultry and other fowl in the village and shot wild fowl and rabbits for the table (if I didn't kill my own I would have bought some anyway). I never enjoyed the act of killing but some is necessary with human encroachment in the countryside. I still don't understand hunting as entertainment though.


In truth, unless someone is a strict vegetarian/vegan then that person is not in a position to take the moral high ground (even where hunting is for sport).

What pisses me off about fox hunting etc in Britain is the general toffery that surrounds it but in all honestly I eat just about every meat going so objecting on moral grounds would be hypocritical.

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