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RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 6:22:03 AM

Leonidas

Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline

quote:

People fear what they don't understand, and hate what they fear. I don't think keeping yourselves isolated in the Gorean boards will help your cause. I think the only thing that will help is calm, reasoning discussion. Yes, you may feel as though you are flamed or attacked, but I think you should remember that most of that comes out of a misunderstanding of who you are and what you stand for. Instead of responding in kind, use the last resort. A very quiet, reasonable voice, and acceptance of the fact that we all have views and beliefs that we hold near and dear, and all are worthy of respect.

Hi Lorelei,

Suffice it to say that there wasn't always a Gorean section on these boards. I actually argued (way back when) fairly vigorously against creating one for pretty much the reason you give here. I was convinced over time that the kind of discussion that you are talking about was simply not generally possible, and the good of the community was best served by the Goreans posting among themselves, for the most part, in their own section.

Yes, part of it is misunderstanding, to be sure, and when factual mis-statements are made they probably should be corrected so that they don't stand unchallenged and are presumed to be true, but part of it is simply an irreducable difference in philosophy and opinion, which just is what it is.

There are lots of reasons that people have a poor opinion of Goreans. Many of them have been stated in this thread. They aren't facts. They are someone's opinion, to which they are entitled, and don't really need to be challenged, especially when the OP asked a group of people who are most likely to have a low opinion of us what they thought of us. All I was pointing out to the Goreans posted here is that, given the OP, and where it was posted, they should not be shocked, suprised, or dismayed at the responses, or feel like they need to defend themselves. Attempts to do so will almost certainly change nobody's opinion (except maybe their opinon of our netiquitte), and run a pretty high risk of generating a lot of heat, and not much light.

_____________________________

Take care of yourself

Leonidas

(in reply to Lorelei115)

Post #: 241

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 6:48:17 AM

subrob1967

Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline

What would happen if a male submissive (myself for example) were to engage in battle with a "Master" and defeat him? Would the "Master" then become my bitch?

Honest question here, what would happen?

(in reply to Leonidas)

Post #: 242

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 7:07:13 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
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Can I watch?

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to subrob1967)

Post #: 243

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 7:07:49 AM

Lorelei115

Posts: 1933
Joined: 8/16/2006
From: Sin City
Status: offline

Well I haven't been here very long, so you may well be right. I do remember several people expressing surprise that this thread had not degenerated into a flame fest yet.

I am sorry that open discussion doesn't seem to be possible. It seems as though both sides are losing out on many people's valuable opinions and insights because of a difference in belief systems and unreasoning prejudices.

Please do know though that through yourself and others that have come here not to argue or nitpick but to speak reasonably and help shed some light on who you are and what you do, there is at least one person that has indeed changed some fundamental opinions on your lifestyle.

_____________________________

A sucessful life is not measured by what we do
But by the realization
Of who we are.

(in reply to Leonidas)

Post #: 244

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 7:19:04 AM

Leonidas

Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline

quote:

What would happen if a male submissive (myself for example) were to engage in battle with a "Master" and defeat him? Would the "Master" then become my bitch?

Honest question here, what would happen?

I guess a question can be honest and misguided at the same time. Where exactly would this fictional battle take place? The fictional planet Gor? Cleveland?

If the former, it would depend on why you were attacking a free man. If you just decided to, other free men would set upon you and kill you. If your owner commanded you to, you would obay, of course, like a good slave boy, and whatever consequences arose would probably be borne by your owner.

If it happened in Cleveland, you'd probably go to jail. It's almost like what would happen on the fictional planet Gor, except that the other free men wouldn't kill you, they'd just lock you up. Unlike on Gor "my owner told me to" probably isn't going to get you cut any slack.

Hope this helps. Good Luck.

_____________________________

Take care of yourself

Leonidas

(in reply to subrob1967)

Post #: 245

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 7:25:51 AM

gooddogbenji

Posts: 5094
Joined: 11/15/2005
From: Toronto
Status: offline

Yeah, but what about other parts of Ohio, like Akron, or Columbus?

Talk about an incomplete answer!

Yours,

benji

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Prevent global warming. Stop burning patchouli.

(in reply to Leonidas)

Post #: 246

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 8:33:31 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas

quote:

What would happen if a male submissive (myself for example) were to engage in battle with a "Master" and defeat him? Would the "Master" then become my bitch?

Honest question here, what would happen?

I guess a question can be honest and misguided at the same time. Where exactly would this fictional battle take place? The fictional planet Gor? Cleveland?

If the former, it would depend on why you were attacking a free man. If you just decided to, other free men would set upon you and kill you. If your owner commanded you to, you would obay, of course, like a good slave boy, and whatever consequences arose would probably be borne by your owner.

If it happened in Cleveland, you'd probably go to jail. It's almost like what would happen on the fictional planet Gor, except that the other free men wouldn't kill you, they'd just lock you up. Unlike on Gor "my owner told me to" probably isn't going to get you cut any slack.

Hope this helps. Good Luck.

Excellent answer.

There is fiction and there is reality; people need to separate them.

As an author of fiction I can say that I've gotten some scary emails from folks thinking I was advocating a particular dynamic or personality type because one of my stories turned them on. That's their reaction and it may not reflect my intention.

Same of the author of the Gor books. He is responsible for what he wrote; he isn't responsible for what people do with that after he's published it unless he is attempting to form a cult or social movement out of it in some active fashion.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to Leonidas)

Post #: 247

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 8:37:57 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BDSM05478

It happens here in the US too right under your nose in almost every major city.

oh...that makes it ok then.. I see.. 'never mind'

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to BDSM05478)

Post #: 248

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:00:18 AM

Stephann

Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline

Always easier to snipe, than it is to form an intelligent, informed opinion.

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"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 249

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:05:33 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger

Hmmm......

Well....I'm not a lady but after watching Nicolas Cage be tricked and then burned alive in ''The Wicker Man'', I have both a healthy and new-found respect for the Goreans.

- R

oh.. you're just no fun anymore!

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to UtopianRanger)

Post #: 250

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:10:04 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

What would happen if a male submissive (myself for example) were to engage in battle with a "Master" and defeat him? Would the "Master" then become my bitch?

Honest question here, what would happen?

He would first be turned over the the Mistresses to be feminized and taught how to lisp and flounce as to be a proper bitch to you.

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to subrob1967)

Post #: 251

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:14:24 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

Always easier to snipe, than it is to form an intelligent, informed opinion.

I've read it all.. I've listened.. oh I've been informed.. this is my opinion. I do not waste my time with fiction.

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to Stephann)

Post #: 252

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:14:44 AM

gooddogbenji

Posts: 5094
Joined: 11/15/2005
From: Toronto
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

Always easier to snipe, than it is to form an intelligent, informed opinion.

Case in point.

Yours,

benji

Edited because my fonts were fucked up

< Message edited by gooddogbenji -- 1/4/2007 9:15:30 AM >

_____________________________

Prevent global warming. Stop burning patchouli.

(in reply to Stephann)

Post #: 253

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:20:56 AM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline

Into the Beech once more

Generally slaves on Gor were not permited weapons. There were slaves trained in the same way as a Roman Gladitor, both male and female. A male slave could earn his freedom if permited to take up arms in a war.

In a match it would depend on what was at agreed upon. In some case if the match was not a Death Match, and both came out alive they would be called "Sword Brothers".

Now if you are really interested in a match I may sugguest you go to a SCA, Adria, or Renaissance Faire. We hold matches there. You are provide the gear, a real sword and an area with supervison. It not a death match but you may have some fun.

I wish you well

Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

What would happen if a male submissive (myself for example) were to engage in battle with a "Master" and defeat him? Would the "Master" then become my bitch?

Honest question here, what would happen?

_____________________________

"The love of a slave girl is the deepest and most profound love that any woman can give a man. Love makes a woman a man's slave, and the wholeness of that love requires that she be, in truth, his slave." Magicians of Gor, page 31

(in reply to subrob1967)

Post #: 254

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:23:32 AM

Leonidas

Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline

Um... Breech, Nosathro :-). Playing Henry this morning, are we? Yeah, I did read something other than a Gor book, but only once. Happy St. Crispin's day.

_____________________________

Take care of yourself

Leonidas

(in reply to Nosathro)

Post #: 255

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:32:27 AM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline

The Nicolas Cage version of the "The Wicker Man" was in my opinion was disdainful copy of the orginial with Christpher Lee. Oh and neither had anything to do with Gor.

I wish you well

Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger

quote:

ORIGINAL: KaramelGoddess

This may have been asked before...

How do you Ladies feel about the fictitious planet of Gor where women are considered less than men, and submissive men are considered less than nothing?

Hmmm......

Well....I'm not a lady but after watching Nicolas Cage be tricked and then burned alive in ''The Wicker Man'', I have both a healthy and new-found respect for the Goreans.

- R

_____________________________

"The love of a slave girl is the deepest and most profound love that any woman can give a man. Love makes a woman a man's slave, and the wholeness of that love requires that she be, in truth, his slave." Magicians of Gor, page 31

(in reply to UtopianRanger)

Post #: 256

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 9:48:24 AM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline

Well Leonidas...

You do have a point...so much for the idea of an intelligent exchange of ideas. It is interesting to note that not one Free Women Gorean posted, and I know some here on Collarme and I can understand why. It does appear that there are biased attitudes and rather than an open formum of enlightment...well..as they say.."Never try and teach a pig to sing..it waste your time and annoys the pig".

I do have friends Non Gorean in the BDSM Lifestyle who are open and respectful to my views as I am to theirs. We share with each other and have fun.

I wish you well

Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas

quote:

45 yrs ago I managed to read up thru at least part of #10 but it became obvious that John Norman had run out of plots & ideas ... and yet he kept writing! (In those days there were few books that went into BdSm other than the Marquis or Anaïs Nin & they were first banned, and then hard to find.)

Sorry, fact police here again. 45 years ago (1961), was six years before the first book would be published. The tenth book wouldn't be published until 1976. 30 years ago maybe?

To the Goreans posting here: Folks, you need to look at where you are, and realize that you're not going to do any good here. The OP asked how the Dommes here viewed Gor and Goreans. It's perfectly valid for them to state all the reasons why they don't like us, think we're wierd, bad, misguided, deluded, sexist, or even that they think we cause global warming, if they want to. Unless you see something grossly innacurate being posted, as with the above, I'd suggest you just let them have their thread. If you do see something factually false (as opposed to someone's opinion that you disagree with) correct it as succinctly and informatively as you can, if you feel you must.

_____________________________

"The love of a slave girl is the deepest and most profound love that any woman can give a man. Love makes a woman a man's slave, and the wholeness of that love requires that she be, in truth, his slave." Magicians of Gor, page 31

(in reply to Leonidas)

Post #: 257

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 10:10:22 AM

Nosathro

Posts: 3319
Joined: 9/25/2005
From: Orange County, California
Status: offline

benji

You really don't know where those cliff notes are on Gor, do you, right?

I wish you well

Nosathro

_____________________________

"The love of a slave girl is the deepest and most profound love that any woman can give a man. Love makes a woman a man's slave, and the wholeness of that love requires that she be, in truth, his slave." Magicians of Gor, page 31

(in reply to gooddogbenji)

Post #: 258

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 10:11:53 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

Well Leonidas...

You do have a point...so much for the idea of an intelligent exchange of ideas.

I take it you define intelligence as that opinion which unquestionably agrees with yours?

You may wish to take your boyish jabs back to your Gorean forum where they belong. This whole discourse has done nothing more than to solidify my original opinion of the practitioners of Gor.

And Leonidas.. what WOULD they do without you telling them how to think?

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to Nosathro)

Post #: 259

RE: How do you feel about Gor? - 1/4/2007 10:12:54 AM

SweetDommes

Posts: 3313
Joined: 10/5/2004
Status: offline

I do have to point out that my views of goreans are based on fact. It is a fact that we have been expected by r/l goreans to bow to the will of a gorean free male simply because he was a gorean free male and we are women. It is a fact that we have been looked down on by goreans - both male and female, and by free and slave. It is a fact that more than once, we have had goreans attempt to force their lifestyle choices down our throats. Yes it is my opinion that I don't like these things, but who the hell does?

It is also a fact that facts have been misrepresented by goreans in this thread (the whole "women aren't called beasts" issue, and apparently the publishing date ... although I haven't researched that one myself). So telling the goreans to stick to the facts might work best if the goreans had their facts straight themselves.

_____________________________

Miss Karen and Miss Holly

Earth is the insane asylum for the universe.

Friends are God's apology for relatives

(in reply to Nosathro)

Post #: 260

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