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RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/22/2007 8:11:07 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		Middle Ages?  Upstart!  My training can be traced back to the Minoans who trained the Romans how to deal with slaves!

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/22/2007 10:53:00 PM   
hisannabelle


Posts: 1992
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MaryT

quote:

ORIGINAL: thaimeeuppppp

If I thought i could run my own life effectively i would not want a Master.


I would not want a master who would settle for less than a self-sufficient person.

MaryT



my feelings as well.

i don't think -anyone- should get involved in a committed adult relationship unless they're capable of being financially and emotionally self-sufficient. even more so a d/s relationship...what value have i as a slave if i can't run my own life effectively? i'm more of a burden on my master than a joy in that scenario, imho.

(in reply to MaryT)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/22/2007 11:04:08 PM   
sunnydays


Posts: 116
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline 		hi all,

im sorry that my opinion was so badly  taken..that wasnt my intention. I was putting forward ( and in hindsight not very well) my thoughts on why sopme people may think BDSM was getting watered down. IMO the OP was describing a sub...and i was drawing attention to what my thoughts are on the subject...again not very well..

the single most important thing i have learnt while reading posts over the last 12 months is that there are as many ways of living this lifestyle as there are people who live it, nd therefore NO ONE can tell anyone what the rules are.. because we need to do what works for us...if a watered down BDSM relationship works for you..then i say go for it ..and smile alot along the way becasue if you are true to yourself then you cant fail.

im sorry that my comment caused probelms in this thread and i will try and be a little clearer in my responses to others..but remember..these are opinions..nothing more..nothing less

sunny

< Message edited by sunnydays -- 1/22/2007 11:07:39 PM >

(in reply to hisannabelle)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/22/2007 11:22:16 PM   
MistressYlwa


Posts: 263
Joined: 8/25/2005
Status: offline 		Watered down? Well, had a vanilla boy contact me, on CM, today. Says he can't find a woman who will take him, so he came here. Wants a woman to tell him what to do, as long as it is a vanilla relationship. He argued about this a bit, but when asked what he wanted,  was "nothing". Would "do anything" to make me happy. LOLOLOL   Anyone heard that before?

So watered down? Maybe to some. But for me, here is the same ole hard nosed witch (with a B) that I have always been. Canes up, so bend over boys. And if you can't take it, there's the door.

_____________________________

Mistress Ylwa

You see what power is - holding someone elses fear in your hand and showing it to them! - Amy Tan

(in reply to sunnydays)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/22/2007 11:32:07 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		My my, you must be very old.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Middle Ages?  Upstart!  My training can be traced back to the Minoans who trained the Romans how to deal with slaves!

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 6:18:13 AM   
CelticPrince


Posts: 3613
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline 		thai,

I agree, over the years it has become a diluted concept.

CP

(in reply to thaimeeuppppp)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 7:21:57 AM   
LaMistressa


Posts: 460
Joined: 12/4/2006
Status: offline 		This reminds me of a favorite joke:

"When did the Old Guard end? About two weeks before you joined the scene!"

I'll be here all week, tip your waiter.

(in reply to CelticPrince)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 7:24:34 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaMistressa
This reminds me of a favorite joke:

"When did the Old Guard end? About two weeks before you joined the scene!"

I'll be here all week, tip your waiter.


OOOOOO I like that!!!

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to LaMistressa)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 7:33:44 AM   
LaMistressa


Posts: 460
Joined: 12/4/2006
Status: offline 		I stole that joke from Jack McG - swipe from the best, I always say. 

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 7:47:00 AM   
crouchingtigress


Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
Status: offline 		BDSM is the same as any activity, like say bird watching, or quilting, there are folks that have a casual interest, there are folks that are have a more extreme interest and go to conventions, turn it in to a "lifestyle" ect and there are folks that whine about the way things used to be.
 
These posts are just a blatant way to go back to high school, and try to make it into the cool kids club by dissing everyone else.
 
common and sad, and really reveals more about the asker of the question then the people the question was asked about.
 
 

_____________________________


Service slut, durable plaything, and ponypenquincatdogpig, to Lee Harrington

This is him

"Its none of my buisness what other people think of me."




(in reply to LaMistressa)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 7:51:00 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline 		To the OP and others:  In the long run, it is going to come down to what works for you.  If you want a D/s relationship wherein the submissive/slave has not only the right to opinions but the right to express them...respectfully...then that is what you look for.  If you want a D/s relationship wherein the submissive has the right to her opinion, the right to express it, and the right to do so in the same manner as any other discourteous person on the street, then that is what you set up.  If you want a D/s relationship that is highly structured and where the definition of submission...yielding to the will of another...is always carried out but you can remember that yielding to your will does not mean that she will not state her opinion respectfully for your consideration...then that is what you set up.  There are all kinds of submissives out here and all kinds of dominants.  There are all sorts of levels of relationships being sought...play, casually serious, serious with no guarantee of romantic LTR, serious with inclusion of romantic relationship, etc..
Define what you want within yourself and go for it. 

I also get somewhat frustrated by what comes across as flippant answers or otherwise discourteous answers but I realize that they are not my submissive/dominant and do not have to please me.  Once I drop that view, then I can look at it from an objective view (granted that the objectivity here is colored by MY standards) of "was that discourtesy necessary?"  "Is this the way the person always comes across?" and make a decision from there as to how much I want to deal with them or what they have to say.  I never rule anything out simply because of rudeness because sometimes, even in rudely stated answers, there is something that makes sense. 

DISCLAIMER:  The above reflects my viewpoint ONLY and in not meant to imply the universally correct view***
1.  Void where prohibited
2.  No one under 18 permitted to disagree with the above.
***though perhaps it should***

(in reply to LaMistressa)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:05:30 AM   
dreamscape


Posts: 51
Joined: 4/24/2006
Status: offline 		Sorry Mary T, but I really do not think you are qualified to tell anyone that they can or can not belong.  You are certainly entitled to your opinion, as is everyone else, but it's untimately that persons decision as whether or not they belong.

(in reply to MaryT)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:07:27 AM   
dreamscape


Posts: 51
Joined: 4/24/2006
Status: offline


Sighs and goes back to lurking

< Message edited by dreamscape -- 1/23/2007 8:12:50 AM >

(in reply to dreamscape)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:11:45 AM   
SirDominic


Posts: 711
Joined: 11/22/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Having only done this for the past two years plus, I'm curious as to why wanting both a committed relationship and a bdsm relationship are mutually exclusive. My Master didn't jump through any hoops, rather he was who he was, and because he was the man he was, I decided to submit to him. I've got a long term loving relationship, and I'm a slave. Does having a long term commitment, does wanting such a commitment make one's slavery or Mastery less valid? It is far more than kink...it extends way beyond the bedroom and into the total dynamic of the relationship.


Hi darkd,
They are not mutually exclusive, and please note that I said "I get the sense that a lot of the people on here...." A lot, doesn't mean ALL. I completely agree that there are many relationships like yours that are genuine in the traditional sense of the word. There are many more, though, who do fit the profile I described. My experience of this comes from dealing with a lot of potential subs, where it quickly became obvious that they never made any attempt to learn about the lifestyle, and they really were looking for marriage.

The difference between the two, based upon my experiences, comes down to knowledge about this lifestyle. Not experience. I'm not denigrating newbies who don't know the ropes yet. I'm talking about people who have a fantasy image of what D/s is all about.

As far as the "jumping through hoops", that was an entirely different statement from the first. The two are not related. In the second example I was talking about ultra-demanding subs.

Namaste, Sir Dominic

(in reply to darksdesire)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:13:19 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		dreamscape,

If someone walked up to you and said they were a Roman, or a Russian Czar you would know they are at best silly and at worst a bit nuts.

The old guard at best were gay men, the last of whom died out in the early to late 1970s.   You can be old guard "style" just like you can wear '70s clothing and love disco but it doesn't make you actually old guard.  Its like a famous band with all new members, the names the same but it aint it.

I say that loving a lot of the stuff that came out of that era, but all to many buy a plastic dom badge and try and use it to lord it over others.  To me, they are just slightly better than the whole "european house" bdsm crap.

(in reply to dreamscape)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:18:45 AM   
dreamscape


Posts: 51
Joined: 4/24/2006
Status: offline 		Shrugs, I won't attempt to say anything about Old guard itself, because I know very  little about it. Yes, if someone told me they were a Russian Czar I would be a little alarmed,(mainly because I would know that they were bug house nuts), but Romans?  Grins....

Last time I checked, Rome was still around.  I suppose what I am trying to say, is that people are entitled to their opinion. It may be wrong to others, but hey, it's a free country, though for how long I do not know.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:20:24 AM   
LotusSong


Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Lotus,

I hate to break into your complete fantasy about old guard but I take it you haven't actually READ the fucking book, have you?

I HAVE, go order a copy and read page 27 and get back to us.  My bet is you won't bother and if you do you won't have the grace to correct yourself and apologize.


No, I didn't read "the book", I've actually talked to those who lived it or were in contact with those who knew about it.  I neither give apologizes these days, nor expect them.  I just used the block option :)
 
I'll never understand why structure and discipline upsets people so.  'Them that can do..them that can't...pass their time in telling everyone else they are wrong. 

_____________________________

Life Lesson #1

I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.


(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:31:33 AM   
SirDominic


Posts: 711
Joined: 11/22/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you, MzMia.

Mary T said: "Don't you see the connection here? "
Yeah I do see the connection, I thought that is what I was saying.

SimplyMichael, the old guard died out in the 1970's????? Gee, I'd better let my old guard friends know they don't really exist. Seriously, I don't know where you got that idea from. The old guard may be a minority in the lifestyle nowadays, but I assure you, they still exist, and it still is a lifestyle choice every bit as potent as when they were in their heydey.


Namaste, Sir Dominic

(in reply to MaryT)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 8:37:16 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		Lotus has admitted that she quoted from a book she hasn't read...

She claimed old guard didn't switch...
page 27 in my copy of The Leatherman's Handbook written when there were still living members of whatever the "old guard" was:

quote:

"When you do learn the ropes, you will learn that the difference you originally perceived is not as sharp and clear as you thought it was.  In my opinion, backed by an overwhelming majority of the leatherman whom I queried on the subject, every good leatherman has also made the scene as an M (which was what they called submissives/bottoms back then)"


It also talks about casual play, casual sex, being laid back, etc.  Clearly whomever is editing Wickopedia has another agenda than the truth, clearly something some people avoid like the plague!

(in reply to LotusSong)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: I wonder if modern day BDSM has become watered down - 1/23/2007 9:18:17 AM   
valeca


Posts: 403
Joined: 1/9/2006
Status: offline 		This might be helpful for some.

http://www.leatherarchives.org/collections/oral/larry.htm

An interview with Mr. Larry Townsend. 


_____________________________

~valeca, Owned and Operated by Loraith.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 100
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