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RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 7:54:59 AM   
KenDckey


Posts: 4121
Joined: 5/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ModeratorEleven

Settle down, children.

XI


sorry,   was just trying to get my question clarified

(in reply to ModeratorEleven)
Profile   Post #: 101
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 8:31:14 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

My thinking is that some people here were denied the right to fulfil their dream of doing roofing or picking grapefruit in south Texas.


New construction has tanked. No roofing gigs.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to caitlyn)
Profile   Post #: 102
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 8:58:23 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

Mexican slave? Spare me the drama-ramma, and we can have a civilized debate.
 
I live here. Unemployment in the RGV is virtually none. California has a different scenario. That's the beauty of the program, it allowed states to apply the law as they see fit, based on how many TWP's they allow.


caitlyn:
If we were to take the cost of a  field slave at pre civil war prices and adjust it for inflation, amortize it over the productive lifespan of the slave and add to that the cost of upkeep of the slave it would be more than what is being paid to the illegal alien field workers, thus my use of the word slave is not drama it is just economics.
thompson

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 2/11/2007 9:03:40 AM >

(in reply to caitlyn)
Profile   Post #: 103
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 9:03:11 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		People CARED if their slaves got sick. Rhetorically, "How is YOUR Company provided health coverage?"



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 104
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 9:16:17 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

People CARED if their slaves got sick. Rhetorically, "How is YOUR Company provided health coverage?"



farglebargle:
If you mean cared in the same sense that they cared about the health of their livestock you are absolutely correct. 
My health care is provided for by the VA and until bush & co. cancel or curtail any aspect of it I am reasonably secure on that front. 
I do not know if you noticed but virtually on the eve of the invasion of Iraq bush & co sought legislation to reduce veterans access to the VA but as soon as word of it leaked out it was immediately withdrawn.  I do not doubt that it will be reintroduced at a moment when they feel they can slip it through.  I found it interesting that the dems did not make an issue of it.  Which only tends to reinforce my opinion that there is little difference between the two parties and that the only thing being contested is who is incharge and not the goals.
thompson

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 105
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 12:16:37 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

What are you reading???

Im confused of what exactly your trying to say. Are you saying that illegal drugs are not coming across the border? Are you saying that illegal aliens flooding in this nation by the millions per year is a good thing? Are you saying that there are no drug cartels operating on the US-Mexican border and that they don't have weapons? Are you saying that you never read that President Bush has ordered the national guard troops on the border to never open fired even if fired upon? Again, what garbage are you reading? Because whatever it is, they are as clueless of what is going on in this nation as the Bush administration. I know people who are on the border, trust me, the situation on that border well out of control. As one sheriff in Texas put it..."It's a war zone. We've got level three body armor. They've got level four. We've got cell phones. They've got satellite cell phones that we can't tap into. And we are outgunned."

And our federal government doesn't give a damn.

http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/International/story?id=1477964

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050818/a_mexico18.art.htm

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,1136921,00.html


i have a question;  why? 

The government doesnt do anything without a reason.  What purpose would letting them in serve?  Create a situation of lawlessness maybe?  Flood the workforce? 



RealOne? Bingo!  I hope one day we will know why the government is basically doing NOTHING, if anything encouraging them.
What is the purpose here?  Creating lawlessness? Flooding the workforce? Soon Americans will have to leave the country to find jobs,
mark my words here.

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 12:27:35 PM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Soon Americans will have to leave the country to find jobs,
mark my words here.



Never mind. You can all come here. We're in the business of taking in waifs and strays. The more the merrier.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to MzMia)
Profile   Post #: 107
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 12:28:43 PM   
MzMia


Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline 		LOL Thanks NorthernGent! 

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain


What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to NorthernGent)
Profile   Post #: 108
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 12:34:14 PM   
caitlyn


Posts: 3473
Joined: 12/22/2004
Status: offline 		Thompson ... you are totally drama-ramma on this issue. Shout slave enough, and people may believe it.
 
BUT ... you know very well that the temporary or guest worker program provides for standardized wages, and gived a fiduciary responsibility to the corporation that is issued the TWP. These corporations even have to pay the employer side of the taxes on these wages ... something they aren't doing now.
 
To suggest that this program is something that supports big business, is unrealistic. Nobody wants this program to tank, more than businesses that are currently abusing the laws already on the books.
 
If you don't know these things, perhaps posting in this thread isn't a good play.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 109
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 12:43:50 PM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

LOL Thanks NorthernGent! 



A pleasure :-)

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to MzMia)
Profile   Post #: 110
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 12:44:02 PM   
wyldsubmissive


Posts: 157
Joined: 5/7/2005
Status: offline 		All right pahunkboy, you just PISSED ME THE FUCK OFF.

Look, I'm a military brat. My father and mother both served (hell Mom's STILL serving). You wanna know why they protect your dumb ass? So America can be a free country. And more then for JUST Americans.

I'm all for people coming into our country. But they have to do it legally and I will gladly move my ass over to make room for 'em.

I DO think we should have a fence. I DO think we should focus more on ourselves. HOWEVER, we have soldiers, Marines, flyboys & squids dying over in Iraq. So, for NOW we focus on where our casualties are the highest.

And he was shot in the left buttock you ass.

-One Pissed Off Wyld

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 111
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 2:43:34 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wyldsubmissive

All right pahunkboy, you just PISSED ME THE FUCK OFF.

Look, I'm a military brat. My father and mother both served (hell Mom's STILL serving). You wanna know why they protect your dumb ass? So America can be a free country. And more then for JUST Americans.

I'm all for people coming into our country. But they have to do it legally and I will gladly move my ass over to make room for 'em.

I DO think we should have a fence. I DO think we should focus more on ourselves. HOWEVER, we have soldiers, Marines, flyboys & squids dying over in Iraq. So, for NOW we focus on where our casualties are the highest.

And he was shot in the left buttock you ass.

-One Pissed Off Wyld



So you will make room for them.       I wont. I will make room for those whom stood their place in line- whom followed proper procedure.

In the grocer checkout- I dont cut in front of people. I wait my turn.

Military brat?  I commend your kin who served my country. Incedently- I come from  a family who served as well.  I prefer not to boast about it. My sister served in the Army.  I served in Americore.   Older family members were high ranking and earned metals.

Be that as it may,  WHY cant Mexico make Mexico a nice place to live?  Why?


PS- someone finally noticed my azzz!! yehaaaaaaaa! ;-0~~

(in reply to wyldsubmissive)
Profile   Post #: 112
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 2:47:05 PM   
asubmissiveheart


Posts: 462
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline 		What is the OP's topic about? I tend to forget after all this.

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 2:55:36 PM   
SCDommie


Posts: 176
Joined: 1/24/2007
Status: offline 		You all have to remember that all Mexicans are not this way.  Looks like the bad on both side came out here.  All we can do is hope and pray that we survive until George gets out.  

SCD

(in reply to KenDckey)
Profile   Post #: 114
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 3:12:42 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		I invented tampons and wrote most of the songs for Springsteen's "Born to Run" album...My grand father invented cooking oil as well as submarines.  My own father is responsible for advising Kennedy during the Cuban missile crisis...and thereby avoiding a war with the Soviets.


Many of the people who post here make ludicrous statements and then are asked  for some form of validation....and never produce it....But keep on spewing their  b.s. unquestioned.

Just stand your  backs against the wall and the one who pisses the farthest wins....I read through some of this thread...and there are some complete boneheads who participate whose logic or lack there of is simply astounding.


< Message edited by domiguy -- 2/11/2007 3:14:13 PM >

_____________________________



(in reply to SCDommie)
Profile   Post #: 115
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 3:15:19 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

These two border guards will not be pardoned no matter how much the people cry. The federal government is trying to send a message to the border patrol that if you do anything to stop the flow of drugs or illegals into the United States, you will do hard time in federal prison.
Homeland Security intentionally lied during the trial of these two guards. At least a few jurors now publically claim they were pressured to give a guilty verdict. That trial was a farce!

There are a number of congressmen, in the President's own party, that says they will call for impeachment hearings against Bush and administration officials if either of these border guards are killed in prison.


How about this one. Where is the source for this?   Please respond.

_____________________________



(in reply to cyberdude611)
Profile   Post #: 116
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 5:50:08 PM   
KenDckey


Posts: 4121
Joined: 5/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

Mexican slave? Spare me the drama-ramma, and we can have a civilized debate.
 
I live here. Unemployment in the RGV is virtually none. California has a different scenario. That's the beauty of the program, it allowed states to apply the law as they see fit, based on how many TWP's they allow.


caitlyn:
If we were to take the cost of a  field slave at pre civil war prices and adjust it for inflation, amortize it over the productive lifespan of the slave and add to that the cost of upkeep of the slave it would be more than what is being paid to the illegal alien field workers, thus my use of the word slave is not drama it is just economics.
thompson


OK   so you finally got around to answering my question.   But remember, slaves in the pre civil war period were beaten, which affected their productivity, legal,  had to work manually where now there are quite a few machines to enhance prodution, and  were restricted in what they can do.   But under the proposals of Bush, they would not be illegal, be guaranteed certain rights not granted to law breakers, and provided protections against the abuse.   How do you reconcile this in your economic slavery scenario?

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 117
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 6:00:43 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

Thompson ... you are totally drama-ramma on this issue. Shout slave enough, and people may believe it.
 
BUT ... you know very well that the temporary or guest worker program provides for standardized wages, and gived a fiduciary responsibility to the corporation that is issued the TWP. These corporations even have to pay the employer side of the taxes on these wages ... something they aren't doing now.
 
To suggest that this program is something that supports big business, is unrealistic. Nobody wants this program to tank, more than businesses that are currently abusing the laws already on the books.
 
If you don't know these things, perhaps posting in this thread isn't a good play.


caitlyn:
There was another guest worker program from the mid 40's to the mid 60's called the "Bracero" program.  It to had  promised competitive wages and took out taxes etc. fiduciary responsibility was given  to the growers.  They even took out 10% of the workers wages for a retirement program.  When it ended there was no money in the retirement fund.  The growers claim it was stolen by the mexican government but there is no paper trail from the growers to the mexican government.  This fund amounted to billions of dollars.  Now it appears they have a chance to do it again.  Why would they be against it.
By what afflatus do you know what I do or do not know?
You can call it drama all you wish but do the math.  How does my previous post fail in its assertions?
thompson 

(in reply to caitlyn)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: mad as HELL, illegals- fuming mad here! - 2/11/2007 6:07:27 PM   
KenDckey


Posts: 4121
Joined: 5/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

Thompson ... you are totally drama-ramma on this issue. Shout slave enough, and people may believe it.
 
BUT ... you know very well that the temporary or guest worker program provides for standardized wages, and gived a fiduciary responsibility to the corporation that is issued the TWP. These corporations even have to pay the employer side of the taxes on these wages ... something they aren't doing now.
 
To suggest that this program is something that supports big business, is unrealistic. Nobody wants this program to tank, more than businesses that are currently abusing the laws already on the books.
 
If you don't know these things, perhaps posting in this thread isn't a good play.


caitlyn:
There was another guest worker program from the mid 40's to the mid 60's called the "Bracero" program.  It to had  promised competitive wages and took out taxes etc. fiduciary responsibility was given  to the growers.  They even took out 10% of the workers wages for a retirement program.  When it ended there was no money in the retirement fund.  The growers claim it was stolen by the mexican government but there is no paper trail from the growers to the mexican government.  This fund amounted to billions of dollars.  Now it appears they have a chance to do it again.  Why would they be against it.
By what afflatus do you know what I do or do not know?
You can call it drama all you wish but do the math.  How does my previous post fail in its assertions?
thompson 



Hey Thompson   How about taking lessons learned to improve any new system instead of saying it failed and that is it?

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 119
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