farglebargle
Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cyberdude611
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ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
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At this point, the only win available to us, is to get out and not leave a greater mess than the one we have already created.
A lovely thought and one I once agreed with but Bush has made such a giant mess I don't see any hope. Now, how do you define not leaving a greater mess? Leaving an alienated Shia majority in charge alienated from both the Sunni and Western worlds provides a massive victory to Iran and I don't see any way around it, so leaving now isn't going to make things much worse than "later"
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one step at a time, events are playing out, as we should not just assume that those doing these bombing attacks and now chemical attacks, have unlimited resources.
They don't? Bush didn't bother sending enough troops or planning well enough to prevent the looting of Saddams massive arsenals, they have an unlimited supply of explosives. What they don't have can be supplied by Iran and Syria over massive borders we don't have the troops to patrol.
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We will have to pay whatever price needs paid, or just forget looking at ourselves in the mirror.
Can you tell me at what amount of dead young men and women, wearing a uniform you would never wear, that you are willing to "pay" so you can look yourself in the mirror? What level of taxes are you willing to pay to support this war? What level of debt are you willing to pass on as future taxes to your children? All so you can "look at yourself in the mirror".
I predicted this mess before we invaded, it isn't a mirror I have to look into. The people who hold that mirror are the Republicans who supported this war without question, who listened to the idiocy spouted by this administration tying Saddam to AQ, saying Iraq had no history of ethnic violence, that Iraq would pay for its own reconstruction, and that we would be greeting as liberators by crowds throwing flowers. THOSE people get to look in that bloodstained mirror, not I.
Bush never himself tied Saddam to Al-Queda.
You are incorrect. Given the LEGAL STANDARD:
"13. A "false" or "fraudulent" representation is one that is: (a) made with knowledge that it is untrue; (b) a half-truth; (c) made without a reasonable basis or with reckless indifference as to whether it is, in fact, true or false; or
...(d) literally true, but intentionally presented in a manner reasonably calculated to deceive a person of ordinary prudence and intelligence. The knowing concealment or omission of information that a reasonable person would consider important in deciding an issue also constitutes fraud."
The following act (N) shows otherwise.
M. On March 18, 2003, BUSH sent a letter to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and the President Pro Tempore of the Senate which asserted that further reliance on diplomatic and peaceful means alone would not either: (1) adequately protect United States national security against the "continuing threat posed by Iraq" or (2) likely lead to enforcement of all relevant UN Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq, which statement was made without reasonable basis and with reckless indifference to the truth in that, as BUSH well knew, the U.S. intelligence community had never reported that Iraq posed an urgent threat to the United States and there was no evidence whatsoever to prove that Iraq had either the means or intent to attack the U.S. directly or indirectly. The statement was also false because, as BUSH well knew, the UN weapons inspectors had not found any weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and wanted to continue the inspection process because it was working well.
N. In the same March 18, 2003 letter, BUSH also represented that taking action pursuant to the Resolution was "consistent with continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorists attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001," which statement was entirely false and without reasonable basis in that, as BUSH well knew, Iraq had no involvement with al Qaeda or the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001.
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It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.
ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים
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RE: Neocons better STFU and get to work! - 
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