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RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 7:59:02 AM

cellogrrlMK

Posts: 672
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginger21

So, I'm here. I probably won't see him for another week or two, and I all respect and trust I had for my mother is gone. I suppose it's better to use her for what I need, than try to build an honest and trustworthy relationship with her, right?

I've been watching this thread, and find it interesting how the advice being given DOES have an age difference. Ginger, I can understand your outrage at having your email looked at, that happened to me once (not my Mom though) and once someone looked at a pre-computer journal I kept. Both times I felt violated and was furious, and it ruined the relationships I had with those people. Wait, I take that back.... one of them is still my friend; while before it happened I thought of her as a sister that I never had, but we were seeing each other much more than now. Since she lives in Russia we don't get to hang out much, but we worked past what happened (there was someone else involved too, but it really has no relevance).

But I really take issue with your statement about using your mother for what you need. That is immature and selfish, as well as sounding incredibly manipulative. You think that is better than trying to rebuild a relationship with her??? That is very very sad to me.

Personally, after reading that statement maybe you should just leave now and be the adult you think you are, rather than using her to educate you so that you can have a productive life after college. Let your Dom help you out... or rather, see if he is willing to take on that kind of responsibility. 51 and you are 20? He's probably paying for his own kid's education right now if he has any. I felt some sympathy for you before you showed us how selfish you are, now I fully agree with the "old folks", Merc included. Reread fillepink's post... it is the best one in this thread, in my opinion.

quote:

She can count on me not coming home next summer.

While it might hurt her, she should count her blessings!

cello, who has no children but does have a dying 91-year-old mother and cherishes every moment I can spend with her

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 21

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 8:21:14 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

She can count on me not coming home next summer.

Maybe then your adulthood will begin.

As beth says; "the only fair that there is in life is somewhere you go in the summertime, ride rides, eat cotton candy, and go to the petting zoo."

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 22

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 9:21:33 AM

EmeraldSlave2

Posts: 3645
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cellogrrlMK
But I really take issue with your statement about using your mother for what you need. That is immature and selfish, as well as sounding incredibly manipulative. You think that is better than trying to rebuild a relationship with her??? That is very very sad to me.

Sad yes, but real.

The mother has put a clear price on her support, this price is at the cost of actual intimacy and understanding. The mother is willing to offer that price at that cost, Ginger is willing to pay the price at that cost, and I don't blame her.

(in reply to cellogrrlMK)

Post #: 23

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 9:48:36 AM

cellogrrlMK

Posts: 672
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

The mother has put a clear price on her support, this price is at the cost of actual intimacy and understanding. The mother is willing to offer that price at that cost, Ginger is willing to pay the price at that cost, and I don't blame her.

Hi Emerald,

I am not assigning any "blame" on Ginger. I am simply stating my opinion on the matter. Of course I've always had a close relationship with my mom; when I got pregnant at 18 she arranged for me to go to the hospital to "take care of it" and made up the story to tell my dad as to why I was not feeling too well. We have always been close; yeah, there were some tense times (I think that is normal in any parent/offspring relationship). It's funny, any clashes we had always turned out with her being right in the end and she NEVER said "I told you so!"

Maybe it's because of the close relationship we have had all my life that I cannot fathom the idea of Ginger's statement that she is going to stay and use her mother to pay for her education, rather than try to repair the damage in their relationship. She has a Dom 31 years her senior with whom she is having her first experience. Look at this from her mother's point of view: that big an age difference, a white guy, and as someone else pointed out, possibly seeing Ginger's "nigger whore" quote. I don't know if she is a religious woman or not, but you KNOW that all that stuff would be shocking to most people who don't have a concept of WIITWD. Hell, when Master first told me about BDSM I was somewhat ambivalent (he told me later that he was afraid I'd never want to see him again!). Ginger's mom discovered all this stuff in a bad way (snooping in Ginger's email), so it had to be more of a shock than if Ginger said anything to her about it. Unfortunately the clock cannot be turned back and the original confrontation can't be dealt with differently. Perhaps over time, if Ginger does not now act as though her mother is the cash cow paying for her education, things will settle down and they can talk about it in an adult, mature manner on BOTH sides, without yelling, screaming, and accusations. I know, I know, in a perfect world.....

This Dom most likely will not be around in even 10 years, if that long... is it worth being estranged from her mother for the rest of her life? Perhaps right now it is to her, but it would be so sad for her to look back ten years from now and regret that she has no relationship with her mother.

You have shared your experiences about this kind of thing with your posts on this thread. If Ginger wants to follow your lead it would be a good thing.

quote:

While my mom is now aware that I "date" a few people including some much older than me and is not at all comfortable about it, she accepts my position, respects my judgement and ability to take care of myself if things go wrong and I continue to show her that I respect her.

There you go. Ginger's statement shows not a whit of respect for her mother. I can only go on how I grew up, in a family where my Mom has been my role model and inspiration all my life (well, except for those times when I was being an asshole!

) To me family is first and foremost. There are not too many of us and we are spread out all over the country and don't all get together that often anymore, and my mother is now in Florida where I can't see her everyday. She is in a nursing home now, as my brother can no longer care for her at home like he did for eight months after she went down there from where we lived in New York. Ginger's nursing home comment actually offended me. My brother went to great lengths to find a good place for my mother, and while I hate it and I hate seeing her there she is in the best place she can be to live out her final days.

quote:

Years have allowed both of us to grow a bit and become comfortable with eachother as adults.

Hopefully, when Ginger becomes an adult, this will happen with her and her mother too.

Again, I think Ginger should read fillepink's post and take it to heart.

cello

< Message edited by cellogrrlMK -- 6/8/2005 9:51:54 AM >

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

Post #: 24

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 10:13:39 AM

EmeraldSlave2

Posts: 3645
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cellogrrlMK
Look at this from her mother's point of view: that big an age difference, a white guy, and as someone else pointed out, possibly seeing Ginger's "nigger whore" quote. I don't know if she is a religious woman or not, but you KNOW that all that stuff would be shocking to most people who don't have a concept of WIITWD.

Trust me I understand, as we've seen, I lived through it myself. I've not said anything about the mother being unreasonable- only closed minded. And I understand exactly why she would be.

quote:

Ginger's mom discovered all this stuff in a bad way (snooping in Ginger's email), so it had to be more of a shock than if Ginger said anything to her about it.

Well, she found out a lot more personal stuff than she knew. The mother was aware of the relationship beforehand.

quote:

Perhaps over time, if Ginger does not now act as though her mother is the cash cow paying for her education, things will settle down and they can talk about it in an adult, mature manner on BOTH sides, without yelling, screaming, and accusations.

I actually think it's pretty likely that they will, over the years, be able to be civil with eachother at the least.

quote:

This Dom most likely will not be around in even 10 years, if that long... is it worth being estranged from her mother for the rest of her life?

I don't think it will cause that sort of damage, and remembering my situation- it wasn't worth it to me which is WHY I decided to lie to my mother. I had my cake and ate it too in what I considered the best action for us all in the long term, even though it caused me considerable personal and moral conflict to lie so much to my mother.

Let's remember here- the mother is the one who caused the divide, whether she considers her actions reasonable or not.

quote:

Perhaps right now it is to her, but it would be so sad for her to look back ten years from now and regret that she has no relationship with her mother.

Assuming it is something to regret. They are both making the choices they feel are the best. Unfortunately at this stage in development they are still deeply linked emotionally and financially which complicates things.

I'm not one to think that just because someone shares biological traits with you that you owe them much. I love my family, but that's because I have gotten to know them and decide I do love them and want to be with them.

Let's think long term here- so what if she does regret it? That means at that point she can choose to try and fix it. That's the joy of long term.

quote:

You have shared your experiences about this kind of thing with your posts on this thread. If Ginger wants to follow your lead it would be a good thing.

Well I lied to my mother in order to continue to have her financial support. I thought that was what you were saying was wrong and manipulative?

NOW, years later, I can be more open with her, now that I don't need her financial support.

quote:

Ginger's nursing home comment actually offended me. My brother went to great lengths to find a good place for my mother, and while I hate it and I hate seeing her there she is in the best place she can be to live out her final days.

See it from her perspective, young, new, frenzied, just wanting to be who she's growing up to be and not really hurting anyone. Even IF her dom is the yuckiest old pervert out there, it's still consensual, she's not being abused, and there are SO many worse things that could happen to her that would potentially mess her life up (for example getting pregnant). What's being done to her isn't fair at all, and it's a very hard thing to deal with. A bit of venting and anger and nastiness on her part is to be expected.

quote:

Hopefully, when Ginger becomes an adult, this will happen with her and her mother too.

Again, I think Ginger should read fillepink's post and take it to heart.

cello

Things are rarely as dramatized as they seem to be stretched over time.

(in reply to cellogrrlMK)

Post #: 25

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 10:43:33 AM

ginger21

Posts: 173
Joined: 4/28/2005
From: Austin, Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cellogrrlMK

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginger21

So, I'm here. I probably won't see him for another week or two, and I all respect and trust I had for my mother is gone. I suppose it's better to use her for what I need, than try to build an honest and trustworthy relationship with her, right?

I've been watching this thread, and find it interesting how the advice being given DOES have an age difference. Ginger, I can understand your outrage at having your email looked at, that happened to me once (not my Mom though) and once someone looked at a pre-computer journal I kept. Both times I felt violated and was furious, and it ruined the relationships I had with those people. Wait, I take that back.... one of them is still my friend; while before it happened I thought of her as a sister that I never had, but we were seeing each other much more than now. Since she lives in Russia we don't get to hang out much, but we worked past what happened (there was someone else involved too, but it really has no relevance).

But I really take issue with your statement about using your mother for what you need. That is immature and selfish, as well as sounding incredibly manipulative. You think that is better than trying to rebuild a relationship with her??? That is very very sad to me.

Personally, after reading that statement maybe you should just leave now and be the adult you think you are, rather than using her to educate you so that you can have a productive life after college. Let your Dom help you out... or rather, see if he is willing to take on that kind of responsibility. 51 and you are 20? He's probably paying for his own kid's education right now if he has any. I felt some sympathy for you before you showed us how selfish you are, now I fully agree with the "old folks", Merc included. Reread fillepink's post... it is the best one in this thread, in my opinion.

quote:

She can count on me not coming home next summer.

While it might hurt her, she should count her blessings!

cello, who has no children but does have a dying 91-year-old mother and cherishes every moment I can spend with her

I personally take offense to this.

The tone of that part of my message was sarcastic. If you've been watching the thread, you should know that almost everyone has said that this is a financial issue and as long as I'm in her house I follow her rules.

I beg to differ.

I see it as being about trust, and building a relationship with my mother that I never had as a child. All this has brought that to a complete halt.

Hopefully, by the time my mother is 91 we can be friends, but in my heart I doubt that.

_____________________________

My Xanga!
What?
"I looked up,
and I was in your arms, and I knew that I was captured..."

(in reply to cellogrrlMK)

Post #: 26

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 11:18:28 AM

cellogrrlMK

Posts: 672
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginger21

I personally take offense to this.

The tone of that part of my message was sarcastic. If you've been watching the thread, you should know that almost everyone has said that this is a financial issue and as long as I'm in her house I follow her rules.

I beg to differ.

I see it as being about trust, and building a relationship with my mother that I never had as a child. All this has brought that to a complete halt.

Hopefully, by the time my mother is 91 we can be friends, but in my heart I doubt that.

Ginger, I am sorry to offend you. How do you beg to differ? You are not agreeing with everyone's take on this about being financial? Unfortunately, with online stuff people generally take things as what one means, not one being sarcastic, unless one identifies it that way with a wink or a smile, etc. Frankly, it didn't seem sarcastic to me at all, but that's a moot point.

I am very very sorry you and your mom have not had the treasure of the close relationship that I was blessed to experience. <sigh> It just underscores for me how lucky I have been in my life. I hope you can see that because of that I have reacted to your statements the way I have, without knowing how much or little you and your mother have experienced together over years.

I sincerely hope that you and your mother will be able to eventually reconcile your differences and salvage some form of relationship in the years to come.

Very sincerely and with no sarcasm whatsoever,

cello

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 27

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 11:20:19 AM

BlkTallFullfig

Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert

quote:

So it's not a stretch that some mother not the least bit interested in kink would freak at reading your email between you and Master whomever.

Glad you said this BTF, because I was thinking the same thing but didn't feel I was qualified to comment on that aspect of it. But I can try to imagine what would happen to mom's blood pressure if she came across comments like this that Ginger uses at the bottom of her posts:

quote:

"I adore nigger whores."

I doubt mom cares about or even sees the word "adore" in there -- the rest of it probably makes her head about to explode.

Thanks for the honest comments HappyPervert... I'm all about pointing out the elephant in the room, lol.
I don't have a daughter, but if I did, and she had Ginger's signature line, I would probably coerce her (you know, using the fact that I pay the rent and for school, lol) into therapy to make sure she loved and respected herself.
Even the word whore, outside of my bedroom makes me cringe, never mind that..M

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to happypervert)

Post #: 28

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 11:29:55 AM

ginger21

Posts: 173
Joined: 4/28/2005
From: Austin, Texas
Status: offline

Just to clarify, she doesn't pay for rent and school. I pay for that with my student loans. I need her tax info for FAFSA purposes.

_____________________________

My Xanga!
What?
"I looked up,
and I was in your arms, and I knew that I was captured..."

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)

Post #: 29

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 11:38:48 AM

cellogrrlMK

Posts: 672
Joined: 3/11/2005
Status: offline

Hi Emerald,

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

I don't think it will cause that sort of damage, and remembering my situation- it wasn't worth it to me which is WHY I decided to lie to my mother. I had my cake and ate it too in what I considered the best action for us all in the long term, even though it caused me considerable personal and moral conflict to lie so much to my mother.

But in the long run it was the best action. LOL... my mom ALWAYS knew when I was lying! Either I suck at it or she just knew me too damn well!

quote:

Let's remember here- the mother is the one who caused the divide, whether she considers her actions reasonable or not.

Oh, I'm remembering... see fillepink's post. Somehow I have the feeling the mother's reactions were triggered by what fillepink was talking about.

quote:

Assuming it is something to regret. They are both making the choices they feel are the best. Unfortunately at this stage in development they are still deeply linked emotionally and financially which complicates things.

Well, since Ginger stated that she and her mom have "never" (Ginger's word, not mine) had a close relationship, which I equate to an emotional one. Financially is Ginger's mother accepting responsibility for the education of her child; whether that is because she cares or because she wants to control her daughter is not something I know or even care to know at this point in this drama.

quote:

I'm not one to think that just because someone shares biological traits with you that you owe them much. I love my family, but that's because I have gotten to know them and decide I do love them and want to be with them.

I agree with you. I was estranged from my oldest brother for eleven years. After my mom's 90th birthday party, where all of us were together for the first time in that long, he called me and said that he realized that we are all getting older and he wanted contact with his family. So happily, we have reconciled our differences and are in touch again. The cause of the estrangement seems small now, twelve years later. Do either of us regret the time we lost communicating with one another? I think so.

quote:

Let's think long term here- so what if she does regret it? That means at that point she can choose to try and fix it. That's the joy of long term.

See above!

quote:

Well I lied to my mother in order to continue to have her financial support. I thought that was what you were saying was wrong and manipulative?

Is that the only reason you lied to her? Did you tell anyone, whether with or without sarcasm, that you were using her for her financial support? Were you that angry at your mother or did you do it because you loved her and didn't want to cause her distress, besides wanting her financial support?

quote:

NOW, years later, I can be more open with her, now that I don't need her financial support.

And do the two of you have a good relationship? Not that it's really any of my business <G> . She might be uncomfortable with your lifestyle choices, but do the two of you argue about it or does she (reluctantly?) accept those choices?

quote:

See it from her perspective, young, new, frenzied, just wanting to be who she's growing up to be and not really hurting anyone. Even IF her dom is the yuckiest old pervert out there, it's still consensual, she's not being abused, and there are SO many worse things that could happen to her that would potentially mess her life up (for example getting pregnant). What's being done to her isn't fair at all, and it's a very hard thing to deal with. A bit of venting and anger and nastiness on her part is to be expected.

I understand all that.

quote:

Things are rarely as dramatized as they seem to be stretched over time.

Oh, I know! Again, see the part about me and my brother.

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

Post #: 30

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 11:41:48 AM

ginger21

Posts: 173
Joined: 4/28/2005
From: Austin, Texas
Status: offline

quote:

Frankly, it didn't seem sarcastic to me at all, but that's a moot point.

Who would say that and mean it? C'mon.

Let me put it to y'all like this.

My ideal situation: She doesn't care. I do what I want. Not gonna happen.

My compromise: I get to see my Master still, but am willing to compromise with her as to the hours and when I gone and how long I'm gone (as we did before. She told me about a week ago that she didn't want me with him "all day" and she wanted me home by 2:30am...). I'm willing to let her place those restrictions on our relationship and some others that are within reason. Which is what she originally told me she wanted to do. (I want to stress that...even with knowledge of the things we did, she was originally willing to compromise) That way, I'm happy and I can tell her where I am, who I'm with, and let her know I'm okay. She can trust me, I can trust her and all is well (as well as it'll be anyway).

The way it is: I can't see him, lest I be disowned. Period, end of story. She's already said she knows I'm gonna see him behind her back- she's not stupid. So my question is- why can we not do this without me having to lie? She is forcing me to be manipulative, she's forcing me to be a liar...

If I do it honestly she's making me leave someone I really, really love and making me resent her, someone I also really, really love.

Fuck money and finances. I feel like she doesn't care about how I feel.

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 31

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 12:01:53 PM

perverseangelic

Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline

Question--
Claiming my -fucked- my FAFSA, how does she help yours?

I mean, my mom forced me to claime her as a supporter so she could get me as a dependant tax credit. Because I did that, it came out looking like I was getting a whole lot more money than I was (my mom doesn't support me) so I couldn't get any student loans.

Why not just become an independant? From what I've seen, based on my sisters status as only supported by my dad (less income) student aid goes -way- up the less money you claim.

Also.

Sometimes it is -better- to cut off relationships with relatives. Cello commented about feling horrible that someone made a rift between mother and daughter. Yeah, it hurts, but sometimes it's for the best. I am doing -so- much better now that I am far seperated from my mother. I love her, but I don't respect her, based on her actions and the way she treated me.

Sometimes, parents just aren't meant to get along with their kids. It -isn't- always a bad thing to be seperated from them. Especially if the parent/kid relationship is ulhealthy, abusive, and destructive. (Not saying Ginger's is. Wouldn't know. Just saying)

_____________________________

~in the begining it is always dark~

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 32

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 12:33:07 PM

Tempestspet

Posts: 360
Joined: 1/13/2005
Status: offline

Here's my 2 cents....

If you don't like the rules at home.... move out. This is the hard part:

Get a job, apply for financial aid through your school. Ask your dad for help...(if he's able to help..) look for a roomate, or find out if your school has dorms and whatnot... and live there.

Basically, you want to do it your way. The price of being an adult.... is making your own way.

There is always...always .. choice.

No one is bound, as far as I have ever seen by "having" to live with a parent, and depend on them. You always have a choice.... it's just not easy or fun.

Now here's the nicer part of what I can offer you.... I remember being 18...19... ( I got married at 19, so it stops their ..pretty much) and not liking the rules at home...wanting to do whatever I wanted, and make my own rules...I was an adult, after all. So I left home, paid rent, bills, job... the whole nine yards. My, now Master / husband, was their helping me every way he could. But at the same time, requiring that I learn to be an adult and do it myself. (And for the record....yes I'm still married to that same man... I call him Master)

This doesn't work for everyone. This worked for me.

Hope I haven't pisse off too many people..... .*smiles*

Tempest's pet
jennifer

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

Post #: 33

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 12:33:29 PM

EmeraldSlave2

Posts: 3645
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cellogrrlMK
But in the long run it was the best action. LOL... my mom ALWAYS knew when I was lying! Either I suck at it or she just knew me too damn well!

For better or worse, I am an excellent liar. That's going to haunt me the rest of my career on this forum isn't it? LOL

quote:

Is that the only reason you lied to her? Did you tell anyone, whether with or without sarcasm, that you were using her for her financial support? Were you that angry at your mother or did you do it because you loved her and didn't want to cause her distress, besides wanting her financial support?

Yes it was the only reason, the reason I FEARED she would take away support is that I had a previous relationship I HAD been honest with her about with an older man and she pretty much almost decided to take that support away.

And yes, I was honest with everyone, even her when I finally admitted to the relationship, that I had done it because I was afraid of losing that support.

Of course I did not WANT to cause her distress, but that was not the reason I lied.

quote:

And do the two of you have a good relationship? Not that it's really any of my business <G> . She might be uncomfortable with your lifestyle choices, but do the two of you argue about it or does she (reluctantly?) accept those choices?

She mothers as much as she can, we're good now even though I know she wishes she saw me more often. I assure her I'm happy and healthy and keep in touch, and she's pretty much assured with that.

And my gaining financial independence was not the only thing that helped here, living on my own for awhile, proving to myself and others that I could pay the bills, be stable, be happy, make good adult choices, all of that combined went a long way on both sides.

(in reply to cellogrrlMK)

Post #: 34

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 1:25:53 PM

ginger21

Posts: 173
Joined: 4/28/2005
From: Austin, Texas
Status: offline

quote:

Claiming my -fucked- my FAFSA, how does she help yours?

I cannot claim independence b/c I'm not 24 years old. There are a series of 5 questions or so on the FAFSA and if you answer "yes" to even one of them, you are still considered dependent on your parents' income.

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

Post #: 35

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 1:26:10 PM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

If you are living under your mothers roof and she has made a decision, then if you do not agree - then you will need to leave. It would be unfair of you to demand she accept your position under her roof.

quote:

She kept yelling that I couldn't see him and I asked her to just listen to me and she refused. She said she was getting pissed off and she didn't want to talk about it anymore...she started throwing shit and I got up to go into the living room and she followed me. I told her to back off, and that I was gonna call my father (to which she replied "Fuck your Dad!") and I walked outside to use my cell phone. She slammed the door in my face and locked it. So there I was outside, barefoot, bawling trying to find someone to talk to her. I got in contact with my father, he called her, then called me back to tell me that she had cussed him out as well, because he tried to stand up for me.

If your father is supportive, then why not move to Him? - Maybe there is a distance, but you could try and transfere. Just a thought.

quote:

She made it quite clear that this isn't about love, it isn't about her concern for my safety or well-being. It's about controlling my life. She has proven to me that her love and support for me a totally conditional and can be based solely on what I do sexually or the age and race of who I do it with (stuff she wouldn't even know if she wasn't snooping around in my email). She has successfully excluded herself from knowing anything about my future romantic relationships

quote:

Fuck money and finances. I feel like she doesn't care about how I feel.

I don't know your mother, she could be one of those complete control freak people - but my take on it is that she does care. She is concerned - maybe she just can't let go because you are growing and an adult. Her reaction to me, seems like one of panic and caring - she doesn't know this man. Shes read your words - ok that was wrong in itself - but maybe she was concerned why you are using a computer so much - shes not stupid, she has seen the news, know as well as you and the rest of us what could happen to her daughter - and then, He's white - and older - and a man who enjoys tying down her daughter and controling her. As far as mums concerned, he is an old freak trying to 'convert' her daughter into some sort of cult.

quote:

So what would you do in my situation? Would you break off the relationship with your partner to ensure you had financial support and backing for your future?

Money isn't everything, and backing for your future is something that takes time - don't make rash decisions.

quote:

and Would you break off ties with your mother to delve deeper into the BDSM lifestyle?

Who says you have to break off ties? How about using patience and time so you can enjoy both - ?

quote:

Would you try to talk to her and get her to understand and compromise?

I would try to explain, and I would be as open to her and as accepting of her as I would want her to be of me.

Your whole world has just changed. Your family found something out. Don't prove them right by panicing and making a rash decision. Show them how responsible you can be - that its your life and your decision, but that you respect their view. Keep on at them to either accept you as who you are - that the truth is, your not changing for anyone, because you have to be true to yourself. Tell her your not wanting to hurt her - get her to read some books, help her meet other submissives - most of all, introduce her to your Master - its up to him to help and support you. In truth, you shouldn't be relying on anyone else except yourself and the one you submit to. He is part of this - don't choose for him and shut him out - communicate with him and if he is worth your submission, he will be by your side throughout this whole situation.

Peace and Love

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 36

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 5:57:10 PM

Raphael

Posts: 263
Joined: 5/10/2005
Status: offline

I really think a lot of the replies here are being quite unfair to ginger.

I suspect it's not intentional, but nonetheless, I see it and it makes me cringe.

I wonder if it's just a matter of people not having the ability to feel empathy for her. Some people, a lot of people, seem to very quickly forget what it was like to be younger once they are past it. And of course it's very common, even 'normal' to ignore someone elses situation and just project your own experiences on it.

Ginger is 20 years old. She's not a child. She's a young adult. While it's easy to see why her mother would be tempted to treat her like a child, that doesn't excuse it or make it right. Her mother messed up here, big. It's now on her, if she wants to re-establish a decent relationship with her daughter, to admit that and apologise. From what ginger has posted, it doesn't sound like she's anywhere near even considering that.

I see several people essentially taking her mothers side on this. Yes, a mother *should* be loved and respected. But not just for getting pregnant and popping out a baby. There's a lot more to being a real mother than that, and from what ginger has said it doesn't look like the woman in question ever bothered with the rest of it. I think pretending a woman like that is in the same class with all the mothers that *do* stick around and really be mothers to their children is a rather dire insult to the latter group, personally.

Ginger is in a tough spot here, with no good choices. And it doesn't sound to me like she did anything wrong to put herself there. Frankly I think she needs a little support here, not a bunch of people trying to make her feel guilty for... what? What on earth has she done wrong?

(in reply to cellogrrlMK)

Post #: 37

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 6:55:22 PM

BlkTallFullfig

Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline

I just hope you stay in school and don't deal with your mother from "if you loved me, you'd accept all of this" perspective. The parent's job, as I understand it, is to love and protect you to the best of their ability (not the same as loving and accepting everything you do).

My mother is much worse than yours in terms of how much intimate and honest communication we have (not)... She loves me, but is completely clueless to relationships in general, so we definitely would not discuss kink..

I just don't want you to make life changing decisions because you're upset with your mother, and regret it later.. M

< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 6/8/2005 8:41:43 PM >

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to ginger21)

Post #: 38

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 7:48:58 PM

GoddessDustyGold

Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginger21
Just to clarify, she doesn't pay for rent and school. I pay for that with my student loans. I need her tax info for FAFSA purposes.

quoting the same line as above. I am not sure I understand this. It is not My understanding that FAFSA is dependent on a student living at home. It is dependent on the parent's financial ability whether or not that student is living at home. My own daughter works 60 hours a week while on scholarship to support herself and put herself through school. I might be a bit hazy on these regulations, so perhaps you could clarify?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raphael

I wonder if it's just a matter of people not having the ability to feel empathy for her. Some people, a lot of people, seem to very quickly forget what it was like to be younger once they are past it. And of course it's very common, even 'normal' to ignore someone elses situation and just project your own experiences on it.

Ginger is 20 years old. She's not a child. She's a young adult. While it's easy to see why her mother would be tempted to treat her like a child, that doesn't excuse it or make it right. Her mother messed up here, big. It's now on her, if she wants to re-establish a decent relationship with her daughter, to admit that and apologise. From what ginger has posted, it doesn't sound like she's anywhere near even considering that.

I see several people essentially taking her mothers side on this. Yes, a mother *should* be loved and respected. But not just for getting pregnant and popping out a baby. There's a lot more to being a real mother than that, and from what ginger has said it doesn't look like the woman in question ever bothered with the rest of it. I think pretending a woman like that is in the same class with all the mothers that *do* stick around and really be mothers to their children is a rather dire insult to the latter group, personally.

Ginger is in a tough spot here, with no good choices. And it doesn't sound to me like she did anything wrong to put herself there. Frankly I think she needs a little support here, not a bunch of people trying to make her feel guilty for... what? What on earth has she done wrong?

Yes, ginger does have choices, and they are good. They are just not the choices she wants to make. ginger needs to grow up and accept where she is in life right now, and determine where she wants to be and how she is going to get there. That takes some sacrifice.
I suspect W/we all remember what it is like to be young and rebellious. Most of U/us were probably rebellious in some way. And the old saying holds very true. "It is amazing how much my parents learned between the time I was 18 and the time I was 21!"
I can't answer for ginger, and I can only go on what she has written thus far. But she has received some excellent advice and a different perspective regarding her responsibilities and how to approach things another way. Honestly, right now, it sounds like she is throwing a major tantrum.
Yes, W/we are Mothers, some of U/us. So W/we can see both sides. And W/we do react to that tantrum tone. I think W/we have been pretty reasonable and nurturing. You are right. W/we are reacting as Mothers, not as fellow BDSM'ers. W/we can see both sides, but W/we are trying to let ginger know that she could be making a terrible mistake right now. She has choices to make. W/we have shared those choices. Now she has to choose.
It is not going to help to just tell her, "awwww, poor baby". How do you propose W/we support her, Raphael? W/we are being supportive. W/we just aren't reacting well to the tone of ginger's posts. That doesn't solve her problem. I am sorry she is in the position she is, along with everyone else. But supporting her in a childish decision to blame it all on Mom and take no responsibility for this herself is not going to help. I am not saying she deliberately did anything to throw this in her mother's face, and I am not saying her mother was right to go into her email. But it is done. It happened. Now it needs to be resolved in some sort of positive way. And the last thing any of the Moms want to see is a young girl cut off her relationship with her mother. Time enough for that later in life, if things never work out between them. And one can only hope it never comes to that.

< Message edited by GoddessDustyGold -- 6/8/2005 7:53:14 PM >

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)

Post #: 39

RE: Mommy Dearest... (grr!) - 6/8/2005 8:15:52 PM

Raphael

Posts: 263
Joined: 5/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessDustyGold

quote:

ORIGINAL: ginger21
Just to clarify, she doesn't pay for rent and school. I pay for that with my student loans. I need her tax info for FAFSA purposes.

quoting the same line as above. I am not sure I understand this. It is not My understanding that FAFSA is dependent on a student living at home. It is dependent on the parent's financial ability whether or not that student is living at home. My own daughter works 60 hours a week while on scholarship to support herself and put herself through school. I might be a bit hazy on these regulations, so perhaps you could clarify?

It's the same thing I ran into myself some years back. Under federal regulations you cannot be considered independent until the year after you turn 24. Even if you haven't spoken a word to or received a penny from your parents in years, you are still required to, somehow, come up with information off their tax forms as to their income every year, and a parental contribution (PC) is calculated based on that. You are only eligible for financial aid to cover expenses above and beyond this presumed parental contribution, whether or not your parents actually contribute a dime. And if you don't have access to the parental income tax forms... you can't even complete the form satisfactorily to submit it and apply for what you are eligible for.

quote:

Yes, ginger does have choices, and they are good.

Oh? Tell me then, what choice does she have here that is good?

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)

Post #: 40

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