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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 10:28:52 AM

MamaDomme

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Hey Latex,

Most people posting in this thread ARE real life and have far more experience than you IN REAL LIFE. It is the bullshit crap about how great dominants are supposed to be, how vital trust and communication are (without any real grasp of how healthy trust is formed or the fact that talking isn't communicating as we speak of it) and the sort of fluffy crap one reads on places like castlerealm that cause all the fucking heartbreak in our community.

I was a pillar of the bdsm community when I was an asshole with anger issues. I am not running or doing anything at the moment and am a far better person than I was before. Dominants are people, with issues, problems, and whatnot. We are not superhuman, we are not perfect, and the louder someone bleeps about how they are the noble exception, the more full of shit I tend to think they are.

LA is right, submissives often come into this thinking us dominants are the answer to their own dysfunction and they need to grow the fuck up and become mature responsible adults and deal with whatever issues they have first. The more we demand that of people, the more healthy our dysfunctional little community will become.

Thank you Michael for more fabulous comments! I love what you have said here-- I was just going to quote a couple of things but the whole damned post is so very true, IMHO.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 10:36:40 AM

Lashra

Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Hey Latex,

Most people posting in this thread ARE real life and have far more experience than you IN REAL LIFE. It is the bullshit crap about how great dominants are supposed to be, how vital trust and communication are (without any real grasp of how healthy trust is formed or the fact that talking isn't communicating as we speak of it) and the sort of fluffy crap one reads on places like castlerealm that cause all the fucking heartbreak in our community.

I was a pillar of the bdsm community when I was an asshole with anger issues. I am not running or doing anything at the moment and am a far better person than I was before. Dominants are people, with issues, problems, and whatnot. We are not superhuman, we are not perfect, and the louder someone bleeps about how they are the noble exception, the more full of shit I tend to think they are.

LA is right, submissives often come into this thinking us dominants are the answer to their own dysfunction and they need to grow the fuck up and become mature responsible adults and deal with whatever issues they have first. The more we demand that of people, the more healthy our dysfunctional little community will become.

This certainly says it all as far as I am concerned. I've been in this lifestyle since I was 19 years old and I am 44 now. I have seen more then my share of troubled Dominants with a dysfunctional sub clinging to them for dear life in the hopes they will fix them. Dominants are human beings not miracle workers or Gods and the same can be said for subs.

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 10:37:55 AM

LATEXBABY64

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yes everyone is an expert and as experince goes it is all about how you present your self anyone can talk it or read a book lets see you back up what you say after all anyone can make up anything lead by example ... ps i never beleaved in castlerealm or those other online places when i read about authors of such books as bdsm101 and other such books and alot of these did not come out till bdsm started to become popular did you ever think why humm oh well such is the way of things

< Message edited by LATEXBABY64 -- 7/31/2007 10:57:16 AM >

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 10:41:12 AM

MistressCass

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Whoa....aren't you a bold one to point out the obvious point that 9/10's of subs miss.....

Just left a thread (cuz I have waaaaay to much time on my hands this week) where someone whined about "do me" Dommes......now where do they think we are going to get the time to meet their needs if they aren't willing to wash our dishes and hang out the laundry?   Real life has to go on, even between M/s D/s couples.

I can't solve your problems. I can't read your mind. I can't undo what others have done to you.

I can listen. I can help you sort things through. I can offer advice on where I think you need to improve your way of thinking.   BUT I can't do it for you.   You are an adult, you need to do it yourself.

And when I am done sorting, advising and listening I just might need you to do the same for me.   Cuz I am human and have needs beyond what is at the jucture of my legs.

And while we're on the subject of growing up and acting like an adult......how about actually LISTENING to what is being said to you before you beg to be allowed to "serve" me.   A LOT of your disillusionment would not happen if you listened to what is being said before you jumped headlong into a relationship where you are being told "I DON" T DO THAT".....hoping I will change my mind once I see how "good" you are .....cuz Dom/mes are people too and are allowed to have limits.   No matter how silly those limits may seem to you.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 10:59:19 AM

heartfeltsub

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Allow me please to introduce you to a new term, punctuation. Maybe you might have already heard of it.

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Life is an exciting business, and most exciting when it is lived for others.

Life is a succession of lessons which must be lived to be understood.

Life is either a great adventure or nothing.

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50 NZ points

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 10:59:37 AM

sleazybutterfly

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When I first started out, I think somewhere in my mind having a dominant would make my life easier. He would be strong, smart, and take care of me (which no one else had). I found I put them on pedestal and allowed myself to be way too trusting. I suppose even though I had been submissive in my life, I put too much stock in reading bdsm websites about how the helpless sub/slave was helped to be everything she was by the big wonderful dom. I was lost in my life at the time, been hurt time and time again by people, I was looking for someone to save me from all of that.

You can imagine that got me into a heap of shit.

I then met these men in person, some good and some bad. Even after that I would see things that I really ignored. I wanted them to be what I thought they should be, or was taught they should be. After a lot of long lessons and getting hurt time and time again, I realized that I was searching for an ideal that didn't exist. I was looking for someone to take all of the pain away, to make my life better in some way.

It's then that I realized that no one can do that. You have to dig into yourself and find the strength to fix things. There is no magic dom wand that will come along and make all of the hurt better, or your life easier. If you don't fix what's on the inside first, you will be finding those that take advantage of that part of you, claiming to have all of the answers. We find what we put out there, what our mind looks for. There are usually patterns, even when we choose not to look.

It was after I started dealing with my past and looking for the answers someplace besides a man, that I found myself able to enter into a healthy and very loving relationship. He is not perfect, but I love him just the same. He has not fixed me, though he supports me in going to therapy and helps me to never forget I am worth the world to him. We have our own fights in life ahead of us, those are things I must learn to be strong for. His health is not the best and no one knows what will be held in years down the road. I know that I am getting stronger, he did not do this, but he allowed me to see I could do things I set my mind to. See, he wasn't the answer...he was just a way to get to it, for me. I know that I will handle with dignity and strength anything that life throws at me. That is a gift he gave me. He did not give it because he was a dom, he did not give it because he was a man, he gave and is continuing to give it to me by watching his struggle, his determination, and his strength every single day. I know that he needs me, and will continue to need me more with each passing year.

If I had not found out what I was made of before we met, I don't know that I would be able to face things I must. It's that quiet strength I believe he loves about me, it's that I am strong enough to be there for him, that I will be here to face whatever the future holds.

If you go in expecting to be fixed, you will be letdown. If you go in with a good head on your shoulders thinking you might find someone that believes in you and will help you discover things about yourself, you just might find it. That has nothing to do with the dom, he is not a prince. It has to do with the person in the dom hat, not the title itself. That is something that cannot come with a name, but rather with proof in the way he lives his life, the way he treats his loved ones, and the love and respect he has for you, and himself.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 11:11:08 AM

Lordandmaster

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Some doms are human. But a few of us are evil ogres.

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 11:33:41 AM

CreativeDominant

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Count me in as being in agreement with you, Simply Michael, Cass...

I've already raised two ums of my own...I do not need to take an adult to raise. If you want to benefit from whatever I have learned in 52 years of life, 24 years of taking care of patients, 10 years of being a dominant, and a fairly good I.Q., then listen. If you just want to whine and have me fix it all...go see a therapist. I am not your therapist, I am your dominant...and there is a biggggggggggggg difference.

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 11:40:35 AM

WhiplashSmile

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This is something I try to make clear as Hell to anybody, I am human and I have my own set of issue, faults and flaws. I'm simply perfectly imperfect. There are good and bad qualities in every human being.

Sure, I love to tie up naked girlie girls, spank their ass, pull their hair, call them dirty names and have my pervy ways with 'em. I get off and enjoy telling them exactly how to use their mouth and tounge. Enjoy telling them what positions I want them in and when.

It bothers me that some submissives out there look at us DOMs as if we like "Jesus Christ", expecting us to be the perfect salvation for their own fucked up crappy life.

< Message edited by WhiplashSmile -- 7/31/2007 11:58:50 AM >

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:05:34 PM

GhitaAmati

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quote:

ORIGINAL: earthycouple

I'm adding to the standing O! Nicely said.

Very hard to stand during an O

-----

LA, well said! I too have noticed a theme..."Doms are supposed to...(add strange opinion here)"

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:08:24 PM

subnaturale

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isn't it human nature to blame the other when a relationship crashes and burns??? it's not just newbies & not just subs that have unrealistic ideals or expectations....

If O/one is not responsible, then why are Y/you playing around in the lifestyle anyway?? that is suicidal, isn't it?

take the true meaning of the lifestyle: embrace it passionately in its full circle... heart, mind, soul and body....only then will the journey be revealed.

my Sir has told me that if i fail He is at fault.. if i grow and succeed, He gets some of the credit.... everything i do reflects on Him... He is not perfect, He is human.. He will make mistakes...just Him telling me those things have humbled me in so many ways....i, on the other hand, know that is my responsibility to be obedient, and loyal to Him.

Trust is the first stone of a strong lifetime foundation, without that there is nothing.

(in reply to LATEXBABY64)

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RE: Dom's are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:15:08 PM

MagiksSlave

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64
the reason that happens is Dom's are suppose to be leaders, educators, and guides and to help a submissive on their life journey. media hypes a lot of this so you have the balloon effect of a idealism of what they are. do they also step up to the plate no not always.. but they do need to do what they say and a sub needs to do this to a ying and yang balance it has to be only then will they find righteous good things..

Thank you for supporting the baseless dogmatic drivel that keeps the false dream alive. Doms aren't SUPPOSED to be anything other than what they say they will be. And most of the clueless subs admit they knew very well what the dom was and ignored it, or they rushed in before they could make anything close to an informed choice.

First off LA great thread, but this lil bit is what I want to focus on....

Exactly LA a Dom is not SUPPOSED to be anything... in fact in many M/s relationships the sub teaches the Dom as much as the Dom teaches the sub, what LATEX is saying is still a very romantisiszed view of what a Dom is to be. The truth is a Dom is what ever the 2 involved in the relationship deside that Dom is going to be. Weather it is TPE relationship where the Dom makes all the desision to the other extreme where the Dom is simply a life support systom for the flogger..

A Dom needent be a leader, or a teacher (these things dont hurt but none of these things does a Dom make) He needent be an educator, last I checked Both parties educated eachother in different ways, he needent help the submissive trough her life journey (this so plays into the sub=poor helpless child like person that needs someone constantly watching over and telling them what to do) again last I checked both Dom and sub helped the other through lifes journey, like you said the yin yang thing they both help and complete eachother, The Dom is doing nothing in that area that the sub isnt also doing. meaning the Dom doesnt complete the sub more then the sub completes the Dom, and seeing what you wrote it sounds as if you think the Dom does complete the sub more then the sub completes the Dom....

ms

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:16:46 PM

DiurnalVampire

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I have no desire to be someone's out for the responsabilities of life. Wether or not they become my responsability later on in our relationship, as is the plan or Angel, he has proven that right now he ca handle himself well enough. I am quite human, I have faults and problems. I have been contacted by slaves that wanted to escape life and become my pets. Life with a Dominant should not be an escape. You cannot simply disappear from the world and let your Dominant take over everything.
Relationships crash and burn, and its becasue 2 people didnt work wel. Regardless of if one was a Dom and the other a sub, if one was male and the other female... sometimes it just doesnt work. That doesnt make someone a bad sub or a bad Dom, it just makes them incompatible together.

DV

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I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

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If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:32:54 PM

WhiplashSmile

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If somebody wants to use me for a way out in life, it damn well better be a full 24/7 TPE Master/slave no/low limits relationship with the understanding, it will be both heaven and hell, 100% my way regardless of what baggage or issues they have.  Oh come on, it's not like they would be selling their soul to the devil or anything. LOL...

Besides, instead of telling somebody to stick a sock in it, I'd just pull out the ball gag and use it on 'em. Like any proper heartless sadistic owner would, I'd flogging take their mind off from whatever issues they are having. (wicked evil laugh).

Now what was all this talk about Doms having to be nuturing, teachers, guides and leaders? Some sub/slaves personalities crave and respond better to mean, sadistic, hardass, strict domly types better.

Just thought I'd flip a coin over, and show another side or way at looking at things.   Call me the devils advocate for the day.

< Message edited by WhiplashSmile -- 7/31/2007 12:49:32 PM >

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:34:12 PM

LotusSong

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Missokyst

Sometimes it seems like people use Ds to get out of taking personal responsibility.

I agree. Too many come here to lay their baggage on another to "get fixed". For some it's a lifestyle, for others it's an excuse.

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I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:40:01 PM

MagiksSlave

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile

If somebody wants to use me for a way out in life, it damn well better be a full 24/7 TPE Master/slave no/low limits relationship with the understanding, it will be both heaven and hell, 100% my way. LOL... Oh come on, it's not like they would be selling thier soul to the devil or anyhing.. LOL..

((giggles n hugs the Smiley one))

Hey hon where did your profile go I went to try and send you a message and it said no profile found!!

ms

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.

-Rodney Atkins-

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:44:28 PM

julietsierra

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Thanks LA for stating the obvious (or rather what SHOULD be obvious) to what more and more seems to be those who are oblivious. Between the "He did this horrible/horrendous thing to me, and it's not fair...uh...do you think I should leave?!" posts and the "I'm such a wonderful person he owes me," posts, not to mention the "I'm the submissive and he should do what I say because I'm giving that wonderful gift of submission and my submission, along with my vagina is golden" posts, it is continually more and more clear to me that common sense is just not that common. OH! That just reminded me of the posts that claim "I'm the submissive and the asshole had better darn well respect me!!" posts. I like those too.When common sense isn't that common, personal responsibility is usually the vehicle that common sense vacated the premesis on.

From what I'm seeing, it isn't simply people forgetting to be personally responsible for themselves. It's people understanding that they have a responsibility and actively abdicating what they're supposed to do in favor of putting it all on the dominant's shoulders. And for some ungodly reason, that's supposed to be submission.

And I just do not get it.

juliet

< Message edited by julietsierra -- 7/31/2007 12:47:54 PM >

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:44:31 PM

subnaturale

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhiplashSmile

Oh come on, it's not like they would be selling thier soul to the devil or anyhing.. LOL..

are You positively, absolutely sure about that????????????

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RE: Doms are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:46:10 PM

SusanofO

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I draw a distiction between people who want to be genuine friends with the person they are "subbing" or Domming" to, and people who want or seem to need a more "impersonal" D/s encounter or relationship. I don't see anything wrong, really with either one - but I know I've observed people who seem to have a very impersonal (or at least less than what I'd consider "mostly "warm") general way of relating to their subs (and even their Dom/Dommes). It doesn't "work" for me, but I guess some people do it that way.

But I do think there is a built in presumption for some people, that everyone in a D/s relationship is in a life-long (or hoped to be life-long) kind of romantic situation, even to the exclusion of what I consider to be real D/s (not that "real" D/s isn't "romantic" - but - there are probably going to be one or two things a submissive might have to end up doing, that they plain just don't appreciate, or think are necessary, or want to do.) Hmmm - it even sounds like "Vanilla" life and D/s really have more in common than appears at first glance - in that regard, anyway, hehe.

Couple this belief with the expectation some seem to have, that that a Dom/me is going to remove all of the "hard parts" (as far as taking responsibility for - whatever) in a submissive's life - and it can be setting oneself up for trouble. From what I've read, built in life-long "romance", and removal of thinking about having to take personal responsibility for even sometimes more "major" life decisions - isn't always removed for a submssive, just because someone is a submissive - and beacuse they now have a Dom/me. From what I've read, this scenario is definitely not always the case.

*Because, IMO, A submissive still is going to have to live with their decisions - even if they truly believe their only "decision" is to hand over decision-making responsibility for "everything" to someone else.

Sometimes, the BDSM actvity is exclusively in the "bedroom". For others, it's D/s interaction all the time, etc. I guess expectations do depend though, on the two involved (and everyone's relationship is different, of course).

I do agree with LA, that people should examine their expectations of a D/s relationship. Most Dom/mes I've read about whom I consider responsible advocate doing this, even before a relationship starts; it's sort of something I consider part of the entire "get to know you" process" - but there are still people who are secretly hoping for things that might never happen, I guess (this isn't that uncommon in "Vanilla" life either, IMO).

*Btw - I think in a D/s relationship, expecting auto-"romance", to the major exclusion of real D/s (and an expectation of obedience as the primary operative expectation) can probably also seem "impersonal" - to the partner who is expecting more real D/s, and less "fluffy romance" (that might not make sense to some, but it does to me). So it's probably not just the submissive who is "disappointed" in these case where "romance" OR real D/s interaction (based on a presumption of a submissive's obedience) one to the exclusion of the other - seems to be the expectation.

But in any case - if there's a problem, then I say talk it over with your partner.

In a less "personal" or "warm" D/s relationship, I can see how interactions between Dom/me and sub might truly work as just a general part of their established "dynamic", and their expectaitons of eachother might be very rigidly defined, with a lot less talking it over or need felt for "discussion" about the relationship (ever, expect maybe one time, orsomething). *But I think expecting D/s to be automatically more about "romance" than its about, well, D/s -is probably setting oneself up for disappointment. Personally, I prefer to mix the two together, and it sort of seems to happen naturally.

*Bottom line - It's still about two people establishing a relationship ("impersonal" or "warm and fuzzy") - and that takes time. Unless we are referring to simple, one time encounters or "scening" with someone once, or something, IMO (and even then, except for one time I can remember, personally I always prefer to really know (and like) the person I am "scening" with).

Like I said before, completely impersonal wouldn't ever work for me, but I can see it, if that's what some people want, then...

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 7/31/2007 1:46:14 PM >

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And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

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RE: Dom's are people, too. Wise up already subs. - 7/31/2007 12:51:37 PM

LATEXBABY64

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one thing is very true each person must be in control of their life before they bring anything to the table.. sub, Dom, domme or slave or what ever.. out of control people only get lost in the muck of stupidity of assumptions and the informational complexity of what is out there... to thine own self be true ...have your ducks in row before you take on anyone or get involved with anyone

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