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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:34:59 AM   
FullCircle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
Anyway, back to the police state: how do you define a police state?


That’s an easy distinction for me: in a police state everyone serves the government in a democracy the government serves you. Call me old fashioned but I like it when the government doesn’t tell me I should live this way to cut down on their costs.



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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:40:06 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		So NG - you mean some sort of Grand Council then?

But this leads us into the issues of how they get elected - by way of the greasy pole of media manipulation and corporate sponsorship, and also into the issue that having acquired a mandate they are just as entitled to govern as the government is.

I can see a solution whereby we dispose of the idea of head of state altogether and have a written constitution which occupies that position, but any person or persons occupying the position just leads us into issues however they get there.

E

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:41:26 AM   
seeksfemslave


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Joined: 6/16/2006
Status: offline 		Police State:
By definition will be run by a dictatator who brooks no opposition or serious debate.
She will setup up various levels of policing activity, many  of them secret  and armed to the teeth.

Various police factions will be used for surveillance of those areas where opposition is likely to arise. say a university. If necessary brutal physical reprisals will be applied including killing. None of this will be reported. There will be no independant judicial review of such things since no independant judiciary will exist.

All media outlets will be ruthlessly controlled and censured. Only the government view will be broadcast.
Insult the great leaderene and you will end up in prison and stay there for a long time.

Finally and most important a fence will be built around Manchester and Liverpool to keep the bolshie sods under control.

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:44:29 AM   
LadyEllen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Police State:
By definition will be run by a dictatator who brooks no opposition or serious debate.
She will setup up various levels of policing activity, many  of them secret  and armed to the teeth.



I cant decide whether your use of "she" here is an effort at PC inclusiveness Seeks, or whether you already recognise me as Fuehrerin?

E

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:47:19 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		 lady E, I always enjoy your post. Maybe 12 folks here are posters I enjoy.

My guess is he meant it to be PC. It can be hard to know when to say what. Tho I hold doors open for others....

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:47:47 AM   
seeksfemslave


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Status: offline 		I actually have a sub streak LadyE: so you decide.
Is there any Rugby on the tele. ?
Yes . South Africa have just defeated Fiji.

Blimey a World Series with teams from all over the World lol


< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 10/7/2007 7:51:40 AM >

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:50:47 AM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

But this leads us into the issues of how they get elected - by way of the greasy pole of media manipulation and corporate sponsorship, and also into the issue that having acquired a mandate they are just as entitled to govern as the government is.



The first issue to resolve is making the democratic process attractive to the population; one method is to provide genuine representation, i.e. all of our officials are elected, we have a chance to vote for them. They seem to have grasped this concept in Germany, in the US, in France and in most of the developed world: we're the most watched people in the developed world and we don't elect all of our officials, maybe there's a correlation there.

Once the principle is sorted out, i.e. the will exists, then it's easy enough to build a system around the principle.

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:50:59 AM   
FullCircle


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Status: offline 		On the issue of the monarchy I’ve never understood how you have to replace it with something if you just get rid of it. Maybe someone could enlighten me but as she only acts as a rubber stamp does it really matter? More important for me is the issue with the House of Lords and how a non elected body can continually force the government to use the parliament act. The idea I have for the House of Lords is non-elected body made up from the heads of professional bodies; because we have plenty of those. It is the perfect solution because they aren’t elected and so don’t over right the primacy of the House of Commons and they are people that can see how laws proposed could affect everyday organisations and groups of individuals. The House of Lords has a contingent made up from members of the C of E but what other popular religions get a look in? So I also propose that religious representation within the House of Lords should be based on the last census as to the actual religious representation of this country.

Will it happen? Noooooooooooooooooooo.

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:52:59 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Police State:
By definition will be run by a dictatator who brooks no opposition or serious debate.
She will setup up various levels of policing activity, many  of them secret  and armed to the teeth.

Various police factions will be used for surveillance of those areas where opposition is likely to arise. say a university. If necessary brutal physical reprisals will be applied including killing. None of this will be reported. There will be no independant judicial review of such things since no independant judiciary will exist.

All media outlets will be ruthlessly controlled and censured. Only the government view will be broadcast.
Insult the great leaderene and you will end up in prison and stay there for a long time.

Finally and most important a fence will be built around Manchester and Liverpool to keep the bolshie sods under control.


Holy cow- this sounds like bushes America! [bush is not capitalized on purpose]

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 7:55:02 AM   
LadyEllen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

I actually have a sub streak LadyE: so you decide.
Is there any Rugby on the tele. ?


Well, I'm more than qualified - I speak German badly, rant and rave fairly frequently, own several pairs of shiny boots and like the idea of a house on a mountain. On the negative side though, I just cant go with armbands you know? So 1930s.

When I'm running the country, rugby will be banned.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:01:21 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		On this note: consider this. The ruling elite will take their dreadful  social experiments- that "worked" in other countries and bring em on home for discovery. [heckle heckle]

The Social Security debate. Lucky for us- it [doesn't] [work] in Argentina. As we stiffled it. [this time]

Privatization of water. Another social experiment....

The war on terrror- how conveninet. A war that can never end.
--> It is the war on crime tenfold. A huge score for the ruling elite to control the masses.

The global wealthy 1% rule the world. NOT the USA. They cloak their interests as "freedom" "democracy" and the like.

The government is nonrepresentittive of the masses- they are bought and paid for by the 1%.

If America melted into total anarchy- the 1% would be out of here so fast it wouldnt be funny.

The allegience they hold is to the money- and nothing else. No flag, no people. It is bullshtt.

THINK!

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:03:21 AM   
susie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

I actually have a sub streak LadyE: so you decide.
Is there any Rugby on the tele. ?


Well, I'm more than qualified - I speak German badly, rant and rave fairly frequently, own several pairs of shiny boots and like the idea of a house on a mountain. On the negative side though, I just cant go with armbands you know? So 1930s.

When I'm running the country, rugby will be banned.

E


You have my vote then. Could you ban football too???

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:03:38 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Yes FC - I think along the same lines as regards the lords - it needs to be appointed rather than elected, and it needs to be comprised of people who can analyse the effects of planned legislation, not political favourites chosen by the prime minister or political has beens from the commons. Also if there are to be religions represented, then all religions must be represented and the link between the CofE and government be broken forever.

The census forms as a means of doing this however are not a good idea, seeing as how we have so few Jedis after the last census, to place sufficient representation for this religion in the lords.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:05:25 AM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Police State:
By definition will be run by a dictatator who brooks no opposition or serious debate.



No, not exclusive to a dictator.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

She will setup up various levels of policing activity, many  of them secret  and armed to the teeth.



The queen? True enough: those corgis will give you a nasty nip.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Various police factions will be used for surveillance of those areas where opposition is likely to arise. say a university.



Yes, we have this: CCTV, Stop and Search laws. Next time there's an anti-war protest, get yourself along and watch the police in action.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

If necessary brutal physical reprisals will be applied including killing.



Yes, during the Poll Tax riots the police cracked more than a few skulls; the same goes for most demonstrations involving environmentalists etc.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

None of this will be reported. There will be no independant judicial review of such things since no independant judiciary will exist.



You have to dig deep for the information, but it won't be reported in the mainstream press. There will be no review of police action.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

All media outlets will be ruthlessly controlled and censured. Only the government view will be broadcast.



Yeah, this doesn't apply, but we don't get a balanced picture.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Insult the great leaderene and you will end up in prison and stay there for a long time.



Or heckle at conferences and you will be thrown out. Not quite on the same scale, granted.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Finally and most important a fence will be built around Manchester and Liverpool to keep the bolshie sods under control.



'Problem is Seeks, cut us off and the country loses its pair of bollocks........."'nothing but lapdogs to a slip of a girl" (if you've ever watched Blackadder, you'll get this).

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:06:46 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Sorry Susie, football is far too important as a means of controlling the masses for it to be banned.

Rugby is going because its mainly followed by and played by those capable of inciting dissent and executing rebellion - people whom I shall be taking a personal interest in as glorious leader. Its also a stupid game, but thats by the by.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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Profile   Post #: 55
RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:07:07 AM   
FullCircle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
The census forms as a means of doing this however are not a good idea, seeing as how we have so few Jedis after the last census, to place sufficient representation for this religion in the lords.

E


Yeah but wouldn’t it be cool to see a few Jedis in power. Maybe then we’ll take the census more seriously. I’m not sure how often we have them but it should be often enough so that no one has a gravy train.

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:09:31 AM   
FatherMayi


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Joined: 6/8/2007
Status: offline 		"for the people, by the people" ... what a classic saying but hardly relevent in this day and age when all your local MP stands for is the lining of his/her own pocket with your hard-earned money
 
the late and great comic Kenny Everitt had the right idea with one of characters he created, who's favorite saying was "round em up, put em in a field and bomb the b$%^!^%'s!"
 Oh come on! don't ban rugby ... after all it's just a group of men playing with funny shaped balls


< Message edited by FatherMayi -- 10/7/2007 8:12:59 AM >

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:15:05 AM   
pahunkboy


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Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		On silencing disent.
My brother was a small mom and pops car dealer in Chicago. He was fine as long as he did not cut into the real car dealer profits. When he got to big- he was stopped. All kinds of red tape things were happening. Eventually a criminal charge ensued. So he stopped.
Apply this same logic to todays world. Washington is owned by lobbyists.  An army of lawyers who change the rules as we go, all in the houses favor. The house always wins. Indeed the world is coerced to dance to Washingtons "rules".
If a person or a group, a country can be a group; gets too much real power; 1st red tape will happen. If that fails, criminal charges will ensue.  Same theory.

See?

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:19:28 AM   
pahunkboy


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Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		A year or so back A huge protest happened in Washington. Try not to gasp when I tell you it wasnt televised.

My buddy and I wanted to see it with our own eyes. S0000000000000000000000, I googled street cams DC; we watched a good portion of the march via street cam.

So in that instance the peon won.    :-0     1 point for peons.  score 1 zillion house, 2 peons

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RE: UK Already a Police State? - 10/7/2007 8:26:44 AM   
FullCircle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy
My buddy and I wanted to see it with our own eyes. S0000000000000000000000, I googled street cams DC; we watched a good portion of the march via street cam.


The Google street level camera’s is a big invasion of privacy in some cases as people have had their images put on the internet for doing stupid things or being caught in embarrassing situations. I’m surprised more people haven’t made a fuss about this.

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