RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited

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RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 10:40:03 AM

laurell3

Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
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The problem with this is like the problem with criticising one religion based on a certain parish. I don't find it to be the case here, where I live. It might be the case in California where you live. Honestly here cops with crappy attitudes don't last long with the exception of one department and it's coming under much criticism now so I'm waiting to see if that changes.
However, it takes a certain amount of detachment to deal with people at their worst. Whether it's trained or not, it does happen. Attending brutal murder scenes, notifying families of a loved ones death over and over...these things require some detachment to continue doing them.
In addition, dealing with people that are difficult actually requires some detachment in order to not respond personally to their issues.
I certainly agree there are law enforcement out there that are burnt out and need to step down.
I do not agree that all law enforcement are insensitive and have found personally where I am that is very much not the case.
l

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 21

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 10:42:46 AM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

quote:

come on obviously you see a badge and think I don't respect that person...not even knowing anything about them.

When you don't know anything about a strange dog you find running around in the park, do you trust they aren't rabid?

Do flashing lights and what appear to be a proper badge just shut your brain down?

How many people have been raped and assaulted by people Impersonating Officers? I don't know the exact number this year, but we've all read it in the papers.

Fake cops are enough of an issue so that it's a special crime to Impersonate an officer.

Look, if the point of a Cop having a pistol is to defend them against any random crazy person, what exactly protects YOU from any random crazy cop?

Remember this dialog from The Hunt for Red October?

Capt. Vasili Borodin: I will live in Montana. And I will marry a round American woman and raise rabbits, and she will cook them for me. And I will have a pickup truck... maybe even a "recreational vehicle." And drive from state to state. Do they let you do that?
Captain Ramius: I suppose.
Capt. Vasili Borodin: No papers?
Captain Ramius: No papers, state to state.
Capt. Vasili Borodin: Well then, in winter I will live in... Arizona. Actually, I think I will need two wives.
Captain Ramius: Oh, at least.

What exactly keeps the Cops from setting up a checkpoint at the State Border and refusing your travel?

Remember when you could just get on an airplane 5 minutes before they closed the door? And you could bring a bottle of water and a sandwich with you? And a swiss army knife? And, you know, your own shit, without being hassled, BEFORE your name is checked against the No-Fly List to see if you're PERMITTED to board.

Don't tell me "It can't happen here". It already did.

< Message edited by farglebargle -- 10/26/2007 10:43:43 AM >

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 22

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 10:56:52 AM

joanus

Posts: 527
Joined: 2/28/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Look, if the point of a Cop having a pistol is to defend them against any random crazy person, what exactly protects YOU from any random crazy cop?

Um how about the fact that my gun is bigger and I can use it better than he can?

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 23

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 10:58:55 AM

laurell3

Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline

I didn't say it can't happen here. I'm done, we have very different experiences and outlooks. Yours is equally as valid to you as mine is to me. Let's leave it at that.
l

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 24

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 10:58:56 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

The problem with this is like the problem with criticising one religion based on a certain parish. I don't find it to be the case here, where I live. It might be the case in California where you live. Honestly here cops with crappy attitudes don't last long with the exception of one department and it's coming under much criticism now so I'm waiting to see if that changes.
However, it takes a certain amount of detachment to deal with people at their worst. Whether it's trained or not, it does happen. Attending brutal murder scenes, notifying families of a loved ones death over and over...these things require some detachment to continue doing them.
In addition, dealing with people that are difficult actually requires some detachment in order to not respond personally to their issues.
I certainly agree there are law enforcement out there that are burnt out and need to step down.
I do not agree that all law enforcement are insensitive and have found personally where I am that is very much not the case.
l

New Orleans, New York, and Los Angeles have all been found to have cop cultures that needed serious remediation. I have to say that your view of your law inforcement may or may not be rooted in reality... I do not know. I do know that there are certain mechanisms that cause systemic problems. Your opinion would probably be very different if you lived in Florida.

A few years ago Florida hosted a trade summit ( I believe it was CAFTA). They spent millions on outfitting local cops in Miami area and others as well with riot gear and training with non lethal weaponry. That training was under much criticism because of the dehumanization of individuals that it promotes.

FB is right, cops are under a higher standard than the rest of us, and if they do not like it they should turn in their badges.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to laurell3)

Post #: 25

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 11:09:34 AM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

quote:

Not to mention that if I were a cop I would probably be tempted to use these measures when inappropriate

Thank you for being honest.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 26

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 11:22:09 AM

kingdom69

Posts: 10
Joined: 4/20/2004
Status: offline

Something that everyone has forgotten, including the police it seems. Tasers (and aother equipment like it) were meant to replace pistols so that criminals could be taken down unharmed. Almost all police agencies indicated that they would only be used in the same type of situation where a pistol would and could be used to assist in not killing the suspect. It certainly doesn't sound like this has become the norm. Tasers can, have been known to, and will kill people, just as assuredly as a pistol will. My question is now, Would you have pulled out a gun and shot the student because he asked too many questions? I doubt it. The individuals who did this, and all like them, should be relieved of thier duties and never allowed to be in any type of security force again.

(in reply to Alumbrado)

Post #: 27

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 12:45:17 PM

CollegeConundrum

Posts: 322
Joined: 5/18/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: lazarus1983

Nooooo...the campus police are not affiliated with the state. At best, they're deputized by the sheriff of whatever county that college is in.

Where did you get that information from?
As far as I know, county sheriffs have nothing to do with running the state university system. Part of FDLE's job is certification of all LEOs, including campus police, and they are the oversight agency, making them most likely to conduct an initial investigation..

Federal law did away with the old 'Kampus Kop' model decades ago, so if they aren't POST certified, they are probably campus security, not police.

The guy's half right.

They're "deputized" by the PD or SD, whoever is responsible for overseeing the campus police. I think, I'm not sure, it's contracted out by the college.

I don't know about the certification but most campus police are simply "security" officers, as described in the post above, being overseen by "real" LEOs. Therefore, most campus police aren't allowed to make an arrest or carry firearms, I'm not even sure they can detain you but they can report you and the cops will pick you up later, if it's necessary.

(in reply to Alumbrado)

Post #: 28

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 1:23:19 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

Ok completely way off topic here but Level have you changed the title of thid thread?
I am nearly positive that when i read it before it was titled 'don't taste me bro'

_____________________________

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If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 29

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:08:05 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

Ok completely way off topic here but Level have you changed the title of thid thread?
I am nearly positive that when i read it before it was titled 'don't taste me bro'

lol, hey there, misty. No, it should be "don't tase me, bro", unless I misspelled it at first, then maybe someone else fixed it.

How's the business going for you over there?

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 30

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:15:48 PM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

quote:

They're "deputized" by the PD or SD, whoever is responsible for overseeing the campus police. I think, I'm not sure, it's contracted out by the college.

I don't know about the certification but most campus police are simply "security" officers, as described in the post above, being overseen by "real" LEOs. Therefore, most campus police aren't allowed to make an arrest or carry firearms, I'm not even sure they can detain you but they can report you and the cops will pick you up later, if it's necessary.

Mmmmm, sorry, but... no. You are describing security guards, and calling them /police/LEOs. Many campuses have both.
Please feel free to provide a link supporting your assertion that FDLE is not the agency overseeing university police in Florida
http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/cjst/Publications/AgencyAddresses/State%20Agencies%20Directory.pdf

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 31

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:16:19 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

It's going very slowly
Getting there though

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 32

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:27:39 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

Good Hell, that kind of thing takes time, but you can do it.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 33

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:49:36 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Good Hell, that kind of thing takes time, but you can do it.

My whole life is taking time at the moment
I'm glad you have faith in me - thank you xx

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 34

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:52:34 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

I do indeed have faith in you ; you're a smart and strong woman.

Life........ well, it can take a lot of time too. Breathe deeply, smile, love, and move towards what your heart wants, as much as possible.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 35

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 2:58:38 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

You really make me smile

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 36

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 3:02:24 PM

bigjohnson

Posts: 43
Joined: 11/21/2005
Status: offline

The funny thing about this whole video is...he resisted when he was being asked to leave by the security/police whatever you guys want to call them. That is justification enough in some states for arrest. Initially he was not under arrest, just being escorted out of the hall by security. Obviously security was called by the speaker or the officers would not have moved in. If he would have peacefully exited the hall instead of insisting on making a scene none of this would have happened and he would not be famous for "don't tase me bro"

I think the little guy deserved it for resisting. If I was asked to leave somewhere and security came up to me and escorted me out of a building I would definitely not resist. Maybe thats because I know when to stop.

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 37

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 3:07:11 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bigjohnson

The funny thing about this whole video is...he resisted when he was being asked to leave by the security/police whatever you guys want to call them. That is justification enough in some states for arrest. Initially he was not under arrest, just being escorted out of the hall by security.

Here's the thing. Bodily contact PRIOR to arrest, without any grounds for arrest is called ---

Assault.

When you are assaulted, you have a duty to use anything you can to remove the physical threat, INCLUDING DEADLY FORCE.

quote:

Obviously security was called by the speaker or the officers would not have moved in.

That's a heck of an assumption. I guess the person who filed the misdemeanor Trespassing complaint would be the person to ask. And that person is -------?

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to bigjohnson)

Post #: 38

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 3:09:45 PM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

quote:

Here's the thing. Bodily contact PRIOR to arrest, without any grounds for arrest is called ---

Assault.

When you are assaulted, you have a duty to use anything you can to remove the physical threat, INCLUDING DEADLY FORCE.

.... I guess the person who filed the misdemeanor Trespassing complaint would be the person to ask. And that person is -------?

Thanks for posting that, and removing all doubt.

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 39

RE: "Don't tase me, bro!" revisited - 10/26/2007 3:24:00 PM

bigjohnson

Posts: 43
Joined: 11/21/2005
Status: offline

Fargle...you are the kind of person that everyone hates to be in a conversation with because you always have to try and make a point even if it is ludicrous. Someone had to call in security otherwise they would never have gone in there to apprehend him. Did you notice how when the officers attempted to escort him out of the hall he tried to stay. They are just doing their job, just like I am sure you do yours every day.

(in reply to Alumbrado)

Post #: 40

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