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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:08:21 AM   
LATEXBABY64


Posts: 2107
Joined: 4/8/2004
Status: offline 		       It is about cheating.  It is about watching what i call collateral damage. Now the reference was back to something you said about something i said four post ago. about empathy. Empathy is everything. It is about having caring feelings beyond that of your own and for others around you. 

      What caught my attention was when  i saw a post about someone say there is problem with emotional cheating. people with out any kinda of emotional  response of guilt of doing something. They are on the same level as the iceman. Not to mention other mental people on that level.

     So yeah get a clue.! There is a cause and effect Wither or not you do not want to admit or even acknowledge it. IT does effect everyone in some way some form.
just how it is. It is not a me thing or a you thing  It is a we thing.  

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:12:08 AM   
Squeakers


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Joined: 10/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: batshalom

To say "I want Aba to be happy with only ME" is saying that I put conditions on his happiness, on my acceptance of his happiness, and on my own happiness.  


   I like that statement.    For me it would feel rather selfish to put those types of conditions into my relationship.    

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:12:30 AM   
TheChauvinist


Posts: 76
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline 		You're right, Latex. It does effect those around you in some way, shape or form. It's just not always a negative effect and not always on a level the effected comprehends.

(in reply to LATEXBABY64)
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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:15:24 AM   
susie


Posts: 1699
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64

      It is about cheating.  It is about watching what i call collateral damage. Now the reference was back to something you said about something i said four post ago. about empathy. Empathy is everything. It is about having caring feelings beyond that of your own and for others around you. 

     What caught my attention was when  i saw a post about someone say there is problem with emotional cheating. people with out any kinda of emotional  response of guilt of doing something. They are on the same level as the iceman. Not to mention other mental people on that level.

    So yeah get a clue.! There is a cause and effect Wither or not you do not want to admit or even acknowledge it. IT does effect everyone in some way some form.
just how it is. It is not a me thing or a you thing  It is a we thing.  


It is NOT about cheating. Who is cheating?

Who does it effect? It has no effect on anyone apart from the people involved, me, him and the person he is seeing. If I am ok with it, he is ok with it and the third person is ok with it how the fuck does it effect anyone else?

You are right it is a "we" thing. Him and me. Not you and certainly not anyone else. You keep saying about caring for the feelings of others but you cannot tell me who these people are that I should be caring about.

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:17:03 AM   
sammiebabygirl


Posts: 465
Joined: 10/23/2004
From: Upstate, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: therealboss

this opinion does not make me insecure


Me thinks he doth protest too loudly.
 
jen

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:21:54 AM   
Squeakers


Posts: 489
Joined: 10/3/2006
Status: offline 		Latexbaby how is it cheating?   Okay you are taking a class and your instructor says put away your books and notes away and take this test---you take your book, sneak it onto your lap, and refer to that book while taking  the test even though the instuctor said not to.   THAT is cheating because he did not give you consent to look at your book or notes and you did anyways.   Now lets say that same teacher says---take this test.   You may use your book and your notes.   (YES THIS DOES HAPPEN!)    Would you use your books and notes or would you consider that cheating---because really it is not cheating if consent to do so has been given and that is WHAT this whole thread is about.     Consent has been given to have sex with others.  

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:31:53 AM   
eyesopened


Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64

      It is about cheating.  It is about watching what i call collateral damage. Now the reference was back to something you said about something i said four post ago. about empathy. Empathy is everything. It is about having caring feelings beyond that of your own and for others around you. 

     What caught my attention was when  i saw a post about someone say there is problem with emotional cheating. people with out any kinda of emotional  response of guilt of doing something. They are on the same level as the iceman. Not to mention other mental people on that level.

    So yeah get a clue.! There is a cause and effect Wither or not you do not want to admit or even acknowledge it. IT does effect everyone in some way some form.
just how it is. It is not a me thing or a you thing  It is a we thing.  


i must be clueless also. my first Dominant told me up front that He had two other play partners.  He had no romantic relationship with any of us and non of us played together,  He played with the three of us on different occassions.  We all knew.  The four of us were all in happy agreement of not being exclusive.  i never met any of the other playmates.  i can't see where anyone got hurt by this arrangement.  All these years later, the Dominant and i say hello from time to time, each of us has moved on.  About three years ago i served a Dominant who was non-exclusive as well.  No one got hurt.  Everyone was happy with the arrangement.  Now that i am in an exclusive relationship it is also by mutual consent that we are monogomous.  If InkedMaster suddenly changed His mind, i guess i would be hurt, but that's only because it would be a sudden change over what we had discussed and agreed upon. 

Regardless of the kind of relationship, as long as people share the same relationship goals the relationship works.  It's kind of like if everyone agrees to go out for chinese food no one should complain if there isn't any lasagna.  And if they wanted lasagna they should have said so in the first place.

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(in reply to LATEXBABY64)
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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:34:19 AM   
angelic


Posts: 1807
Joined: 1/24/2005
Status: offline 		~fr~ Here's the problem as i see it.  Many times the Dom/Master/Top wants to play with xy and z... but said slave/submissive is only allowed to have him as the "One".  i am of the firm belief that what is good for the goose is good for the gander.  It is one thing if  said slave/submissive does not want another, it is an entirely different thing when the Dom/Master/Top has said specifically 'i will have many, 'you' will have one. 


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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:40:14 AM   
breatheasone


Posts: 4004
Joined: 7/14/2007
Status: offline 		If all parties are informed fully and consent...imho....Its not cheating, or adultery or whatever you want to call it ....I however would NEVER be in a relationship that wasn't exclusive. I want one Master...and I want a Master that wants one slave.

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:44:48 AM   
batshalom


Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: angelic

~fr~ Here's the problem as i see it.  Many times the Dom/Master/Top wants to play with xy and z... but said slave/submissive is only allowed to have him as the "One".  i am of the firm belief that what is good for the goose is good for the gander.  It is one thing if  said slave/submissive does not want another, it is an entirely different thing when the Dom/Master/Top has said specifically 'i will have many, 'you' will have one. 



Ohhhhhhhh yeah. Been there and I agree with you, angelic. "I can have all I want, you can have only me." ~snort~ WhatEV.

(in reply to angelic)
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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:47:27 AM   
plushiecat


Posts: 109
Joined: 12/18/2005
Status: offline 		Poly--be it polyamory or just having additional playpartners is NOT cheating (as has been stated.  Squeakers correlation with the test example was quite good!).  It is ONLY 'cheating' when it is done **without consent**.  I do have two people I call my mates.  Not only do they both know about each other, we regularly have dinner together, and love playing games (we are quite fond of all the Munchkin series.  They're grand!).  As for people needing to 'get a clue' latexbaby...I'm quite of the opinion that perhaps it is you that needs it, not those that choose to share in whatever fashion or capacity they choose to.  And, when it all comes down to it, we ARE 'just animals'..mammals, to be precise.  That's not such a bad thing though. :)

(oops.  Just saw this was listed as 'in reply to breatheasone.  It wasn't meant as such.  I thought I hit 'fast reply'!)



< Message edited by plushiecat -- 10/28/2007 9:54:07 AM >

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:51:54 AM   
batshalom


Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64

     It is not a me thing or a you thing  It is a we thing.  


Not even close to being a we thing, Latex. It's a you thing. Not everyone agrees with your view. What is good for you may not work for me. What works for me may be shattering to you. Some people prefer monogamy, some people don't care.

(btw, angelic, I thought your post about being one of the "insecure ones" was very self-introspective and sweet. You're beautiful.)

(in reply to LATEXBABY64)
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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:55:00 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		I dunno, it sounds like you didn't actually read those threads, because in just about all of them, you'll have at least 5 or 6 people state exactly what you've said.  Owned, myself, Beth, Bita and a few others. 

Sometimes there's more, sometimes less, and it always comes down to what the people involved need for their own selves.

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Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:56:23 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: angelic
~fr~ Here's the problem as i see it.  Many times the Dom/Master/Top wants to play with xy and z... but said slave/submissive is only allowed to have him as the "One".  i am of the firm belief that what is good for the goose is good for the gander.  It is one thing if  said slave/submissive does not want another, it is an entirely different thing when the Dom/Master/Top has said specifically 'i will have many, 'you' will have one. 

That's where the whole "Ds = double standard" comes in.  I am perfectly fine with a master setting up an entirely different set of standards for their property than they hold for themselves.  That's kinda what the relationship is based on- one person has authority and the other does not.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 9:59:00 AM   
rmanrr


Posts: 358
Joined: 7/25/2006
Status: offline 		Greetings
Well said angelic. There are Doms who will play behind their sub/slaves back, without saying a damn thing. That is cheating in My opinion. There are Doms who play with their sub/slave and with another person...that is a form of poly play in My opinion. There are Doms who will play with another after speaking about such a possibility with their sub/slave and making sure she/he is fine with the scenario. And you are absolutely correct in that what is good for the Gander is good for the goose. At this point I don't see Myself wanting to play...scene...session...have sex...with another. That does not preclude the possibility of the future bringing a change to the situation...not being God I can't predict that at this point. And yes, even though I am Gorean...I discuss things with My woman....This is the real world in which we live...not some fantasy.
Elsewhere there was a thread about trust....in which My woman responded and it dealt a bit with playing with others. If I can provide most but not all of that which she requires then I trust her to get it elsewhere in a safe environment. and in that I trust her completely. And in the same vein but different, her upcoming visit will be something new. She I think suggested an immersion weekend...meaning for the duration we go into our alternative personae. I asked a few questions regarding her idea of such. The response made Me quiver with pride in her. It brought home to Me yet again how much we trust each other. She simply stated, immersion is immersion...no negotiation, no limits. Now how is THAT for the trust she bestows for Me. As usual she gives Me reasons every day to be proud in associating with her, and providing reasons for Me to laugh and find joy in this life.
(I love you My woman).


_____________________________

Be Well, Be Careful

Jarl Rmanrr

"the road untravelled is the loneliest." Me
Courage...the ability to overcome obstacles during the course.
"to be insane is to be original!"...Me

(in reply to angelic)
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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 10:02:38 AM   
rmanrr


Posts: 358
Joined: 7/25/2006
Status: offline 		Greetings LA
While that may indeed be the way it works for some...I find it distasteful. If honesty and open communication are paramount to establishing and maintaining trust ...then it goes without saying that the two people in the dynamic communicate such desires or possibilities to each other BEFORE they happen or occur. Agree or disagree?
There again, we live in the real world. If you are completely happy with your Dom playing with every jane, sheila, and mary who comes along and strikes his fancy without letting you know in advance than so be it. It might work for you and some others...it does not do so for Me.


_____________________________

Be Well, Be Careful

Jarl Rmanrr

"the road untravelled is the loneliest." Me
Courage...the ability to overcome obstacles during the course.
"to be insane is to be original!"...Me

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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 10:05:40 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Exactly.  The double standard isn't the problem, most Ms and Ds relationships in fact need it in order to thrive. 

It's that some subs do not actually want a double standard, or only want it in a particular limited way- then it's a problem if they try to get involved with doms who DO want a double standard or in a way that is not compatible with them.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 10:11:17 AM   
chamberqueen


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline 		I think that there should be a clear understanding up front.  For instance, I had a 24/7 slave who encouraged me to have other subs.  He wanted no other mistress, and if I was to allow another woman to "play" with him there were certain rules.  The main one was that I must be present and could give directions at any point.  The other was that she could demand any sexual favor other than kissing on the lips.  The third, maybe obvious for safety, was that he must wear a condom.

He knew that I was the only one that I wanted sexual gratification from and that my other subs were to be toys only.  We talked it all out very carefully.  I think that the communication is the most important part.  If he would have wanted other mistresses we simply would have set some limits, but I knew that I was the only one that he could create that deep bond with.  That's what he needed, the complete belonging to one person.

Very sadly, I found out yesterday that my slave died in Iraq.  I will miss the incredibly close bond that we had.

(in reply to Squeakers)
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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 10:39:18 AM   
angelic


Posts: 1807
Joined: 1/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Exactly.  The double standard isn't the problem, most Ms and Ds relationships in fact need it in order to thrive. 

It's that some subs do not actually want a double standard, or only want it in a particular limited way- then it's a problem if they try to get involved with doms who DO want a double standard or in a way that is not compatible with them.


Yes, another one i have witnessed... is those 'Doms/Masters' who will agree to most anything at the start (i.e. monogomy (ok i believe in it, i just can't spell it for shit)... with the full undisclosed knowledge that at some point in time he plans on bringing in a 2nd or 3rd... essentially he has based the entire relationship on a lie.  Now, when said slave/submissive says "ok... As a Master you do not meet all of my needs, so can i have another to fill that?"... the answer is most often than not a resounding 'no'. 

i do not believe that D/s or M/s has to be based upon a double standard.  i do believe there are many involved in D/s or M/s because of the double standard that many seem to allow.

< Message edited by angelic -- 10/28/2007 10:51:25 AM >

_____________________________

~....and once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return.~ -- Leonardo de Vinci


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RE: Alone in my way of thinking? - 10/28/2007 10:58:38 AM   
Squeakers


Posts: 489
Joined: 10/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: angelic

Yes, another one i have witnessed... is those 'Doms/Masters' who will agree to most anything at the start (i.e. monogomy (ok i believe in it, i just can't spell it for shit)... with the full undisclosed knowledge that at some point in time he plans on bringing in a 2nd or 3rd... essentially he has based the entire relationship on a lie. 
     I can not say that I agree with this totally.    Yes sometimes people do have hidden agendas but not always.    I see it more as people changing and growing.  

(in reply to angelic)
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