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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/4/2008 10:28:39 PM   
EvilGenie


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Joined: 9/10/2007
From: Morocco and Maine occasionally
Status: offline 		Please do not forget with all the talk of fat burning that these plans, especially the more restrictive ones like Atkins also eventually burn muscle tissue. Refer to either a Duke or Stanford study as well as others.

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/4/2008 10:35:53 PM   
EvilGenie


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From: Morocco and Maine occasionally
Status: offline 		P.S. Anyone wanting to know their BMI, CMail me your height and weight and I will let you know.

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/5/2008 6:45:29 AM   
MsBearlee


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Joined: 2/15/2006
Status: offline 		Heres a link to calculate your Body Mass Index (BMI): 

Here are some links to places where you can find the carb levels in various foods:

Here is a link (thanks Level) to an awesome site where you can journal your daily food intake, read more about good diet, find a free calorie counter that is really a 'nutrition' counter, track exercise and weight loss, see long-term diet analysis, read inspirational success stories, and more. 

B

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/5/2008 7:21:05 AM   
MsBearlee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

Please do not forget with all the talk of fat burning that these plans, especially the more restrictive ones like Atkins also eventually burn muscle tissue. Refer to either a Duke or Stanford study as well as others.  


To make such a statement leads me to believe you are more than a little ill-informed.  The American Medical Association has had to refute their original claims that the diet they promoted (low-fat, moderate protein and lots of vegetables and fruits) is one that worked.  They have also had to refute their original claims that a diet high in protein, with moderate fat and low carbs will not only improve health, but will also instigate weight loss.
 
The thing about the word ‘moderate’ is that it must be taken within the context of what each person believes is ‘normal’.  If, for a decade, we have been taught that fat is bad, then surely a ‘moderate’ fat intake will seem excessively unhealthy and too high to us. 
 
Counting calories seldom works.  Diets that keep a person feeling hungry or deprived might help one initially loose some weight, but they do not teach a person how to form life-long eating habits…nor does one who lost weight in this manner usually keep the weight off.
 
Atkins, Paleo, South Beach, ZoneDiet… are hardly restrictive!  How many diets are there where a person is allowed to eat till full, eat as much as they like, eat things that feel good to eat, things that taste good…and still loose weight?  Most of these diets were originally designed to ‘fix’ things like cardio-problems, liver-problems, hypertension, arthritis, even ADHD; the weight loss was just a bonus!  I would call them ‘back to basics’ more than ‘diets’ in the usual sense of the word. 
 
The other thing...one cannot read Part One of a 3-4 part diet plan and say THAT is  the diet plan.   
 
While I appreciate there are some folks who prefer not to do real research (I’m one…it IS time-consuming!!!), and some folks prefer to spew what they’ve heard from others they respect (I tend to be one of those, too), and while I also realize there ARE folks who find success with all manner of weight-loss programs…I’d prefer this little thread to be more about positive discussion, success stories and support than about fear mongering.
 
Oh…and for anybody keeping track:  I started moving towards such a diet (as I did more research, got rid of my ‘white’ stuff and purchased some healthier foods to last me a couple weeks).  I started on the afternoon of Dec 31 and on the afternoon of Jan 4…I’m happy to say I’m already 5 pounds lighter! 
 
B

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/5/2008 1:17:23 PM   
Najakcharmer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie
Please do not forget with all the talk of fat burning that these plans, especially the more restrictive ones like Atkins also eventually burn muscle tissue. Refer to either a Duke or Stanford study as well as others.


Try actually reading some of those studies rather than just the pop-magazine summary.  A restricted carbohydrate diet that is high in protein tends to partition total weight losses more favorably in terms of a fat to lean body mass ratio than a low fat diet that is low or moderate in protein and high in carbs.   In particular, individuals whose insulin sensitivity has been blunted due to overconsumption of high-GI carbs are going to partition losses much less favorably in the continuing presence of high-GI carbs.

Atkins is restrictive only in the initial phases of the diet, where the purpose is to accomplish a specific metabolic switchover - an effective overclocking of the metabolism.  The extreme restrictions are temporary.  The last phase of the diet - the one that is supposed to be maintained permanently - includes fruits, whole grains and nutritionally dense starchy vegetables such as sweet potatoes, in sensible portions, along with animal and vegetable proteins.  The only foods permanently eschewed are highly processed and unnatural ones, specifically sugar and all its analogues, white flour, and the non-nutritive junk foods made from such ingredients.

Now, if you are a bodybuilder doing intense resistance exercise to glycogen depletion, you will probably need to do a targeted or cyclic ketogenic diet in order to maintain positive nitrogen balance and muscle glycogen replenishment while maintaining dietary ketosis for the purposes of fat burning.  That's a bit more technical than Atkins, but do-able.  Google for Dan Duchaine or Lyle McDonald; there's lots of excellent information and good, solid cites to research papers in their work on the subject.

Do, please, read and fully understand the studies you are vaguely referring to.  And you will need to cite them too.  Duke and Stanford produce a rather large number of studies on exercise physiology and nutrition, a percentage of which could be applicable to this discussion, and a university name alone is a very bad cite.  It's difficult to discuss the specifics of a study when you don't know which of hundreds is being referred to.  Perhaps you mean this one from Duke?  http://thyroid.about.com/b/2004/05/17/duke-university-study-shows-low-carb-diet-more-effective-than-low-fat-diet.htm 

"This diet can be quite powerful," said lead researcher Will Yancy, M.D., an assistant professor of medicine at Duke University Medical Center and a research associate at the Veterans Affairs Medical Center in Durham, N.C. "We found that the low-carb diet was more effective for weight loss," Yancy added. "The weight loss surprised me, to be honest with you. We also found cholesterol levels seemed to improve more on a low-carb diet compared to a low-fat diet."

Or this one from Stanford? http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/64716.php

According to a study of 311 women carried out by researchers at Stanford University, USA, the Atkins diet is the best one around. Those following the Atkins diet had best blood pressure levels, better cholesterol levels and lost the most weight, compared to people on other diets, say the researchers.

It should be clearly understood that dietary carbohydrate restriction is a powerful tool, and as such, can cause harm if misused or misapplied.  However a broader look at the evolved dietary habits of our species demonstrates numerous indigenous cultures existing in seasonal ketosis, and several in permanent ketosis. Homo sapiens very clearly thrives in the long term on a low carbohydrate diet, and forensic anthropologists have shown significant positive correlation between longevity, infant survival rates and general population health on a low carbohydrate hunter-gatherer diet as opposed to their immediate agrarian neighbors on a high carbohydrate diet. 

The one thing that us modern hunter-gatherers need to keep in mind is that is we do all our hunting and gathering at the grocery store, we are not truly mimicking the known healthy patterns of our ancestors either in terms of physical exercise or in terms of the micronutrient ratios and biological content of the meat and fat we are eating.  Mass produced, grain fed, hormonally pumped animal meat and fat is simply not the same as the animal meat and fat our ancestors stayed healthy on.  As a result many modern researchers recommend cutting your intake of farm-raised animal fats and getting your fats from sources like fish, olive oil, flax and nuts.   Alternatively, use wild game or small farm raised, grass fed organic animals as your primary meat and fat source. 


< Message edited by Najakcharmer -- 1/5/2008 1:19:28 PM >

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/5/2008 3:13:04 PM   
MsBearlee


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OMG  You're good, you little snake charmer, you!  Thank you so much for all the valuble input you've provided here and in other threads, as well.    ^5
 
Beverly


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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/5/2008 3:29:14 PM   
MsBearlee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Najakcharmer
...Mass produced, grain fed, hormonally pumped animal meat and fat is simply not the same as the animal meat and fat our ancestors stayed healthy on.  As a result many modern researchers recommend cutting your intake of farm-raised animal fats and getting your fats from sources like fish, olive oil, flax and nuts.   Alternatively, use wild game or small farm raised, grass fed organic animals as your primary meat and fat source.  


Ya know, it is for this reason I moved to my 40 acres (which I had to sell when the stock market thingy happened).  It was my plan to become a 'small-animal farmer'; you know...rabbits, chickens, perhaps a couple of sheep and/or goats; small animals that a single person could 'harvest' by themselves...and only as many as they'd need to feed their family.  Even selling the place, I moved to a town rural enough that, just a block or two from Main Street, I still can raise and harvest my own rabbits and chickens.  There is other livestock around...generally the larger ones are more like 2-3 blocks of main though...a little further from the art galleries!  LOL 
 
I was doing famously till a neighbor dog got in and slaughtered my animals; pulled baby rabbits right through the bottom of the cage…or just nipped off their legs and left the dead little body.  Ugg… it was terrible!  Yeah, your family pet IS capable of this…keep your dogs on a leash, please.
 
Anyway…end rant.  I’m curious if this, like the Victory Gardens of the post-war era will make a come back.  Between the pesticides blowing in the wind, the sad state in which mega-farms keep animals, and the growing knowledge that home-grown IS best makes me think more and more families will realize it’s a good thing.  Hell, having the kids help would keep ‘em off the streets, too! 
 
Anyway, my plan is to fix up a green-house, make a dog-resistant place for rabbits and chickens (and get automatic waterers), and build some raised beds here at the new place.  I'm ready! 
 
Beverly

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 12:22:57 PM   
MsBearlee


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Status: offline 		Well, I started moving towards an Atkins-like diet on Dec. 31 and have lost at least 5 pounds (last weighted on Friday the 4th; I don’t have scales at home).  Yesterday, that ‘Induction Flu’ passed and I find myself feeling so much better than I did just a week ago.  I have more energy, I am sleeping better, I am eating so regularly it feels like I’m eating constantly; I'm never hungry.
 
I am nearing 60 years old (lordy that is such a surprise it makes me laugh…there MUST be a mistake somewhere; I know I’m really only 47), and I have a few ‘standard-issue’ health problems.  Plus, around a year ago, I heard I had elevated blood-sugar levels (which I scoffed at; what is 102 when 100 is okay?) which I had no idea indicated I may becoming pre-diabetic.
 
THEN…for several weeks lately, I was finding myself adding more carbs to my meals than I have in years, plus (!!!), going back for seconds after I woke up falling asleep in front of the TV; I do NOT fall asleep in front of the television. AND…I also noticed I was waking up at night 4-5 or more times; not to pee, just waking up for no known reason.
 
Okay, all this, plus carrying an extra 35-pounds or so, has become a wake-up call.  Well, plus the fact that my cloths are just getting too damn tight!  So, by all standards, I am not obese and am active (usually) and seemingly healthy, but…there IS that birthday coming ever closer!  Hence the new plan; I have plenty of time to turn things around before they get worse.  In fact, I suspect I’ll be very close to my ideal weight by the end of January.
 
It cracks me up how many people do a knee-jerk reaction to Atkins and bring up the idea of eating a pound of butter wrapped in bacon.  Dang…it’s like a bad joke; it keeps coming around.  While that is, of course, not at all what Atkins suggests, and yes he does recommend exercise, and even during Phase I, his plan offers unlimited amounts of various proteins plus a nice salad and a cup of veggies every day.  Where do people get the idea his diet is so austere and limiting?  Lordy, I feel like I’m porking it on (no pun intended).  I’m never hungry, I sleep all night, I feel so much better and I have more energy…after less than a week!
 
Anyway, the purpose of this post is to share a comment he made in his ‘new’ Diet Revolution regarding what it is we people think we should eat: “…the trouble is they don’t know what they’re supposed to eat, but they’ve heard the wrong answer so often, they think it’s an unchallenged truth.”
 
I love it.  I love the AMA realizing perhaps he had the right idea, I love the medical university studies coming up supporting his ideas; I love how I feel after just a few days on my new regime.  For those of you who insist dieting is a bad idea…Atkins, for one, agrees and pointed out:  “The word ‘diet’ comes from the Latin diaeta and the Greek diaita, meaning ‘way of life’ or ‘regimen.’  Not something one does for two or three months and then stops, but the way one eats always.”  THAT is how I want to embrace this.
 
Do we have more success stories?
 
Thanks,
Beverly

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 12:32:19 PM   
Najakcharmer


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Status: offline 		Beverly - awesome.  You're well on your way to being another low carb success story.  Drop me a note on the other side for some additional resources, and please do join us on the alt_fitness Yahoo e-list.  :)

Mine was dropping 80 lbs on Atkins - doing it right, after a lot of reading and research - and getting fit enough to move to a bodybuilder's weight lifting and fitness regimen.  I am no longer low carbing; there's a lot of brown rice and raw oats and sweet potatoes and fruit in my meals these days, along with veggies, various forms of lean protein and some healthy fats from nuts, fish oil, flaxseed and avocado.  Atkins was a *much* easier diet to stick to, with more and tastier food, but what I'm doing now is more optimal for building muscle and fueling hardcore weight training. 

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 12:38:39 PM   
EvilGenie


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Status: offline 		I happen to fully read as well as write and conduct medical studies of my own. My how presumptous some are without knowing what one does for a living, their background or where their information comes from, though I said Duke and Stanford studies among others. I have kept much of my career as a personal matter and decided not to publicise it on CM. Long term NO carb diets will eventually burn muscle tissue. I also stated long ago in this thread that I am a low carb freak for my own health issues. I am not dissing the plan merely pointing out a factor which has not, as of yet, been refuted by any major medical study of a no carbohydrate diet.

**edited to add: Just as a by the way, I read medical studies not articles in magazines. This means medical journals and the studies/information contained therein.

< Message edited by EvilGenie -- 1/6/2008 12:43:43 PM >

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 2:00:39 PM   
MsBearlee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

I happen to fully read as well as write and conduct medical studies of my own. My how presumptous some are without knowing what one does for a living, their background or where their information comes from, though I said Duke and Stanford studies among others. I have kept much of my career as a personal matter and decided not to publicise it on CM. Long term NO carb diets will eventually burn muscle tissue. I also stated long ago in this thread that I am a low carb freak for my own health issues. I am not dissing the plan merely pointing out a factor which has not, as of yet, been refuted by any major medical study of a no carbohydrate diet.

**edited to add: Just as a by the way, I read medical studies not articles in magazines. This means medical journals and the studies/information contained therein. 


Right.  It would seem to me that HAD you done so, you'd know the plans we are discussing here are NOT no-carb; not a single one of them.
 
You offer a lot, but never seem to come through with much; no recipes, no links, no support, no reality.  Generally folks who cannot walk their talk are not well received; yanno?  How odd you insist you both read and write medical studies...and yet missed that part.
 
YOU are the one who mentioned the Duke and Stanford studies on this topic...and seem not to have read them throughly enough to catch that the diets we are discussing are, again, NOT no-carb.  Maybe you're too busy, like you said.  Perhaps you should read the 'condensed' versions...you know; to save time.
 
B

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 3:07:20 PM   
Level


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Status: offline 		On zero carbs: there are those that feel that is optimal.

I've read a bit about an Owsley Stanley; he's eaten a carnivorous diet for several decades now, and seems to be in superb health. He's in his 70s, and lifts weights.

He was also the sound man for the Grateful Dead, and the producer of some of the most famous (infamous?) LSD from the 1960s

For those interested: A long article written by Artic explorer Vilhjalmur Stefansson. He lived with the Inuits, and ate an all-meat diet, and had robust health. Once he got back to civilization, a team of doctors in New York observed him, and another man, for one year, on the all-meat diet, and found no ill effects.

http://www.biblelife.org/stefansson1.htm

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 3:12:31 PM   
proudsub


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quote:

I have more energy, I am sleeping better, I am eating so regularly it feels like I’m eating constantly; I'm never hungry.


That's great to hear Bev and congrats on your loss, you are off to a good start.

quote:

   I am no longer low carbing; there's a lot of brown rice and raw oats and sweet potatoes and fruit in my meals these days, along with veggies, various forms of lean protein and some healthy fats from nuts, fish oil, flaxseed and avocado. 

Sounds a lot like South Beach to me Najak

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 3:16:11 PM   
backseatbebe


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Status: offline 		no carb and low carb diet are two totally different things (can anyone really do a no carb diet anyways?!)
and for myself being a vegetarian i was foolishly subsutiting carbs instead of protien
now i have to say lowering my carb intake (of course in moderation, i try for 40-30-30/P-F-C) has changed my eating habits completely and made me a much healthier person


< Message edited by backseatbebe -- 1/6/2008 3:17:52 PM >

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 3:17:33 PM   
domiguy


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Status: offline 		People are dumb...It's might be a fact or at least an observation. There is nothing wrong with the word diet as long as you plan on changing what you ingest and can do so for the long run. Most people use the word "diet" as a fix....For a specific time period or until they reach some preconceived weight goal.

Your diet should be a relatively permanent once you have determined the proper foods that you should be consuming. Combined with exercise which is definitely the flexible part of this program...as your tolerance and strength increases you can improve upon your work out to include more vigorous activities.

Any other approach has a tremendous chance of failure over the long run. It's that simple and this is a fact.

< Message edited by domiguy -- 1/6/2008 3:18:31 PM >

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 3:22:22 PM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

quote:

I have more energy, I am sleeping better, I am eating so regularly it feels like I’m eating constantly; I'm never hungry.


That's great to hear Bev and congrats on your loss, you are off to a good start.



I agree, good going, Beverly.

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 3:23:55 PM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: backseatbebe

no carb and low carb diet are two totally different things (can anyone really do a no carb diet anyways?!)
and for myself being a vegetarian i was foolishly subsutiting carbs instead of protien
now i have to say lowering my carb intake (of course in moderation, i try for 40-30-30/P-F-C) has changed my eating habits completely and made me a much healthier person



On a diet like Stanley's, you'll get under 5 grams of carbohydrate a day, I think. For all intent and purpose, no carbs.

I rarely eat over 30 grams a day, often around 20.

< Message edited by Level -- 1/6/2008 3:24:26 PM >

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RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 4:14:57 PM   
MsBearlee


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Status: offline 		Thank you so much, Naja…I appreciate your information and your support!
 
There is another thing I’d like to add; something I found to be absolutely astounding:
 
It is about fat and carbohydrates and sugar (just another carb, but completely empty of value) and how we process food.  I’ve read a single slice of bread raises the blood sugar level the same as a spoon-full of sugar would.  Christ!!!   I find that almost shocking; not that I eat much bread…but just how different are bread and pasta, I ask?  Sheeshhhhhhhhhh...
 
Okay, another thing I read is that 100 years ago we, per capita, consumed about ten pounds of sugar (including corn syrup) yearly.  Okay…I’m quite sure that’s how much I might eat.  …right!  About 1820 or so, these numbers had already doubled!  Sheeshhhhhhhh!!!  In one decade that followed, both cola drinks and the ability to mix processed white flour with sugar and chemicals to make ‘convenient’ food that can sit in a box for months were invented…and since then the per capita of sugar (including corn syrup) rocketed to over 150 pounds today!!!   OMFG   One Hundred-fifty pounds of sugar-shit per year, PER PERSON???  Lordy, is it a wonder we are obese and suffering diabetes and a whole mess of other problems?
 
Okay (can you tell I’m on the band-wagon?), there is a reason I was falling asleep on the couch, following a meal an hour or so later with a second helping of pasta or a whole bowl of (just) popped corn and waking up in the middle of the night. 
 
The body absorbs amino acids from protein, glycerol and fatty acids from fats and simple sugar (energy) from carbohydrates.  Back in the day (to the point we evolved to become human), our body’s ability to deal with unrefined foods was great; it stored excess ‘energy’ as fat and used it in the rather frequent times food was scarce.  However, hour body’s ability to deal with highly refined food and all the excess energy they provide (from both sugar and white flour) is poor.
 
Our pancreas produces insulin when we eat carbohydrates, which is the hormone that either uses the high blood sugar (glucose, a body’s basic fuel) as energy or converts it to glycogen and stores it as starch in the muscles or liver…readily available as energy for a later date.  When (and I mean when because this is not an ‘if’; in the standard American diet, it will happen) the body is full of as much glycogen as it can hold for later, the excess is converted to FAT.  Think of the glycogen as food you find right on the front shelf of your fridge and FAT as the food way far back on a low, hard to reach shelf; underneath everything else.
 
Insulin is efficient and can be stimulated to over-process, leaving too little glucose to circulate the blood to fuel the brain.  (Circulate the blood…that would be why people use toes, right?  But…fuel the brain?  Christ!)   The body, in its attempt to adjust, counters with other hormones, including adrenaline…to raise the glucose levels to feed its brain.  Hello…adrenaline?  Is THAT why I wake up at night?  Is THAT why my stress level physically feels WAY up?  This shit is scary!!!
 
Consider that protein and fat produce almost no change in a body’s insulin level.  Carbohydrates, especially simple ones like sugar, honey, milk and fruit which contain glucose as well as refined carbohydrates like white four, white rice and potatoes are quickly converted to glucose, which require a lot of insulin to process the glucose.
 
Even before becoming diabetic, overweight people can become ‘insulin resistant’; all those carbs create so much glucose that the body nearly continually pumps out insulin to the point that apparently the body’s cells become blocked from transferring the glucose to useful energy (why we fat people are often tired)…and it is all stored as fat.  Eventually the pancreas becomes exhausted and the body suffers hyperinsulinism… and usually followed by diabetes; which of course affects the eyes, kidneys, nervous system and skin.
 
Even if diabetes is not reached, when those with hyperinsulinism eventually experience the tiniest bit of glucose it causes such a insulin surge that the blood sugar levels drop to far too low: and hypoglycemia occurs.  As this happens, the body yoyos back and forth between too high and too low blood sugar; and the metabolic problem becomes a merry-go-round of emotional and energy exhaustion.
 
I just read this in Dr. Atkins’ New Diet Revolution (parens are mine):
 
Here are some issues high insulin levels in a body create:
·         Insulin increases salt and water retention—a recipe for both hypertension and weight gain
·         Insulin aggravates hypertension by increasing the responsiveness of arteries to the effects of adrenaline.
·         Insulin affects the body’s supply of neurotransmitters and can cause sleep disorders.
·         Insulin is directly involved (according to numerous animal studies) in creating atherosclerotic plaques.
·         Insulin is the primary contributor to both high levels of triglycerides and low levels of the ‘good’ HDL cholesterol.
·         Insulin provokes the liver into producing more LDL cholesterol (the ‘bad’ kind).  It may be one of the most significant components in the cholesterol/heart disease connection.
 
All of a sudden Diabetes seems quite real…and no ‘common’ little problem I hear so little about.  I’m thinking this little change in the way I eat could have just added years and years to my life.  I’d like to think that, anyway.
 
I am reading a lot, looking at portions and good carbs; I'm guessing I'm eating around 20 grams per day (finally)...or will be; I just cannot bring myself to toss out or give away any more food.  And crap, now my dog is enjoying the sliced turkey lunch-meat I bought for those roll-up thingies (turkey, a bit of cheese...wrapped in lettuce)...because who knew 'smoked' means LOTS OF ADDED SUGAR?  Okay, no more processed meat.  <sigh>  This is so wierd cuz I'm a cook and my mother was an Adel Davis fan (You Are What You Eat) and I had my ADHD kid on the Feingold Diet (no artificial chit)...I really thought I ate heathfully!!! 
 
Lordy!
Beverly
 
PS... I am a visual person who learns best by writing.  I don't do all that well just reading or hearing something.  Writing it helps me learn.  Give me directions on the phone I'll miss the turnoff.  Show me a map (but keep the map, I'll likely miss the turnoff)  But if I write the directions and even if I leave them behind...I'll most likely arrive right on time!  I hope this stuff helps you...it helps me to write it.  Thanks!

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This one, as well!

(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 4:29:58 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
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quote:

I’ve read a single slice of bread raises the blood sugar level the same as a spoon-full of sugar would.  Christ!!!   I find that almost shocking; not that I eat much bread…but just how different are bread and pasta, I ask?  

 
When a carb goes into your body, they all pretty much turn into glucose, except for fiber, I believe.

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Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
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(in reply to MsBearlee)
Profile   Post #: 119
RE: High Protein, Low Carb Diet - 1/6/2008 5:24:48 PM   
LeMis


Posts: 9255
Joined: 9/24/2005
From: Florida
Status: offline

I bought some Pepperidge Farm "Light Style" 7 grain bread.  The nutritional info is for 3 slices, I usually eat 1 slice when I want something bread-like.  (Although tonight I had 2 slices to make a chicken sandwich) 


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Profile   Post #: 120
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