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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 3:45:35 PM   
christine1


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From: i'm headed to HIM...
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

Psssst christine number 1 the silver paint thing was a joke.


ok, what was number 2?  oh nevermind, i already know.

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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 3:48:25 PM   
FullCircle


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Status: offline 		I didn't want to leave you thinking I was serious about painting the ice silver to combat global warming.

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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:25:33 PM   
Smith117


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

I can't answer that

All I can say is bad things happen and owning a gun never guarantees good things will come of them.



No, but not having one when the criminal who attacks you does ensures you're already dead.

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Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:29:53 PM   
FullCircle


Posts: 5713
Joined: 11/24/2005
Status: offline 		I could easily argue that you have an equal chance of survival if you pose no threat, but we beg to differ as already noted by myself.

I could argue firing a weapon means the attacker has to also fire in return. Whereas he may only have robbed you now he has to also kill you because he is more desperate than you due to the fact he is doing the extreme in the first place.


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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:31:54 PM   
christine1


Posts: 6155
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From: i'm headed to HIM...
Status: offline 		FC, i have to differ....if someone broke into my house in the middle of the night and i had a shotgun, it would make a big difference over if i had a rolling pin in my hand.

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i am woman! er, godzilla! hear me roar!

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He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

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Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:35:16 PM   
Smith117


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle
You give people far too much credit for their training.


No, I'm saying the training is there. Not everyone takes it. That is the problem, not guns. I think it should be mandated, personally. I think it you want one for defense, you should be taught how to defend with it. Taking guns away from law-abiding citizens is not the answer, making damned sure those citizens know how to use their weapon should be.

quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle
For me it underscored what kittinsol just said i.e. some people own guns for the wrong reasons. Same reason some people started smoking because it was sexy. Personal defence is just an afterthought and those people will attend the course to get the license and then pose in picture to impress others. The power of death so impressive isn't it?


For every person you claim has a gun for the wrong reason, there are others who got one and only one and only one little one just for that 'just in case' moment.

You want to know what power is more impressive than death? Life. I don't even carry yet. I have my CHL paperwork "all ready to go" and sitting in a drawer where it's been for the past 5 months. I took the class and went practice shooting, to evaluate which gun I wanted to carry and I haven't bought one yet. Mainly, I can't afford it. Our lovely economy has my more focused on things like food and gas to get to work. However, I do plan to get one. The thing I noticed, though is that just taking the CHL class made me much more apt to not get upset. That class teaches you first and foremost that the gun should be the LAST thing you reach for, no matter what. I found that when I got into an argument or something after the class, I remembered what they taught about de-escalation and realized that whatever was being argued about wasn't really that important.

quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle
Do you seriously think everyone that legally owns and carries a gun knows how to use it and hasn't got a little rusty at some point regarding safe handling?


Nope. Not in the least. But those who seek to use them "legally" for defense are more apt to be trained to do so. The training is available, and it's highly encouraged by the teachers of the CHL class. They tell you first off that a CHL class is not a gun safety course...it's not a tactical shooting course and it's not going to turn you into a SWAT officer. It's going to educate you about when you can defend yourself so that you can legally carry a weapon. The thing they most repeated was just because you have one, doesn't mean you're going to get to it. So learn how and when to use it.

This goes back to what I said about training. I think the tactical shooting courses SHOULD be mandated. I think if you're going to carry concealed, you should have exactly the same training course the cops use to learn how to use that force when and only when it's necessary. What I do NOT think should happen is for all law-abiding citizens to be disarmed. Because the criminals don't care about gun laws. That's just one more to add to the list of charges for whatever else they're doing.

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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:35:26 PM   
FullCircle


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Status: offline 		That is the problem with hypothetical what ifs: we never know until actually faced with that exact situation proposed. Why would you necessarily be in the position of advantage?

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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:41:06 PM   
Smith117


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

I could easily argue that you have an equal chance of survival if you pose no threat, but we beg to differ as already noted by myself.

I could argue firing a weapon means the attacker has to also fire in return. Whereas he may only have robbed you now he has to also kill you because he is more desperate than you due to the fact he is doing the extreme in the first place.


Unfortunately, with gang activity on the rise, that paradigm no longer applies. "Thrill kills," serial attackers, the rise in car jackings....all of these would disagree with you.

Here in Dallas, we had a story in the news about a lady who had a knock at her door. She posed ZERO threat. She was in her 50's and just relaxing at the end of her day. She heard a knock, answered the door, and was promptly shot dead. For nothing. Nothing was taken and nothing else occured. "Knock knock"-"Bang." That was it.

I know people here who say if they are not expecting someone, they answer their door through the peep hole and their gun is not far away. This is the way the world is going unfortunately. Taking guns from law-abiding citizens isn't going to stop those kinds of murders. They'll just make them easier targets.

And the CHL class says that if you pull a weapon, you make damned sure you need it, you use it. And you end the conflict. So, in theory, the attacker could not then fire back.

This is why I say we all need that tactical course. Without proper training, 'firefights' are a greater possibility.

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Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:41:46 PM   
christine1


Posts: 6155
Joined: 12/15/2007
From: i'm headed to HIM...
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

That is the problem with hypothetical what ifs: we never know until actually faced with that exact situation proposed. Why would you necessarily be in the position of advantage?


ok, say i'm in bed and i hear my front door open, i grab my rolling pin and wait for the intruder to enter my bedroom, i yell, "watch out you hoodlums, i've got a mean rolling pin!", then i shake it so they can hear that it's made out of real wood.

or

ok, say i'm in bed and i hear my front door open, i grab my shotgun and wait for the intruder to enter my bedroom and yell, "watch out you motherfuckers or you'll be wearin a belly full of lead!"  i cock the gun and wait...hmmm, i wonder which one will have more effect....(i just know chuck norris would be wanting to hug me right now!)

don't you think it's to ones advantage to think of the most positive outcome in all situations?  i'm not going to sit around with a rolling pin and hope for the best.

_____________________________

i am woman! er, godzilla! hear me roar!

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He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

(in reply to FullCircle)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:44:14 PM   
Smith117


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

That is the problem with hypothetical what ifs: we never know until actually faced with that exact situation proposed. Why would you necessarily be in the position of advantage?


There's a guy here who has been broken into several times. Two times ago, the criminal found out that the guy wasn't going to tolerate it anymore. He can't rob anyone anymore.

It's only happened once more after that. And that guy met the same fate. The homeowner is still alive though. I'd say it makes a difference.

There was another story about a lady who got mugged. The following day, she was moving with her husband and spotted the mugger. The husband went to talk to the guy, and didn't even get across the street before the guy opened fire. The husband, though, had a legally carried firearm as well, he pulled it, and killed the guy.

The husband and wife are still alive, the attacker is not. No one else was harmed in the incident.

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Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:46:33 PM   
FullCircle


Posts: 5713
Joined: 11/24/2005
Status: offline 		Being shot dead at random is a risk I don't see how me carrying a gun is going to stop me dying in a similar fashion to that woman.

A sad insight into that society that every knock at the door is a threat and yet where did this glorification of violence instilled in the evil youth come from?


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RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:51:15 PM   
FullCircle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117
There was another story about a lady who got mugged. The following day, she was moving with her husband and spotted the mugger. The husband went to talk to the guy, and didn't even get across the street before the guy opened fire. The husband, though, had a legally carried firearm as well, he pulled it, and killed the guy.

The husband and wife are still alive, the attacker is not. No one else was harmed in the incident.

It doesn't worry you people are taking the law into their own hands? Was anyone at risk if the husband had just simply called the police rather than approaching the suspect? Notice my use of the word suspect rather than culprit because it isn't for victims to dish out justice? Has this rule changed recently?


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Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:52:00 PM   
Smith117


Posts: 1447
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

Being shot dead at random is a risk I don't see how me carrying a gun is going to stop me dying in a similar fashion to that woman.

A sad insight into that society that every knock at the door is a threat and yet where did this glorification of violence instilled in the evil youth come from?



If you were prepared and educated about such crimes you would, presumably, not open your door, if they then continued to try and gain entry still, by the time they managed to get in, your 12-pump would be aimed at their chest and you would literally help them to find the most efficient way out.

Yes, I recall that there *was* a time when people "didn't even have to lock their doors at night." But those days are over. Now we are in the days of removing shoes at airports, passing through metal detectors at school, and yes, having a gun handy in case there's a knock at the door you were not expecting.

It's the way the world has become. No ammount of wishing, hoping or decrying the evils of guns is going to reverse it.

(in reply to FullCircle)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:54:19 PM   
Smith117


Posts: 1447
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle
It doesn't worry you people are taking the law into their own hands? Was anyone at risk if the husband had just simply called the police rather than approaching the suspect? Notice my use of the word suspect rather than culprit because it isn't for victims to dish out justice? Has this rule changed recently?


It's funny to see you reply like this. I just finished answering a post of yours that talked about how sad it was that people had to answer their doors with guns. And yet you now indicate that the mere act of crossing the street is taking the law into your own hands.

Why is it sad to have to have a gun to answer your door, but you see someone walking across a street as 'taking the law into their own hands?'

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Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 5:55:09 PM   
christine1


Posts: 6155
Joined: 12/15/2007
From: i'm headed to HIM...
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117
There was another story about a lady who got mugged. The following day, she was moving with her husband and spotted the mugger. The husband went to talk to the guy, and didn't even get across the street before the guy opened fire. The husband, though, had a legally carried firearm as well, he pulled it, and killed the guy.

The husband and wife are still alive, the attacker is not. No one else was harmed in the incident.

It doesn't worry you people are taking the law into their own hands? Was anyone at risk if the husband had just simply called the police rather than approaching the suspect? Notice my use of the word suspect rather than culprit because it isn't for victims to dish out justice? Has this rule changed recently?



there are more situations than that to consider, i dont' have a husband, i have ME to protect myself and my own....if a shotgun gets the job done over a stupid rolling pin, so be it.  Amen and please pass the ammo.

_____________________________

i am woman! er, godzilla! hear me roar!

http://wavcentral.com/cgi-bin/log/log.cgi?id=2856&sound=/sounds/movies/godzilla/roar.mp3


He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

(in reply to FullCircle)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 6:08:05 PM   
FullCircle


Posts: 5713
Joined: 11/24/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117
quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle
It doesn't worry you people are taking the law into their own hands? Was anyone at risk if the husband had just simply called the police rather than approaching the suspect? Notice my use of the word suspect rather than culprit because it isn't for victims to dish out justice? Has this rule changed recently?


It's funny to see you reply like this. I just finished answering a post of yours that talked about how sad it was that people had to answer their doors with guns. And yet you now indicate that the mere act of crossing the street is taking the law into your own hands.

Why is it sad to have to have a gun to answer your door, but you see someone walking across a street as 'taking the law into their own hands?'


Let me put a different spin on things for one moment.

A woman thinks she sees someone that looks like the person that mugged her, she tells her husband who confronts the suspect with a gun, and the suspect sees an approaching threat pulls out his gun and panics. Someone shoots first, someone dies. The husband approaches the dead body with wife not far behind. The wife says "That's not him." The husband says "fuck we better not tell anyone the truth and I hope there are no witnesses."

It’s for a court to decide because some people remind us of other people.

Strange you seem to be approving of circumventing that system. In South Africa the police will even help you cover up a crime for a fee, used to be the case anyway. You wasn’t there with that husband and wife neither was I and yet you believe the couple over the man who can no longer defend himself. God knows what other possibilities could have existed such an irate husband discovering an affaire and a wife helping someone that made a stupid mistake cover up a crime.

Why do you think you know who the victim is just because someone told you?


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Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 6:16:30 PM   
christine1


Posts: 6155
Joined: 12/15/2007
From: i'm headed to HIM...
Status: offline 		wonders why no response is given to my answer..maybe because there isn't a good one?

_____________________________

i am woman! er, godzilla! hear me roar!

http://wavcentral.com/cgi-bin/log/log.cgi?id=2856&sound=/sounds/movies/godzilla/roar.mp3


He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

(in reply to FullCircle)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 6:18:45 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline 		In answer to the question both stated and implied about the actual effect on peoples safty from owning firearms.  According to FBI statistics for ever crime commited with a gun four are prevented by armed citizens.
The asertion that if I fire at an intruder he will be forced to return fire (somehow impling that he is now the victim) I have been shooting for 50 years I was trained by both military and police, if I fire at an intruder he won't be able to return fire.  One final thought as a mid fifties overweight diebetic with arthrites what chance to I have attempting to defend myself against a 20 year old intruder if we both have knives?   

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Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 6:20:17 PM   
FullCircle


Posts: 5713
Joined: 11/24/2005
Status: offline 		The police used to be for protecting people but they take ten minutes to arrive and by then you would have shot him.

Good enough?

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Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Mateba revolver...I want one really bad. - 4/26/2008 6:26:07 PM   
christine1


Posts: 6155
Joined: 12/15/2007
From: i'm headed to HIM...
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

The police used to be for protecting people but they take ten minutes to arrive and by then you would have shot him.

Good enough?



huh, i'll take that as a "yes it's okay to protect yourself in your own home against a fucktard intruder."

_____________________________

i am woman! er, godzilla! hear me roar!

http://wavcentral.com/cgi-bin/log/log.cgi?id=2856&sound=/sounds/movies/godzilla/roar.mp3


He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

(in reply to FullCircle)
Profile   Post #: 100
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