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RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 1:54:30 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

quote:

So much so that when someone actually just states the truth, says what they actually want .... that honesty is attacked from those above in their Ivory towers.

And herein lies the problem. Stating the truth is all well and good until it becomes too much honesty to handle. For those of us who come down from those ivory towers now and again, or who don't even reside in one at all and post from the heart judegement from above is the gauntlet we face.
I see so many here posturing about how important honesty and integrity is and yet when someone is genuinely honest and shares it is like they have committed a cardinal sin.

quote:

Well I want to know this .. how many people know themselves .. and are actually HONEST about themselves .,.. can step down out of Ivory Towers, BDSMville, cut the crap and speak honestly about themselves.

*steps out of lego tower*

*Being in borderline abusive relationships gets my juices flowing - whether i have a safety net, escape route or not.
*I recently ended a relationship that was potentially harmful to myself and him and i would go back to it in a heartbeat.We were a potentially life threatening mix.
*I really do not feel emotion like most people. I am incapable of it plain and simply.
*Eventually i will tire of 'playing' slave and not settle for less than i need.
*I will probably then spend the rest of my days alone because finding what i desire is going to be very difficult. Think 24/7, no limits complete slavery with no love involved and you'll be as close as i want to disclose.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 21

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 2:24:30 PM

persephonee

Posts: 5089
Joined: 12/15/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

My profile changes have apparently got back to the Sub's Union and the High Dom Council ... my Twueness card has been recalled ... bastards. I say in my new profile that I dont think of myself as submissive anymore ... and yet I am still listing as a slave ... that I am looking for a Top but not necessarily a Dominant. I'm saying that I am way to self driven, independent and proud to every really accept that someone else is better at being the boss of me, than me. This it would seem ... is upsetting people ... or at least the Poll as indicated by my overflowing inbox of moral outrage would indicate. So far I am postively identified by the Resident Spotters as - a fake, a wannabe, a man, a brat, a SAM, a newbie, a man hating lesbian, damaged, derrange, one person says I want my daddy, someone else says something about rice in my shoes, and at least 14 people wonder if i would like a quick fuck (I messages them back first - come on guys .. a fuck is a fuck)

yay for internet pick up sites!

A lot of time is spent posturing on web boards ( I should know, I have done it often enough) about the perfection and wonder of BDSM, about the one true way, How M/s or D/s is something somehow sublime and spiritual, that it is better than vanilla and somehow our way of being is purer and greater than those poor mere mortal vanillas.

So much so that when someone actually just states the truth, says what they actually want .... that honesty is attacked from those above in their Ivory towers. I will hold my hand up and admit to being fairly snotty towards some dynamics .. have certainly pissed in some people's cheerios on here over the years .. I was usually pissing on the person(s) involved rather than the ideal dynamic they shared ... (I usually get that bit wrong and hate the sinner rather than the sin - oops)

Any how .. to my point about Ivory towers ... Another thread is talking about knowing yourself ... and linking it to Mastery. Well I want to know this .. how many people know themselves .. and are actually HONEST about themselves .,.. can step down out of Ivory Towers, BDSMville, cut the crap and speak honestly about themselves.

Here is me having a go.

Being in borderline abusive relationships (personal/sexual/professional) gets my juices flowing - as long as I have an escape route and a safety net.

I am arrogant enough to know that I will never find anyone who is the boss of me, better than I am.

I will never be made to do something I do not wish to do ... It might look that way, but it will never actually happen.

I like being a heavy player because people look at me and flinch .. that turns me on.

If I was a thin, beautiful woman who could walk into any bar and get the attention I want ... I would be as vanilla as the ay is long.

I could go on ... but it would spoil my profile.

So anyway, try stepping out of the Ivory Tower and trying some real brutal honesty

softness....

At the risk of being grouped into the heretic corner awaiting my stoning...i tend to agree with almost everything you said here...ill go check out your profile in a second. i do think that this most recent spate of introspection might be related to a stage youre going thru over your most recent relationship ending. Youre just shedding your skin and the new softness will be better than the last. i can hardly wait to meet her.

good girl.

~perse~

p.s. Whats with the rice in the shoes bit?

_____________________________

You be the Captain; i'll be no one.

And You can carry me away....if You want to. ~Kasey Chambers

E*Whore, extraordinaire....

Nothing is exactly as it seems~Nor, is it otherwise.

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 22

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 2:34:04 PM

Lashra

Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline

softness, honestly be who you are and just don't give a shit what other people think. I get messages all the time saying I'm fake, I'm this and that. Do I care? Hell no why should I? It is my life and my profile I will do them both as I please.

On the net people tend to act like jerks because it makes them feel special. I make them feel even more special by ignoring them or actually putting them on ignore.

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 23

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 2:36:11 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

This is one of the times when I am glad to not be active in the local scene anymore with a whole host of narrow-minded people ready to decree me unfit for society, because as I grow more and more, the path I take splits farther and farther from the entity called "BDSM".

I don't think I am in an Ivory Tower though, because I think I am pretty self aware and honest about who I am in my writings here....intense personality, mild temper, intellectually arrogant, enjoyer of petty sadism, and someone who has made a hell of a lot of stakes in the past regarding his own personal life.

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness
Here is my thinking ... I know I make a pretty amazing boss of me ... I know of almost no one who I would trust to be a better one. You knew that someone with a better ego than yours would win your trust and confidence. What I KNOW will win mine is a statement like this from a partner .... " you know what, you dont need me to tell you how to run your life, because you do it great so I'm not going to pretend these things are for your good. I'm going to be honest and not spin any bull and just say they are for my benefit, because they make me happier - so would you do this for me? Oh yeah, and I trust your judgement, so when you think I *am* spouting a load of crap, I want you to tell me and do what you know is best"

I understand where you are coming from with this and I tend to agree with it in less flippant terms. It actually goes to a pet peeve of mine that has been boiling under my skin that I was discussing with another poster recently. The fact that in a world of posturing, carciatures of dominants, and fantasies, strong, practical and good leadership skills and tactics often get perceived as being "weak dominance". I'm even considered starting a thread to elaborate on it.

Hell, I am not immune. If you had asked my opinion a year ago, I would have considered what you wrote above to be the words of a "weak dominant", but luckily, hard knocks and good influences have changed that a bit.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 24

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 2:45:10 PM

califsue

Posts: 593
Joined: 2/2/2008
Status: offline

Softness...when I viewed your profile recently what I saw was a woman with a no holds/bull approach to life who knows who she is and what makes her happy. I am sorry to hear you have idiots tearing into you right and left. We all make our own life in this path that so many refer to BDSM/lifestyle and I don't believe one way is better or Twuer than the other. I say more power to you for being real to yourself and your needs. Not all of us at such a young age know that. May you continue to grow and learn and stretch yourself as you continue to experience life and your journey.

I wish you the best.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 25

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 2:48:39 PM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
Status: offline

It's been about a month or so since I told you, MR, but you are one amazing young man. Ditto to all you said and congrats on the maturity and wisdom you continue to gain. Anyone who thinks youth means one isn't yet wise hasn't encountered you.

Blessings,
luci

_____________________________

To choose a good book, look in an inquisitor’s prohibited list. ~John Aikin

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 26

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 3:18:45 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit
I understand where you are coming from with this and I tend to agree with it in less flippant terms. It actually goes to a pet peeve of mine that has been boiling under my skin that I was discussing with another poster recently. The fact that in a world of posturing, carciatures of dominants, and fantasies, strong, practical and good leadership skills and tactics often get perceived as being "weak dominance".

*sighs* I actually find it rather astonishing that entire areas of human accumulated knowledge and wisdom are so routinely tossed aside. Neither relationship skills or leadership skills are unique to the BDSM sphere and there are in-depth and excellent bodies of knowledge about them.

Good for you Mad... you can join me in the rejects corner of the BDSM world advocating for ... you know... common sense and all.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 27

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 3:28:06 PM

persephonee

Posts: 5089
Joined: 12/15/2007
Status: offline

~FR~
Upon reviewing your profile...i think you should actually take your original post and integrate that into the profile...youre clearer here than there....
have a great weekend....

perse

eta...that was to softness....but Leadership...you have a great weekend too.

_____________________________

You be the Captain; i'll be no one.

And You can carry me away....if You want to. ~Kasey Chambers

E*Whore, extraordinaire....

Nothing is exactly as it seems~Nor, is it otherwise.

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 28

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 3:34:13 PM

OneMoreWaste

Posts: 910
Joined: 8/24/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness
A lot of time is spent posturing on web boards ( I should know, I have done it often enough) about the perfection and wonder of BDSM, about the one true way, How M/s or D/s is something somehow sublime and spiritual, that it is better than vanilla and somehow our way of being is purer and greater than those poor mere mortal vanillas.
(snip)
I will hold my hand up and admit to being fairly snotty towards some dynamics .. have certainly pissed in some people's cheerios on here over the years .. I was usually pissing on the person(s) involved rather than the ideal dynamic they shared ... (I usually get that bit wrong and hate the sinner rather than the sin - oops)
(snip)
If I was a thin, beautiful woman who could walk into any bar and get the attention I want ... I would be as vanilla as the ay is long.

So BDSM is just a tool you have no real interest in, yet you enjoy judging other people in the lifestyle, and make fun of the people who feel it is an important part of their lives.

And yet you get hostile mail?

How 'bout dat.

But, I guess you're successful enough at getting attention, and have the threads you post about yourself to prove it. So, yeah, you have... that. Congrats.

-Wastie
(reppin' the Black Tower, for the record)

_____________________________

-and the few still remember passion over rage-

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 29

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 3:45:00 PM

IvyMorgan

Posts: 729
Joined: 7/5/2007
From: Midlands, UK
Status: offline

Honesty...

I do not know how to use a safeword, and even when I want to stop, people can ask me to carry on and I will comply.
I like the "edgy" stuff, most everything else can be rather bland.
I am inhibited by fear a lot of the time.
My limits are in places you might not expect, and with work, trust, and time, they will (and have) fade away.
I am unlikely to leave a relationship, even if I find it unfulfilling.
There will be times when I will avoid answering your questions, this is my safety mechanism.
I give good massages.
I become annoyed if I can work the toys better than the person topping me.
I am uncomfortable making a spectacle of myself, but love public play.
I swear too much.
Some days, it is too dangerous for me to play, as the desire to hurt/harm myself is too great.
I trust very few people, but when I do trust, you can do anything you want to me.

Soft, I do not think there is anything wrong with being honest, my profile is quite blunt in places. Sadly, there are people who like to belittle others to make themselves feel better. We should pity these people and marvel at the irony that we are belittling them to make ourselves feel better over a nice cup of tea and a chocolate hobnob.

Oh, and feel superior to those of us who have stopped getting offers of random fucks. I just get; "mwistwess, can i please be Your slave?" which makes me grumpy.

(in reply to persephonee)

Post #: 30

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 4:20:58 PM

stella41b

Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OneMoreWaste

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness
A lot of time is spent posturing on web boards ( I should know, I have done it often enough) about the perfection and wonder of BDSM, about the one true way, How M/s or D/s is something somehow sublime and spiritual, that it is better than vanilla and somehow our way of being is purer and greater than those poor mere mortal vanillas.
(snip)
I will hold my hand up and admit to being fairly snotty towards some dynamics .. have certainly pissed in some people's cheerios on here over the years .. I was usually pissing on the person(s) involved rather than the ideal dynamic they shared ... (I usually get that bit wrong and hate the sinner rather than the sin - oops)
(snip)
If I was a thin, beautiful woman who could walk into any bar and get the attention I want ... I would be as vanilla as the ay is long.

So BDSM is just a tool you have no real interest in, yet you enjoy judging other people in the lifestyle, and make fun of the people who feel it is an important part of their lives.

And yet you get hostile mail? How 'bout dat.

But, I guess you're successful enough at getting attention, and have the threads you post about yourself to prove it. So, yeah, you have... that. Congrats.

-Wastie
(reppin' the Black Tower, for the record)

Oh right. And you've sat down and discussed this with her face to face? But I must admit you've done a pretty good job of setting yourself up as one of the characters in her OP.

Think about it. Then perhaps think again about what you posted.

_____________________________

CM's Resident Lyricist
also Facebook
http://stella.baker.tripod.com/
50NZpoints
Q2
Simply Q

(in reply to OneMoreWaste)

Post #: 31

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 4:46:53 PM

OneMoreWaste

Posts: 910
Joined: 8/24/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b
Oh right. And you've sat down and discussed this with her face to face? But I must admit you've done a pretty good job of setting yourself up as one of the characters in her OP.

Think about it. Then perhaps think again about what you posted.

Have you seen my posts in the Mistress forum? I am nothing if not brutally honest with myself

I must admit, I haven't even read all 2000-odd of her posts, much less spoken to her. Hell, I don't know if I've read anything from her aside from this thread. But what I take from the quotes above is:
"Don't judge me! It's my job to judge you!"

And what I still say is:
"If you all you want is attention, well, congrats. But that doesn't bestow moral high ground upon which to look down on people who consider BDSM to be an important part of their lifestyle"

_____________________________

-and the few still remember passion over rage-

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 32

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 4:59:14 PM

CallaFirestormBW

Posts: 3651
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline

Since we're being brutally honest...First, I don't think a person has to be hostile to be heard.

Now that I've gotten that off my chest, here's my wrecking ball for the Ivory Tower. These are things people need to know about -me-... but I refuse to judge the value of someone else's choice, or try to make them feel like idiots because their choice isn't my choice.

I don't believe there is any such thing as "The One".
It takes me a long time to get close to people.
Being forthright about my life does -not- mean I'm confiding in you or 'getting close'. It just means I -suck- at the 'closet'.
I don't believe that "love" is a strong enough foundation for a long-term relationship
I don't believe in altruism or 'noble sacrifice' -- humans do things because it makes -them- feel good.
I expect to be served, and be served well. I am forthright about that. It is not for the servant's benefit, it is because it is what I want and need. If the s-type approaching me says xhe is there to meet my needs, I expect no -less- than this. I expect that xhe isn't doing it to be altruistic. I expect that xhe is serving me because serving is what makes hir tick.
I like needy, begging, pleading, submissive individuals who are willing to give up -everything- to someone who wants to control them. Just don't expect me to get all mushy about it, because that is not my style.
Blood is my friend. Blood is power. Blood is the essence of giving (or taking) everything. It is followed in a close second by fire. If you spend any time around me, you're going to be spending time around blood and fire, even if I don't use them on you.
If you suspect you won't like the answer, don't ask me the question, because I will answer you, straight up.

CFB

< Message edited by CallaFirestormBW -- 10/10/2008 5:02:23 PM >

_____________________________

***
Said to me recently: "Look, I know you're the "voice of reason"... but dammit, I LIKE being unreasonable!!!!"

"Your mind is more interested in the challenge of becoming than the challenge of doing." Jon Benson, Bodybuilder/Trainer

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 33

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 5:08:01 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

I thought, all and all, a pretty good OP like most of softness's threads even if she needs to work on a less snobbish and more mature presentation. It would be a shame if what has been an interesting discussion was detracted by that.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to CallaFirestormBW)

Post #: 34

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 5:43:54 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

Softness,

You are 24, you ARE young, and one of the things you learn as you get older is "never" is a word that is really sort of useless. Rarely and seldom are much more likely to be the proper choice. You just got out of a relationship with a fucking moron, who chose that moron? So, he was the person you choose give yourself to, not the best of choices AND not exactly a high grade sampling of talent in the relationship or dominant, even decent manly skill sets.

Now I love the fact that you are one firey chick who isn't looking for some dipshit on a white horse to rescue you, just remember, some pretty decent guys ALSO ride white horses, so before you shoot anyone who rides one, just make sure it really is a dipshit before you blow them away with both barrels.

Now, as for whether or not you are a good submissive, let me tell you, BSB sure as hell wouldn't be seen as a "good submissive" as those morons would define it (servile, meek, quite, no opinion) and can be hell on wheels when she gets pissed off. She sure as hell doesn't "need" me and I have never run her life but let me tell you this, when she DOES bend her knee to me, it means one hell of a lot to me and makes all the rest of our troubles seem effortless with the glory of it. So, when those little wankers whine and complain, just laugh at them, its really all you can do. Then, one day when you meet someone truly worth your effort, BE the submissive you are because you have met the dominant you need.

As for honesty, there are those here and certainly on other boards who think I am a mushy panssy ass wanabee because I talk about my weaknesses and I am not stern enough and all the rest of that horsehit. I just smile and laugh because generally, before they say that, they have to wipe the drool from their mouths.

You are intelligent, beautiful, and in my eyes, the exact sort of submissive someone who is intelligent, handsome AND talented would find to be a worthwhile challenge and an amazing partner.

Remember, the best revenge is living well.

< Message edited by SimplyMichael -- 10/10/2008 5:46:47 PM >

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 35

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 6:15:58 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

What makes you think that some of us don't all ready talk honestly about ourselves as much as we think is wise and useful to a bunch of folks that are basically strangers?

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 36

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 8:30:26 PM

smilingjaguar

Posts: 271
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness
A man/woman who is big enough to admit that, and say it to me with perfect honesty - that is someone who I would hand the reigns to - because they would know when to give the horse its head.

I understand what you're saying mainly because that was the one I was hunting. Unfortunately dominant types secure enough in their own dominance to know when to delegate to their underlings are a rare commodity indeed. Be careful what you wish for, though...you might find "the one" gives the horse its head a bit more than you bargained for...those types tend to like to delegate and forget it so you end up with a lot of responsibility on your shoulders.

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 37

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/10/2008 9:05:13 PM

NuevaVida

Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline

Hi softness,

It's interesting the self reflection we go through when something intense which we once thought fulfilling goes away. Like you, I'm learning all kinds of things about myself. My ivory tower...ha - that was in a dream somewhere. What I am discovering now is that while I have a pretty good grip on my life and the goings on in it, I don't really know what the hell to do once in a relationship. I don't have very good "healthy relationship" history to tap into. So I question my reactions sometimes - are they appropriate or are they a reflection of the luggage I'm currently dragging around from the past? I talk to close and trusted friends and ask them to hold a mirror to me, however difficult it might be. On one hand I think I'm a pretty damn cool person to know and to be with, and on the other hand I sometimes think I'm a loser who can't help but disappoint the people I want to love.

But it's a time of change, and I take it for that. I blow it, I kick myself, and I keep going. I'm scared to death to get close to someone so I try to push them away when I start to, without even realizing it (until those ugly mirrors come out). For me it's a turbulent time (emotionally) and I know it's just a matter of time before I'll feel confident enough to hope for a successful relationship again - One which I won't feel the need to project issues from the past partner onto the current partner, who truly doesn't deserve that. Right now, all I can be is self aware, honest, and accountable. I no longer identify as "slave" because the idea of giving that much of myself away again feels terrifying and too great a risk to me. I'm still in a place where all the thoughts and emotions brewing around in me are really overwhelming. I've been seeing someone who understands that process, but who gives me the space I need to work out for myself what I need to. I don't expect or ask for his direction in this, and he isn't proposing to step up and be Mighty Mouse who comes to save the day. If anything, I might be wearing on his patience too much, which is not something I want to do.

So...live and learn. There are no ivory towers. We are just humans in this world who are doing the best we can, who make mistakes, who feel pain, who feel joy, who strive to be fulfilled. If I can suggest anything it would be to focus on you and your own process, rather than what people you have no clue about (or they about you) have to say about your profile. You are awesome in my eyes, and hopefully in your own, as well.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to softness)

Post #: 38

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/11/2008 12:46:12 AM

softness

Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

What makes you think that some of us don't all ready talk honestly about ourselves as much as we think is wise and useful to a bunch of folks that are basically strangers?

tammyjo .... I did not say that people didn't do it ... I wondered how many did.

_____________________________

proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 39

RE: Ivory Towers .... and other false gods - 10/11/2008 12:49:14 AM

softness

Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Softness,

You just got out of a relationship with a fucking moron, who chose that moron? So, he was the person you choose give yourself to, not the best of choices AND not exactly a high grade sampling of talent in the relationship or dominant, even decent manly skill sets.

I would thank you not to rip into DV when He is not here to defend himself, I have no desire to sully His good name on the boards, that is His job, or no ones.

quote:

Remember, the best revenge is living well.

Interesting that someone who you called moronic, gave me exactly that advice.

_____________________________

proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 40

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