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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 7:15:00 AM

Dnomyar

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It was'nt the Americans who started that. Blame the Germans. They were are it way back then. There was a vote on what would be our national language. The English won it by one vote over German.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 8:19:46 AM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

I won't argue American history with you because I don't believe that you could ever see or listen to anything not made up by those who hate America. Your own past statements have shown a need to deny any good that America has done in the past and a pathological need to put down all things American. You are a sad, bigotted little man.

You are just sensitive to criticism of the current Whitehouse incumbent. If a leader of a country was destabilizing your region of the world, you'd be angry too.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 9:01:45 AM

Irishknight

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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

I won't argue American history with you because I don't believe that you could ever see or listen to anything not made up by those who hate America. Your own past statements have shown a need to deny any good that America has done in the past and a pathological need to put down all things American. You are a sad, bigotted little man.

You are just sensitive to criticism of the current Whitehouse incumbent. If a leader of a country was destabilizing your region of the world, you'd be angry too.

Grasp at straws little man. I could care less about truthful criticism of Bush. I despise the "Bush is a poopyhead" school of thought. The man is a fuck up. Its when people start singing of the partisan perfection of either side that I find such arrogant blindness annoying and, by its very nature, blatantly false.
It is apparent that you have trouble reading. My statement says that you deny anything that America has done in the past. Bush was not in charge for all of America's past. You might need to pick up a book with words in it some time to understand that. Of course, it is easier to be an antiAmerican bigot, isn't it?

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 9:27:21 AM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

Grasp at straws little man. I could care less about truthful criticism of Bush. I despise the "Bush is a poopyhead" school of thought. The man is a fuck up. Its when people start singing of the partisan perfection of either side that I find such arrogant blindness annoying and, by its very nature, blatantly false.
It is apparent that you have trouble reading. My statement says that you deny anything that America has done in the past. Bush was not in charge for all of America's past. You might need to pick up a book with words in it some time to understand that. Of course, it is easier to be an antiAmerican bigot, isn't it?

I think youre the little man, 'for it is you that obviously wants your country to be something it isn't. The US is a typical western country and no different from others, not better or worse. It is imperial, exploitative and pretends its foreign policy is benigh because as a state it is benigh to its own people.

What in America's past makes America somehow better than other countries which is what you are implying? WWII? You fought that in your own interest like every other country fought in their own interest. What?

You obviously don't read my posts about Britain in regard to foreign policy which is just as vitrioloic as my posts against the US government.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 10/13/2008 9:33:00 AM >

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 9:44:16 AM

LadyEllen

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Order! Order!

Crikey, its like the Welsh Assembly here, all the spitting and cursing going on

E

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 11:06:49 AM

seeksfemslave

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Who would have that that a thread on Whales would have generated so many animated responses.

I hear the people on the Orkneys are not very happy.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 11:11:41 AM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

It was'nt the Americans who started that. Blame the Germans. They were are it way back then. There was a vote on what would be our national language. The English won it by one vote over German.

This is an urban legend.

http://www.watzmann.net/scg/german-by-one-vote.html

However, it is true that the largest white European ethnic group in America are German, making up 40% of the population from European origins.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 11:29:40 AM

meatcleaver

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the Irish population almost doesn’t show any characteristics that would distinguish it from the British one.

http://strangemaps.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/306-the-genetic-map-of-europe/

Nothing better to do than browse because I have to work early tomorrow and my entertainment is in Koln tonight but I've been searching over articles of European genetic mapping and nothing I've found brings up any significant difference between Irish and British populations and no significant difference within the British population so just about all indigenous people of the British Isles are closely related. Sorry if there are any disappointed nationalists out there but your difference is not genetic and your blood is not pure. Men of Harlech, you could be men of Rotherham for all it matters.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 10/13/2008 11:30:57 AM >

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 12:54:22 PM

MadAxeman

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What bait were you using for this thread LadyE?
Lowbrow, Narrowmind or Windbag?

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 1:11:40 PM

LadyEllen

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not sure, but I caught a good haul

E

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 1:39:57 PM

Paulnz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

And a note to Paulnz,

Are you aware of the picture you are painting of yourself on these forums, how you are coming across ?

You are doing yourself no favours.

Woop de do.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 1:44:23 PM

Paulnz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Paulnz

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Then, the leader of Plaid Cymru had the incredible gall to think that the money for this prison should come from the British taxpayer as a whole (or in other words, from England);

Sounds more than reasonable given the plunder the English have got away with from Wales for centuries.

Hmmm, first what the English did to New Zealand, and now what the English did to Wales, methinks you think the English are the whipping dog for most of the ills in the world. Well, the ex colonised world at least, in which case you might have a point, but that is history, the past.

For the Welsh it is the present day. What I find peculiar is how the English presume to tell everyone else how they're feeling. When was the last referendum on Welsh independence ?

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 1:51:39 PM

Paulnz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

I live about 45 minutes from the current Welsh border
< snip >
From what I've seen, the place is far from fucked as you so eloquently put it.

Interesting statement, because depending on which side of the border you're on it's like night vs day. Step into Wales - darkness. Lights out. That's how fucked over it is. I'm not talking about the towns, I'm talking about everything, look around. Back into England - ping - lights on again. I noticed it immediately the first time, but now I find it depressing that the English would be so blind to this inequality.

< Message edited by Paulnz -- 10/13/2008 2:06:10 PM >

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 1:56:25 PM

Paulnz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

I assume you have actually lived a significant part of your life in Britain and know the relationship between those that were fucked and those fucked over.

Nope. Too much sense to do something like live in the place, but the inequalities are staring everyone in the face. Interesting when I talk to the Welsh they are usually the ones who raise some idea of greater independence. On the other side of the border it is the English constantly grinding on about how happy the Welsh are.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 1:58:09 PM

Irishknight

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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

I think youre the little man, 'for it is you that obviously wants your country to be something it isn't. The US is a typical western country and no different from others, not better or worse. It is imperial, exploitative and pretends its foreign policy is benigh because as a state it is benigh to its own people.

What in America's past makes America somehow better than other countries which is what you are implying? WWII? You fought that in your own interest like every other country fought in their own interest. What?

You obviously don't read my posts about Britain in regard to foreign policy which is just as vitrioloic as my posts against the US government.

I have read your posts and I level the same charge back at you. You haven't even read the last 2 posts you are quoting. I am not claiming America is anything but what it is. You are making an assumption based on your belief of who you think me to be. I am stating that unlike every post you have made attacking this country, we have done good in the past along with the bad that you are always in such a hurry to point out. There is over 200 years of past for this country, not just 8 years. If you are asserting that in all of that time noone had been helped by the US, you are blinded by bigotry or stupid. I give you credit for not being stupid.

As for making America something that its not, I have yet to do that. Our country is fucked up but its apparently better to even you than your alternatives because you are still here. I was born here, I have fought for this country, and I will die here. Maybe I will leave it a little better than I found it. Isn't that what we should all be trying to do?

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 2:02:01 PM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Paulnz

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

I assume you have actually lived a significant part of your life in Britain and know the relationship between those that were fucked and those fucked over.

Nope. Too much sense to do something like live in the place, but the inequalities are staring everyone in the face. Interesting when I talk to the Welsh they are usually the ones who raise some idea of greater independence. On the other side of the border it is the English constantly grinding on about how happy the Welsh are.

I doubt any English are really bothered one way or the other what Wales does, quite happy for them to stay, quite happy for them to leave if that's what they want, its just not going to effect them.

But if you haven't been living in Britain, how do you know about how how the resident populations feel about each other and what's your concern? Its not as if Britain impacts on New Zealand, there is no British foreign policy that effects you whatsoever or is that your problem, New Zealand doesn't register in Britain?

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 2:02:36 PM

Paulnz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

Paulnz seems to hate the English as much as he hates the Americans. I guess its because we are all "lazy, arrogant bigots who oppress the innocent so we don't have to work." That seems to be the core of what he keeps telling us.

I can explain my attitude thus;

1. The English ruined a perfectly good empire because they mistakenly thought that they were the centre of it and everything revolved around them. It was their racism;

2. The USA is best making stuff and staying out of harms way. Things went bad when they got the idea they too were going to have an empire, but pretend it didn't exist.

For both it was all down hill from 1945. That's where I'm coming from.

quote:

And, as far as the conquest of Wales, the country was pacified more by a single marriage more than all of Longshanks' castles. My surname is from Wales and, in fact, means "one from Wales." I spent a bit of time researching the history. I didn't condemn the whole country as fucked over because I saw one ghetto but I did learn a bit about the past of the region. It is one of my goals to visit Wales one of these days so I can see where we came from.

Err, so you haven't been to Wales? Keep an open mind and look around. If you know what to look for it will wake you up.

< Message edited by Paulnz -- 10/13/2008 2:04:53 PM >

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 2:03:50 PM

Irishknight

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My apologies MC, you did leave. You're in Germany now.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 2:15:17 PM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

My apologies MC, you did leave. You're in Germany now.

Thatcher drove me out, I couldn't stand her rightwing politics...hmm....and perhaps I should mention her lousy sense of economics turned where I came from into an industrial wasteland.

As for fighting for my country, fighting for my family and friends would be one thing, fighting for the British state, quite another.

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RE: Independence for Wales - NOW! - 10/13/2008 2:18:05 PM

Paulnz

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