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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:36:37 PM

RealSub58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Missokyst

I find women to be more brutal than men. Women can cut someone to shreds before they are aware of what is happening. It doesn't matter if they state their orientation is submissive, dominant, or vanilla. It is the way they interact.

To this I totally agree. And to use someone else's words, it's all about ego, one ups manship.....and it takes all forms.

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:40:17 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
Either way it all posturing. For example, on the whole you do have some cool things to say, but it gets tainted with the fact that your words don't match your actions. From my perspective, you don't learn and you haven't grown in my opinon, maybe outside these board you have, I don't know because I haven't met you - but on the boards here and elsewhere, you are still crappy dom.

I definitely cannot agree with that opinion. I can count the male dominants I would take advice from and implement in an actionable sense in my own real life on one hand and Michael is in that group.

One of the things Michael is notorious for here is admitting to his own insecurities which fuel his own temper and venomous behavior. The thing about insecurities is when it comes to Internet correspondence, they are three times worse then in real life, because the absence of tone, emotion, body language, and the problem of misinterpretation allows for a large margin of error for one to project their own insecurity onto someone else's writing. Hence, it's easier with the Internet for an insecurity to flair up then in a face to face conversation.

Is Michael a reformed saint? Nope, but the differences in his behavior in comparison to the past is monumental. So his own issues get out of hand and so sometimes he flairs up and starts hurling a few insults....that's part of the slow process of growth. But to say he is a bold faced liar and his own testament to trying to change is bullshit solely because his old behaviors still haunt him is an injustice to the growth he has accomplished by the person he evidently tries very hard to be.

I still manage to piss people off quite a lot on these boards, but the differences and the attempts of change in my communication style is still a testament to me being conscious of a problem and attempting to improve on it.

I am not trying to contend with the fact that he has done and said things to people here that he is accountable for nor is this anything personal against you, but I don't find such a savage public bash of him to be fair or well-grounded in reality. That's my opinion and since Michael has been kind enough to provide me with words of encouragement in the past, one I certainly don't mind taking the time to write out..

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:46:49 PM

missturbation

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Omg lol.
I'm sure your good self and my bad self had a discussion in another thread about peoples opinions all being valid. We also discussed what was insult and what was not. I see no insult in what The Dark said.
Now i respect you for standing up for michael and understand your reasons for doing so. Pity you didn't show me the same respect when it came to my defence of someone.

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:48:11 PM

gypsygrl

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I doubt this idea of 'brutal honesty' is related to one's D/s orientation. However, I would hazard (as a hypothesis, not a conclusion) that it might be relevant to how sadistic one is.

I don't have a sadistic cell in my body. And, I find 'brutal honesty' difficult. The way I see it, the truth, when presented plainly, is often painful enough. No need to rub anyone's nose in it.

A thought: why is the brutal truth so often bad? Do we need to be 'brutally honest' when we're telling someone how much we like them? For ex: "I'm gonna be brutally honest here, and not mince any words! You make the BEST butter milk scones I've ever had!" It just doesn't sound right. My guess is somethings up with this, but hell if I know what it is right now.

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Post #: 64

RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:49:20 PM

RealSub58

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What, whom or why does anyone think they can know someone by their words on a forum...
~~that they grow
~~their intentions or motives
~~inconsistencies from post to post

That's an awful load of hard work to keep track of people whom you dint know in person..... and then to tell them with high polished rhetoric your words don't match your actions.

You cant see actions or behaviour or intent or motives on forums...you assume from words what you assume.

And then to judge someone isn't growing?

ROTFLMFAO !!

I'd like to see some peacock feathers flying out of my computer!!

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Post #: 65

RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:52:54 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion.

quote:

Pity you didn't show me the same respect when it came to my defence of someone.

I'm sorry you gathered that impression, but I assure you if I didn't respect you and what you were doing, I would have come down a lot harder then I did. You can compare our discussion to any other number of well documented threads where I got into a disagreement with someone I had zero respect for. But regardless, I am not going to allow my statements to be misconstrued.

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Post #: 66

RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 1:55:03 PM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit
I am not trying to contend with the fact that he has done and said things to people here that he is accountable for nor is this anything personal against you, but I don't find such a savage public bash of him to be fair or well-grounded in reality. That's my opinion and since Michael has been kind enough to provide me with words of encouragement in the past, one I certainly don't mind taking the time to write out..

And I always admire people who do find the time to write positively. But this is my reality, as ungrounded as it might be to you MR - it's pretty firm and rock solid from me - in fact from both of us as Darcy has overall authority to what I post. I don't entirely disagree - I said earlier - I find Michaels posts to be quite good and contains excellent material. However I disagree with you and I do find he has slipped backwards since his 'return'. Again, my perspective from the way he gets personal with specific people when they do not fit his ideals. And for someone who says he knows his flaws, he doesn't attempt to change them if he thinks he is right.

Like misst when she defended softness from you and various others on the other thread, I admire it. I think the show of support rocks. I find friendship wonderful. And I know that mutual back slapping is fantastic.
But, that which just 'is' should not need defending. It really just 'is'.

It's just each our own personal perspectives.

Just an edit to add, I do understand your not making it personal to me MR and I do appriciate that. It's all good.

the.dark.

< Message edited by Darcyandthedark -- 10/13/2008 1:57:47 PM >

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:00:17 PM

missturbation

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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

quote:

Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion

quote:

but I don't find such a savage public bash of him to be fair or well-grounded in reality.

Let's not split hare's. Same thing.

Did ya get my funny?

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:00:42 PM

stella41b

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Stella,

I grew up next to the San Diego River, I didn't know rivers were even supposed to have water in them till I grew up. I remember the first time I saw a river with flowing water, I was dumbfounded. To me, river meant a very wide expanse of sand between two hills where if you dug deep enough water might flow into the hole.

Okay, okay, but you get my drift?

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:04:25 PM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion.

MR - just to clarify - I have boobies. Darcy has the manstuff.

the.dark.

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:06:44 PM

missturbation

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion.

MR - just to clarify - I have boobies. Darcy has the manstuff.

the.dark.

Might i add that according to the soft one they are quite a set of boobies too. Anddddddddd considering softy has a on the large side nice rack, well i hate to think lol

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:07:18 PM

Durus

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Anything can be used as a weapon including the truth. If a perfect stranger walks up to you on the street and says "damn are you fat/scrawny/ugly" regardless of it being true it was intended as an insult not a "brutal truth" and when or if you defend yourself you can be sure they will whine "I was just telling the truth". We are responsible for what we say and how we say it be it the truth a lie or some shading of either.

Honesty is vital, being careless with anothers feelings is not.

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Post #: 72

RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:11:25 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

quote:

Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion

quote:

but I don't find such a savage public bash of him to be fair or well-grounded in reality.

Let's not split hare's. Same thing.

Did ya get my funny?

Ok, miss, your focusing on what you think I meant by my words without giving me any opportunity to clarify.

Now if you want this thread to go on for 6 pages where you unrelentingly tell me what I really meant by my words while ignoring any clarification I provide, then what will result is another "pissing match" where the goal is to prove one's self "right" at the expense of any real understanding of our viewpoints being achieved by communication.

savage - harsh or brutal
public - done in the presence of others
bash - negative rebuttal to a person's statements or claims

Now the sentiment I am trying to communicate is not an "insult" but rather a reference to the dark's direct expression of opinion regarding Michael's character (which coincidentally provides a nice example of some of the downsides of "brutal honesty").

Nor do I find it "uncalled for" as Michael has certainly used such direct expressions of negative opinion on these boards in the past so therefore what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I just think it's inaccurate and a year and a half of reading great advice from Michael compels me to say so.

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:12:27 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion.

MR - just to clarify - I have boobies. Darcy has the manstuff.

the.dark.

I am horrible with names. Take no offence at all

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:17:18 PM

missturbation

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quote:

savage - harsh or brutal
public - done in the presence of others
bash - negative rebuttal to a person's statements or claims

Pretty much MY definition of insult.
Not going to get into a debate with you about it though.

And as an aside i'm fucking upset you didn't laugh at my joke.

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:18:17 PM

subtee

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I think it is brutal to say we don't get irony.

You brits can't even see if our clothes are wrinkly...

< Message edited by subtee -- 10/13/2008 2:21:37 PM >

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:20:56 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

quote:

savage - harsh or brutal
public - done in the presence of others
bash - negative rebuttal to a person's statements or claims

Pretty much MY definition of insult.
Not going to get into a debate with you about it though.

And as an aside i'm fucking upset you didn't laugh at my joke.

I thought it was funny. I'm in "intense" mode right now and I forget to acknowledge some things when my brain is working like that

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:21:56 PM

missturbation

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quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

I think it is brutal to say we don't appreciate irony.

You brits can't even see if our clothes are wrinkly...

If there was irony in there it slipped right over my halo.

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:25:34 PM

missturbation

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quote:

I thought it was funny. I'm in "intense" mode right now and I forget to acknowledge some things when my brain is working like that

Intense is good, i like intense.
A man with a brain though *shakes head*, now thats dangerous.
Did i mention i like intense?

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RE: Honesty, brutal honesty and just too much !! - 10/13/2008 2:27:44 PM

BitaTruble

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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

I think it is brutal to say we don't appreciate irony.

You brits can't even see if our clothes are wrinkly...

If there was irony in there it slipped right over my halo.