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ORIGINAL: marieToo

There's truth (which can be backed up factually), then there's honesty.   I think the type of honesty you are speaking of is when we give a person our "honest" opinion, which to me, isn't necessarily the same thing as being "truthful". 
I see a lot of this online and in real life also.  I will even go so far, as to say that most of the people that claim to be "brutally honest" can't take it at all. 
"Brutal honesty" is a phrase often used to be cruel and or mean.

I don't know why I felt the need to differentiate, but having said that, I've often found that people who claim to be "brutally honest" are really just looking for an acceptable way to be hurtful and insulting.


There have been times when someone I was involved with personally was a complete asshole (privately), and I felt that they deserved to be verbally bitch slapped.  In cases like that, I will be "brutally honest" without regard for their feelings.  But then there are times, on the boards for example, where there is really no good reason to put an opinion across in a hurtful way, then hide behind the whole "I was just being honest" card.   I have found that I can say the exact same thing to a person in a nice (just as honest) way, without being hurtful or insulting.  And I've noticed that when I do that, they are far more open and responsive in return.

Often our responses (and over reactions) on the boards are merely a reflection of our own insecurites, and of our own current issues,  and our comments are sometimes a pontification to validate something within ourselves rather than to speak to the OP about themselves and their issue.  Then other times a person is just begging to be insulted, but that's another story.

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ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

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ORIGINAL: missturbation

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ORIGINAL: missturbation
I see no insult in what The Dark said.

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Neither do I. I am just saying I disagree with his opinion

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but I don't find such a savage public bash of him to be fair or well-grounded in reality.

Let's not split hare's. Same thing.
 
Did ya get my funny? 

Ok, miss, your focusing on what you think I meant by my words without giving me any opportunity to clarify.

Now if you want this thread to go on for 6 pages where you unrelentingly tell me what I really meant by my words while ignoring any clarification I provide, then what will result is another "pissing match" where the goal is to prove one's self  "right" at the expense of any real understanding of our viewpoints being achieved by communication.

savage - harsh or brutal
public - done in the presence of others
bash - negative rebuttal to a person's statements or claims

Now the sentiment I am trying to communicate is not an "insult" but rather a reference to the dark's direct expression of opinion regarding Michael's character (which coincidentally provides a nice example of some of the downsides of "brutal honesty").

Nor do I find it "uncalled for" as Michael has certainly used such direct expressions of negative opinion on these boards in the past so therefore what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I just think it's inaccurate and a year and a half of reading great advice from Michael compels me to say so.

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ORIGINAL: MzMia

I always wonder if people really think others take advice given in a nasty or confronting way?
I have found that most rarely take advice given in that manner.

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ORIGINAL: MzMia

I always wonder if people really think others take advice given in a nasty or confronting way?
I have found that most rarely take advice given in that manner.

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ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

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ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

I can't speak for "d-types" (and think most of these generalizations are bunk--how about that for brutal honesty?), but I will say that dishonesty is almost always more hurtful in the long run.  There may be some situations where it is genuinely kinder not to be completely honest, but those situations are extremely rare.  Usually people resort to this sort of justification only because it's easier on their conscience.

Oh I don't agree, LaM. I have found I can handle the most difficult honesty over the sweetest lie any day. For me, as soon as I know someone was evasive or even somewhat dishonest to try to spare my feelings, trust is either questioned or entirely gone. If it is questioned, then way too much of my energy is spent trying to figure out "what is" and "what is not," even to the point of reviewing my complete past with that person and questioning all of it. I personally found that an exhausting and horrible place to be, and it sucked the life out of me. That kind of dishonesty may seem less hurtful to the one presenting it, but in the long run, it really is more hurtful to the one receiving it, even if nobody else can see it. At lest that's been my experience.

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And some people claim they want brutal honesty but can't handle it when they get it. In fact, thinking back, I've never known anyone who asked for no holds barred who actually could handle it. The ones who ask for it, IMO, always throw tantrums when they get it

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ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

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And some people claim they want brutal honesty but can't handle it when they get it. In fact, thinking back, I've never known anyone who asked for no holds barred who actually could handle it. The ones who ask for it, IMO, always throw tantrums when they get it

And this is why I live by these words "Never ask a question if I am unprepared for the answer"

The above took me about 35 years to learn. I do not ask another person a question that I am not ready to have them answer. Sometimes it is not the honesty that is brutal so much as it is the person that is asking for it is unready to have any sort of honesty given to them. You can't sugar coat everything after all. Sometimes a pig is a pig no matter how much lipstick you apply

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ORIGINAL: MadameMarque

When things are conveyed in an unnecessarily hurtful way, using "I was just being honest" as an excuse, cheapens everything.  And it's cowardly passive-aggressive.

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ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

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ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

However I disagree with you and I do find he has slipped backwards since his 'return'. 

ironic... it is slip backwards from time to time that reflect positively for me on a person as their steps forward.   When a person is making or trying to make changes, I do not expect prefection as they step forward... in fact... I become rather suspicious when they never slip into that rut.  When they do slip in.. I watch for manner in which they get themselves back out of the rut of past behaviors.

Argh, I loath writing out an entire post only to have it lost when hitting send.
So-trying this again.
I absolutely agree. But there is a difference between backsliding/reverting and two steps forward and one step back.  I watch the manner and the way they deal.  Not to would be totally naive.

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ORIGINAL: JustDarkness

I just don't see why brutal and honesty should be together.
if you need to be brutal....then I hardly doubt anyway that that 1 brutal remark makes a change. The problem is bigger then.
Better be honest way earlier in what ever process..then let it expand till you need to be brutal.

we can discuss a lott about this but as in every form of communication, there are 3 thing; sender, reciever...and message
is one of them not "ok" honesty or brutal honest won't work.

On a good day..my message will be more gentler with more impact...when I am pissed..I tell "screw you". Wel we can all think he the different messages will be recieved depending on the situation of the reciever.

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I am reading this thread and seeing people complaining about the pain that so called brutal honesty can inflict, it's intent .blahblah. like it's a bad thing - and yet, some of these posters can be the most brutal purveyors of honesty given.

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Dump him/her.

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He's just not that into you.

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Shes using you.

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You're being abused.

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They are probably married, move on.

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I'd read the thread, but after the first sentance gave me a headache because your grammar sucks.

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It's not worth it.

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Your profile is badly written.

I completely agree with you here Dark. I am guilty of writing some of the things above which could be seen as quite brutal. However i would question the intent behind the words. I have never meant to be brutally honest with that kind of post or intentionally hurt someone. I think though that most people who post here regularly have seen the sorts of Op's that lead to these answers so many times that the standard replies we give have lost the brutality to us.

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ORIGINAL: missturbation

I completely agree with you here Dark. I am guilty of writing some of the things above which could be seen as quite brutal. However i would question the intent behind the words. I have never meant to be brutally honest with that kind of post or intentionally hurt someone. I think though that most people who post here regularly have seen the sorts of Op's that lead to these answers so many times that the standard replies we give have lost the brutality to us.[/blockquote]

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I think giving an honest opinion to a question asking for one requires one, that doesnt mean a lack of tact or inconsideration.