RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency

RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (Full Version)

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popeye1250 -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 6:57:04 PM)
Sheesh, Abbadabba would be a continuation of Bush, tax and spend, tax and spend! And borrow, borrow, borrow! He's already rounding up Bush's people, he said Colin Powell would be in an "Obama administration."

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 7:03:37 PM)
the only reason i mentioned the bailout, in this thread, was to support my decision to vote 3rd party. there are more than 2 parties on the ballot in my state.

rulemylife -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 7:36:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 Sheesh, Abbadabba would be a continuation of Bush, tax and spend, tax and spend! And borrow, borrow, borrow! He's already rounding up Bush's people, he said Colin Powell would be in an "Obama administration." And what would McCain be a continuation of? Considering he doesn't have to round up Bush's people, they've been part of his campaign staff from the start.

juliaoceania -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 7:42:57 PM)
I will repeat this question... who pays for all the partying of the last 8 years under Bush...you know, those stimulus checks, the various wars, the largest increase in the power of the federal government since Lyndon Johnson in the form of Homeland Security? Who pays for the Wall Street bailout? Those 45% of Americans that do not invest in stocks, have interests in oil? Who pays for all the borrowing from China? I do not get you folks that think we do not have to pay off the debts we have... for crying out loud! Passing the buck... it is what most republicans suggest we do

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 7:57:56 PM)
sorry, but there are dems & pubs up there in DC running the house & the senate. the dems have been dominant the past 2 years. all those dems got elected in 2006 promising to end the war in iraq and putting the breaks on government speeding. they did not keep their promise! i am a registered pub and in 2006 i voted for the dems that made those promises. they all lie and say anything to get elected. matter of fact their approval rating is in single digits right now, lower than Bush's approval rating.... HA!......

MissSCD -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:00:07 PM)
*There are a couple of problems with these stats.* *First, they are nuts. Did you include the 700 Bailout in Bush's term, and the new stimiulus package they are talking about now?* *Who is going to pay for it?* *It is not us because a lot of us are losing jobs, and hours.* *Figure that one out.* *Regards, MissSCD*

MzMia -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:00:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania I will repeat this question... who pays for all the partying of the last 8 years under Bush...you know, those stimulus checks, the various wars, the largest increase in the power of the federal government since Lyndon Johnson in the form of Homeland Security? Who pays for the Wall Street bailout? Those 45% of Americans that do not invest in stocks, have interests in oil? Who pays for all the borrowing from China? I do not get you folks that think we do not have to pay off the debts we have... for crying out loud! Passing the buck... it is what most republicans suggest we do julia this is exactly how I feel! spend, spend, spend all the way to hell in a handbasket! No one should ever pay! Damn it, just keep spending! I have heard talk about another economic bailout and also more stimulus checks coming! yahoo!

Kirata -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:03:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife Let me ask you a simple question. Do you understand what marginal tax rates are and how misleading it is to use them as a method of comparison? ...Or did you just latch on to the first link you found on the site that said Obama will raise taxes? That was a Fast Reply, not a response to your post. But since you brought it up... I don't appreciate your insulting crap. If you think there's something greasy about using marginal tax rates in the comparison, support your claim. What a concept, eh? K.

rulemylife -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:04:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync oh my goodness! Sen. Obama has clearly stated he will raise taxes. to be honest if we go back to something similar to the Clinton tax plan, that would not upset me. hell, i voted for Clinton, met him face to face twice, once before he won in 1992 and again this year. i think he is a very intelligent man. i do not agree with him on everything, but i do respect him. my OP was information i obtained from a friend and i added a link to a website he gave me. if you look at that website it is full of positives & negatives on both presidential candidates. i found the website somewhat informative. of course we all know that alot of media information whether it comes from the right or the left, can sometimes be misleading/untrue. i was just sharing and hoping to hear others opinions. sorry to upset you, rulemylife. my opinions or decisions are just that, mine. i do not expect everyone to agree with me. Raise taxes on the top 5% of earners by a small percentage that will hardly be detrimental to them. Unless you are making a quarter million dollars a year you will see a tax cut. I don't get upset when someone states their opinions or decisions. I don't even get upset when people state facts that oppose my views. What upsets me is when people claim things that someone else told them are fact without bothering to check for themselves. It also pisses me off when someone lists statistics that are manipulated by dubious sources and claim they are factual. Even after the provider of those statistics clearly states that the numbers were being erroneously used by those dubious sources.

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:08:16 PM)
i never stated my OP was fact. it was information i found that i posted for others to post about. take a chill pill

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:13:32 PM)
oh and i forgot....the rich business owners will not pay those higher taxes, they will pass it down to the consumer or cut back on personnel in the businesses. the rich will not take a pay cut, no way.......the middle class will take the hit......ha!

rulemylife -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:22:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife Let me ask you a simple question. Do you understand what marginal tax rates are and how misleading it is to use them as a method of comparison? ...Or did you just latch on to the first link you found on the site that said Obama will raise taxes? That was a Fast Reply, not a response to your post. But since you brought it up... I don't appreciate your insulting crap. If you think there's something greasy about using marginal tax rates in the comparison, support your claim. What a concept, eh? K. My apologies if it came out as insulting. it wasn't my intention. Though I do see it was. The normal comparisons use statutory tax rates. Using marginal tax rates is pretending to clarify the issue my muddying it with concepts that have nothing to do with whether you will have more or less money in your hand as the final result.

rulemylife -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:33:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync i never stated my OP was fact. it was information i found that i posted for others to post about. take a chill pill So, you presented a link and statistical charts not as facts to support your viewpoint but only for us to determine if they were factual or not?

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:40:59 PM)
my OP was to promote and stimulate conversation etc about the issue. i enjoy sharing information and learning from others. message boards are fun for me. if i or anyone else learns something in the process it is a good thing, right? most political opinions do not fit perfectly in the dem box or the pub box or any of the 3rd party box. there are alot of moderates, no matter the party one associates themselves with.

slvemike4u -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:43:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync sorry, but there are dems & pubs up there in DC running the house & the senate. the dems have been dominant the past 2 years. all those dems got elected in 2006 promising to end the war in iraq and putting the breaks on government speeding. they did not keep their promise! i am a registered pub and in 2006 i voted for the dems that made those promises. they all lie and say anything to get elected. matter of fact their approval rating is in single digits right now, lower than Bush's approval rating.... HA!...... How were the dems supposed to end the war with Bush in the White House.

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:50:27 PM)
well i sorta wondered the same thing. they did run for office promising to end the war in Iraq. i voted for those dems for some of the same reasons alot of pubs i know are voting for Obama, because they want change and hope for the best.

rulemylife -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:54:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bestbabync my OP was to promote and stimulate conversation etc about the issue. i enjoy sharing information and learning from others. message boards are fun for me. if i or anyone else learns something in the process it is a good thing, right? most political opinions do not fit perfectly in the dem box or the pub box or any of the 3rd party box. there are alot of moderates, no matter the party one associates themselves with. Now I know you're a Republican. [image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m20.gif[/image] That backpedal would've made even W blush.

Kirata -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:57:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife The normal comparisons use statutory tax rates. Using marginal tax rates is pretending to clarify the issue my muddying it with concepts that have nothing to do with whether you will have more or less money in your hand as the final result. Well okay, but Kotlikoff and Rapson use marginal tax rates in their paper, as do other scholarly works I've come across that study systems of taxation, so the approach seem to be accepted as a legitimate metric. If you'd care to explain your point more fully, however, I'm willing to listen. K.

bestbabync -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 8:57:59 PM)
rulemylife too bad you do not know me. i am a registered republican. never denied it! just because i am a registered pub, i do not always vote pub......give me a break! but like many have stated in another thread about Colin Powell, all can be redeemed!.........ha!

BitaTruble -> RE: projected increase in our taxes if Senator Obama wins the presidency (10/20/2008 9:30:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata Well okay, but Kotlikoff and Rapson use marginal tax rates in their paper, as do other scholarly works I've come across that study systems of taxation, so the approach seem to be accepted as a legitimate metric. If you'd care to explain your point more fully, however, I'm willing to listen. K. Since marginal tax rates only take into account the last dollar earned, it fails to address the fact that dollars earned before that 'last' dollar are taxed at a lower rate. Say there are only two tax tiers and the top tier is 35% and the 2nd tier is 25% with a cutoff at $100.00 I earned $101.00 .. $1 of that is taxed at 35% .. the other $100 is taxed at the lower rate. I'm not paying $35.35 as would be assumed by looking only at marginal tax rates. I'm actually paying $25.35 in taxes. If you ask me what my tax bracket is though .. it's 35%. With that extra $10, I can go buy some apples .. or, you know.. oranges. [8D]

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