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LadyPact -> The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:26:19 AM)

This isn't going to be a popular thread.  I know this already, not just from the current condition of Collar Me, but the life in general.

A while back, I was watching something on TV.  Some spin off of the original Star Trek series.  In the context, the character said that those of today had a debt to those who paved the way.  Even though their actions would never be tolerated in that world.  The places they went and the things they did would never be acceptable.  While they were honored in history, their time was gone.

Yes, it was a stupid, bullshit show, but has that prophecy come to pass?  Are those of us who explored this world seen the end of an era?  Are we dinosaurs?  Has our time come to an end?

I'm still a Captain Kirk.  I'm proud to be one.  I still remember answering ads in the Blue Oyster, rather than logging on.  I was part of the old days and the old ways.  I'm out numbered, it seems.  Where are the rest of you?




OttersSwim -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:30:29 AM)

While Kirk was alive...it was still his time.

While you are alive...it is still yours.  [:)]




Mercnbeth -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:38:40 AM)

quote:

I'm still a Captain Kirk.  I'm proud to be one.  I still remember answering ads in the Blue Oyster, rather than logging on.  I was part of the old days and the old ways.  I'm out numbered, it seems.  Where are the rest of you?


I'm so much like 'Captain Kirk' that don't give a shit if I'm perceived as a dinosaur or last of some kind of dying bred. I won't take on a 'sensitive' pansy Picard persona or share my 'bridge' with a psychic 'adviser' and pretty boy with hair and a beard. I'll go on all the shore excursions my 'ship' encounters, hoping to find a unique alien to torture or fuck depending on the color of their scales.

However, I don't think that I owe, or anyone owes me a debt. I've may have gone "where no man has gone before"; but the fun I had doing so was payment enough. If I left a path for anyone - it wasn't deliberate, or contrived to set a 'one true way'.

Screw the 'Next Generation' - they aren't killing me off as a contrived sub-plot of whatever bad 'PC' story line they happen to be performing today.




thorkin -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:47:32 AM)

I so want to be Merc when I grow up




agirl -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:55:31 AM)

I've no idea what came before. All I have is *now* and all I've ever had is now.

All my exploring has had only one end......nothing I've done or will do has any significance beyond pleasing myself.

No thanks required folks.....lol

agirl










catize -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:59:15 AM)

If you want my gratitude, you have that—tons of it!  I appreciate and value all those in history who have gone against the status quo.   
Elizabeth Blackwell, Florence Nightingale, Sojourner Truth, the suffragist movement;  every man or woman who fought for positive changes so that we today have better chances and more choices. 
I acknowledge that my life is made easier in many ways because some one, some time, some where carried a light to show the way. 
Do I owe you more than that?




feydeplume -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 9:59:23 AM)

Personally i am a bit more interested in being on one of his shore leaves...

I hear what you are saying Merc. You did it your way and kudos to you, I really mean that.

But kudos as well to the people that stood up at Stonewall, the one's that started the sexual rights movement, the one's that educate therapists on BDSM so we are no longer considered dangerously insane, the ones that has the balls to set up sites like this one, and the people brave enough to have retail  shops before there was internet shopping.

The thing is, they also all did it their way. So do we "owe" the TNG anything? fuck no, they should be begging to kiss our collective shoes for making it safe for them to learn and play, to be able to but SM101 in major book stores, for putting up and maintaining sites like this and the zillion other ones that us dinosaurs helped build and create and protect and pay for.

But isn't it great that they are out there, the kids thinking, knowing that they aren't freaks or weird or bad and that they are safe and can learn how to play safe with things like fire and knives. Isn't it neat that, because of us doing it our way, making it up as we went along as best we could, that they can now argue the "right way" or styles and flavors.

Maybe i am just sentimental about it, but they are our spawn, in a sense, and it makes me feel good to see them pushing past where we have gotten and assuming that they can go even farther.

Besides, i like fresh meat.




LadyPact -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:05:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: catize

If you want my gratitude, you have that—tons of it!  I appreciate and value all those in history who have gone against the status quo.   
Elizabeth Blackwell, Florence Nightingale, Sojourner Truth, the suffragist movement;  every man or woman who fought for positive changes so that we today have better chances and more choices. 
I acknowledge that my life is made easier in many ways because some one, some time, some where carried a light to show the way. 
Do I owe you more than that?


Nope, that's enough.






eyesopened -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:20:08 AM)

I know where I was.  I was a confused woman who on one hand knew she could never be fulfilled in the role society demanded but on the other hand had no roadmap on how or where to be different.

I suppose the old days and old ways were fabulous.  The really cool part from what I can see is that it kept so many people OUT of "the lifestyle" like me for instance.

In all sincerity I appreciate pioneers in all aspects of humanity.   I can't repay all the pioneers in science, civil rights, government, medicine.  However, would it really be an honor to Pasture if I started drinking only raw milk?  Would it be an honor to Ford to buy a horse?

So what would you want those of us who are not pioneers, who did not know about the old days, what would you have us do?




junecleaver -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:26:42 AM)

I'm sure that in thirty years TNGers will write a post similar to this.  How we paved the way for the older generation to accept us, only to become the older generation, how we rallied to make groups +18 instead of +21 and now the new TNGers don't respect us the way they should because...blah blah blah.  History repeats itself.  There's nothing new under the sun.

Not saying this post is coming from a place of insecurity because you're some words written over the internet and I don't know you...but I find that with RL people...this attitude comes with a lot of insecurity and fear of being misplaced or dethroned.  I'm part of Generation Y.  As in..we are always asking 'Why?' Why do we need to respect you?  Why are you worthy of our respect?  Why should we honor you?  What exactly did you do?  We don't walk into a community and automatically worship its leaders.   Personally, I respect ability, not reputation, not how many references you have...but your ability and character.  Having an attitude of entitlement of superiority will not win my respect.  I find there is a LOT LOT LOT of ass kissing involved in the community and people feel miffed when I don't provide lip service as a form of gratitude.

Heh, like always...you take the good and you leave the bad.




MarcEsadrian -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:28:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Are those of us who explored this world seen the end of an era?  Are we dinosaurs?  Has our time come to an end?


In some ways, I think so. BDSM, fetish, kink, et cetera has become so pervasive and overexposed as the stuff of "alternative lifestyles" that it has all reached a sort of campy acceptance in the collective conscience of society.

I'm fully aware I'm a bit cynical on the subject, but I do think some of that cynicism is justifiable, considering the hipness these "alt" ideas have gained. I just avoid the esoteric short-hand and special watchwords altogether when speaking of what I practice. For me, it's not about theatrics, sexual expression or lifestyle activism. It's about the psychological aspects of influence, control, discipline, authority, servitude and so on. Abscond the t-shirts and you don't need to be trapped in time. I'd say don't see it as something recently invented and explored; see it as something very, very old, for in reality, it really is.





thishereboi -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:30:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: feydeplume

Personally i am a bit more interested in being on one of his shore leaves...


I wouldn't have a problem with being on one of his shore leaves, as long as they don't make me where a red shirt.




camille65 -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:36:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

This isn't going to be a popular thread.  I know this already, not just from the current condition of Collar Me, but the life in general. What current condition?

A while back, I was watching something on TV.  Some spin off of the original Star Trek series.  In the context, the character said that those of today had a debt to those who paved the way.  Even though their actions would never be tolerated in that world.  The places they went and the things they did would never be acceptable.  While they were honored in history, their time was gone.

Yes, it was a stupid, bullshit show, but has that prophecy come to pass?  Are those of us who explored this world seen the end of an era?  Are we dinosaurs?  Has our time come to an end? I think it is the nature of 'era's' to pass, I'm not understanding what you mean by 'we' and 'our time coming to an end'.

I'm still a Captain Kirk.  I'm proud to be one.  I still remember answering ads in the Blue Oyster, rather than logging on.  I was part of the old days and the old ways.  I'm out numbered, it seems.  Where are the rest of you?
I don't think you are outnumbered, at all. But then I am having trouble understanding the point of your post... what/who is it that you feel is fading?





DavanKael -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:38:44 AM)

I find when I am indulging such lines of thought (Not about bdsm per se but about anything), I am sliding in to reminiscing and I make myself feel old. 
I see few truly clear delineations between what is and what was as well as what will be.  It all flows. 
We're all part of our own personal 'In the beginning...", we're all part of our own personal 'end of days'; it's all relative. 
Davan




CatdeMedici -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 10:58:36 AM)

As soon as I exhale, that breath is history, as soon as I utter word it is in the past--
 
though I may not always go bravely where no man has gone before, I have-- by being--shaped a new era, by my very presence, by my very activity, by my preferences,  by my activities--though I will not be known in infamy by name, My very touch creates effect, change, activities, actions. It has set in motion a series of events that would not otherwise have happened--it is as simple as My 19 yo UM being very comfortable with all peoples in and out of our life, being very comfortable with selecting or  not her aspects of BDSM or as complex as defending marriages of different peoples--
 
No I have not lead the charge, but I have continued it, I have not let the flag fall nor the drum go silent. This is My legacy to keep the momentum alive by-- simply-- being-- alive.




CreativeDominant -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 11:33:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: junecleaver

I'm sure that in thirty years TNGers will write a post similar to this.  How we paved the way for the older generation to accept us, only to become the older generation, how we rallied to make groups +18 instead of +21 and now the new TNGers don't respect us the way they should because...blah blah blah.  History repeats itself.  There's nothing new under the sun.

Not saying this post is coming from a place of insecurity because you're some words written over the internet and I don't know you...but I find that with RL people...this attitude comes with a lot of insecurity and fear of being misplaced or dethroned.  I'm part of Generation Y.  As in..we are always asking 'Why?' Why do we need to respect you?  Why are you worthy of our respect?
  Because common manners dictates that you respect those who faced the brunt of society's disapproval so that you could exist within that same society with a much lower level of disapproval?  Because common sense should tell you that we got to where we did by dint of our own hard work?  That common sense should tell you that they don't just give you a doctorate like mine or anyone else who holds one and, if nothing else, the work that I put into that alone should be worthy of some respect...never mind the years I've spent working under that degree?
quote:

  Why should we honor you?  What exactly did you do?  We don't walk into a community and automatically worship its leaders.   Personally, I respect ability, not reputation, not how many references you have...but your ability and character.
You are right in that you don't automatically walk in and honor a community's leaders...because rather than being taught that, contrary to populist opinion, it DOES take ability and smarts to be a leader, you've been taught that those in charge just got lucky.  I understand that with each person that I care to interact with, I might have to show them that I have the ability to do so but how exactly would you have me do that?  Have you come in and watch me treat another patient?  All that shows you is that I can...it doesn't show you whether or not I am any good at it.  Show you my appointment book?  All that shows is that the people coming to see me believe in me enough to return.  But that doesn't "show" my ability to you, does it?  How about the fact that I have been in practice for 26 years and have built it back up twice?  Just lucky, right?  Couldn't be from some ability that has not been shown to YOU yet, could it?
quote:

  Having an attitude of entitlement of superiority will not win my respect.  I find there is a LOT LOT LOT of ass kissing involved in the community and people feel miffed when I don't provide lip service as a form of gratitude.
  But is that what they are really miffed at?  What I see with a lot of young people is an assumption...in many cases, a mistaken one...that an air of confidence and assurance is an attitude of entitlement or superiority when it is neither.  It is a hard-won, well-earned feeling of assurance and confidence in one's self because we HAVE fought the battles, whether it be in learning how to dominate/submit, how to build our business and keep it going or turn it back around when it needs to be, or in how to be a good mom/dad and not just a mother/father.  We've done all that and you haven't...why should we not have an attitude of confidence and victory and assurance tempered by our losses that you DON'T have yet?  Why should we not expect respect, as a common courtesy if nothing else, for those achievements?  I don't much care for medical doctors...way too much surgery and way too much reliance on chemicals rather than an emphasis on wellness...but I respect what it took to get where they are and to build the practice THEY have. 

quote:

Heh, like always...you take the good and you leave the bad.

True.  And like Merc, I don't feel like pandering to some PC point of view that we all must earn everyone's respect nor do I feel the need to prove myself to anyone...including my own ums...whose brain is not fully cognitive yet and won't be until the age of 24-25.




apple2 -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 11:34:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

This isn't going to be a popular thread.  I know this already, not just from the current condition of Collar Me, but the life in general.

A while back, I was watching something on TV.  Some spin off of the original Star Trek series.  In the context, the character said that those of today had a debt to those who paved the way.  Even though their actions would never be tolerated in that world.  The places they went and the things they did would never be acceptable.  While they were honored in history, their time was gone.

Yes, it was a stupid, bullshit show, but has that prophecy come to pass?  Are those of us who explored this world seen the end of an era?  Are we dinosaurs?  Has our time come to an end?

I'm still a Captain Kirk.  I'm proud to be one.  I still remember answering ads in the Blue Oyster, rather than logging on.  I was part of the old days and the old ways.  I'm out numbered, it seems.  Where are the rest of you?



We are Captain Christopher Pike.




agirl -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 12:11:47 PM)

 It's nothing to do with manners. That's just silly.

agirl








junecleaver -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 12:20:03 PM)

quote:

Because common manners dictates that you respect those who faced the brunt of society's disapproval so that you could exist within that same society with a much lower level of disapproval?  Because common sense should tell you that we got to where we did by dint of our own hard work?  That common sense should tell you that they don't just give you a doctorate like mine or anyone else who holds one and, if nothing else, the work that I put into that alone should be worthy of some respect...never mind the years I've spent working under that degree?


I was speaking in terms of the BDSM community, maybe I should have made that a little more clear.  I have a tremendous amount of respect for well-educated people and I hope to get there myself one day.  I have respect for people who own and operate their own business.  I have certain amount of respect that I feel everyone deserves as human beings.  Will I worship a leader in the BDSM community because everyone else does?  Tell them their scenes are awesome and their posts are amazing because everyone else does?  Tolerate their whining or gossiping because a lot of people think they are important?  No.  Basically...telling me I should think you are important because I'm younger than you...will not make me feel you are important.  For instance....you have a degree and the medical knowledge to deserve my respect.  I have met people in the scene who did not have the emotional maturity or skill sets deserving to be honored.  It doesn't matter how long they have been kinky to me.

quote:

You are right in that you don't automatically walk in and honor a community's leaders...because rather than being taught that, contrary to populist opinion, it DOES take ability and smarts to be a leader, you've been taught that those in charge just got lucky.  I understand that with each person that I care to interact with, I might have to show them that I have the ability to do so but how exactly would you have me do that?  Have you come in and watch me treat another patient?  All that shows you is that I can...it doesn't show you whether or not I am any good at it.  Show you my appointment book?  All that shows is that the people coming to see me believe in me enough to return.  But that doesn't "show" my ability to you, does it?  How about the fact that I have been in practice for 26 years and have built it back up twice?  Just lucky, right?  Couldn't be from some ability that has not been shown to YOU yet, could it?


Once again, I was speaking about the BDSM community.  Does the fact that everyone worships the football star in high school really mean he's worth worshipping?  I feel a similar phenomenom happens in the BDSM community, honestly. 

I'm sure you have all the tools you need to be in practice, etc.  It doesn't really relate to what I was speaking about.

quote:

But is that what they are really miffed at?  What I see with a lot of young people is an assumption...in many cases, a mistaken one...that an air of confidence and assurance is an attitude of entitlement or superiority when it is neither.  It is a hard-won, well-earned feeling of assurance and confidence in one's self because we HAVE fought the battles, whether it be in learning how to dominate/submit, how to build our business and keep it going or turn it back around when it needs to be, or in how to be a good mom/dad and not just a mother/father.  We've done all that and you haven't...why should we not have an attitude of confidence and victory and assurance tempered by our losses that you DON'T have yet?  Why should we not expect respect, as a common courtesy if nothing else, for those achievements?  I don't much care for medical doctors...way too much surgery and way too much reliance on chemicals rather than an emphasis on wellness...but I respect what it took to get where they are and to build the practice THEY have.


Why should you not expect respect?  Well...because that's the easiest way to not get it?  Telling me I owe you something for living your life, following your own path, and perusing what makes you feel fulfilled will not make me respect you.  You did what you did for yourself and maybe for the people close to you.  I'm not close to you.  I don't know you.  I doubt anything you ever did benefitted me in any way really.  Maybe I could learn something from reading your posts.  Aside from that, I just don't understand exactly how you braved this harsh disapproval and it benefited me?  When one of these "dinosaurs" can explain to my parents why BDSM is okay,  when they can make my friends accept it without blinking...then I will say thank you.  Otherwise...I don't really understand why I should 'honor' them for anything other than what I feel merits it. 

I don't understand why the old ways were better or why anyone would miss the days when their was so much misinformation and darkness.  We evolved.  We improved.  We have the internet as a way to arrange meetings, inform, and support.  I don't understand how that is less cool or how it makes the paving of my own path any more or less radical for me.





Mercnbeth -> RE: The Captain Kirk's (2/25/2009 12:29:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thorkin
I so want to be Merc when I grow up
Well you won't get there that way.

NOT growing up completely has always been a personal deliberate goal. I'm guilty of regular and frequent childish behavior and damn proud of it! It is a function of seeking fun, being ready for fun, being open for fun, hanging out with fun people, and being fun to be around. The trick is being 'adult' enough to handle responsibility, have integrity, and live up to obligations. Work at work enough and you get to be a 'child', play, and have FUN as long as you have the desire to do so. 
quote:

ORIGINAL: feydeplume
...kudos as well to the people that stood up at Stonewall, the one's that started the sexual rights movement,
I won't represent that I knew well any of the people involved with the 1969 Riot in the Village that centered around Stonewall. In the late '70's when I was hanging out there trying to earn my way into the BDSM version of 'Star-Fleet'; there were some who said they were there, or knew someone who was there. I imagine it is the same as the 10,000,000 people who claimed to have been at Woodstock that same year. They didn't think it was any big deal, except it pointed out to the 'entrepreneurs' that based on the size of protest turn-out; you could make money opening places which cater to the gay and or leather community.

As much as it may have accomplished politically, and as much of a political rallying cry it became; it occurred because of the exact reason sited above. The people there were just looking for a place to have FUN. Few know that it was a 'Family' (aka Mafia) business. The police wanted to close it down for that reason, as much as any other. Stonewall stood up when other's folded, but that was as much a function as to who was behind it than any 'movement'. The movement came later, the 'victors' wrote the history and now you have a legend, like that of Kirk.

All the 'red-shirted' crew were trying to do was have a place to relax and have some fun. The only piece of advise I ever hope anyone goes away with when they ask either of us for it, is to have fun and enjoy whatever it is you are doing. That's was the real agenda of the men and woman of Stonewall. Circumstances and consequences made it into something else. If you want to follow their lead do it on their agenda and seek a place within yourself to be yourself, enjoy yourself, and have fun.

Regarding shore leave? Any visitor to our neighborhood is welcome. We may not have a TNG 'holo-deck' but rest assured, you can play out your fantasies pretty easy if you visit our personal 'Enterprise' in SoCal. We 'beamed aboard' many 'aliens' thus far, a fair amount from the planet 'CollarMe'. We hope to our continuing mission brings us the company of more. 'Red-shirts' shouldn't worry; we always keep our phasers on 'stun'.

Hell - If you really want to accompany me, us actually, on a great 'shore-leave'; plan on coming to the Folsom Street Fair in SF; every year its the last Sunday in September. This year its September 27th. Last year was impossible to describe; ending with beth's topless woman's protest march down 12th Street after closing the Eagle Bar on Sunday night - check that Monday morning. Even that was, like Stonewall, a function of hapenstance; she already gave her shirt to the bouncer at the door of the Eagle when she went in, so being topless was not a matter of choice, it just was.

We've already booked our room inside the 'velvet rope' guarded by our great 'alien' friends from the planet of 'Perpetual Indulgence'. Nobody wears a red shirt, but you do see a lot of red asses and other body parts; however there have been no casualties from our prior missions. You're all invited to join us! 




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