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RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 7:58:55 PM   
heartcream


Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline
quote:

MarcEsadrian ...some of us "kinky people" are opinionated jerks? That's my guess.


I like opinionated, it is the jerk part I have trouble with.

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Profile   Post #: 101
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 8:04:37 PM   
LATEXBABY64


Posts: 2107
Joined: 4/8/2004
Status: offline 		oh great next they will be redesigning what kink is   i feel like i am in a freaking soap opera as the kink turns the never ending story of people out of place with socialism and idealolgy of the world as we know it   on fox news  we report you decide lol

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Profile   Post #: 102
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 8:14:42 PM   
MarcEsadrian


Posts: 852
Joined: 8/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heartcream

quote:

MarcEsadrian ...some of us "kinky people" are opinionated jerks? That's my guess.


I like opinionated, it is the jerk part I have trouble with.


YMMV on that. Otherwise, I reciprocate the sentiment.

(in reply to heartcream)
Profile   Post #: 103
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 8:23:13 PM   
heartcream


Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline 		MarcEsadrian, this was not directed at you if it came off that way to you.

I am sorry I dont know what YMMV means, I missed that class.

_____________________________

"Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague." Vincent Van Gogh

I'd Rather Be With You

Every single line means something.
Jean-Michel Basquiat



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Profile   Post #: 104
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 8:36:35 PM   
PhlossophurDomme


Posts: 6
Joined: 2/6/2009
Status: offline 		ymmv = your mileage may vary.  A cyber term meant to portray a flexible interpretation of words.

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Profile   Post #: 105
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 8:45:36 PM   
MarcEsadrian


Posts: 852
Joined: 8/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: heartcream

MarcEsadrian, this was not directed at you if it came off that way to you.

I am sorry I dont know what YMMV means, I missed that class.


No worries. Even if it was directed at me, it might be a fair portrayal.

(in reply to heartcream)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 9:10:57 PM   
heartcream


Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MarcEsarian

...it might be a fair portrayal.


That is too bad we could use a few less jerks about the place.

Maybe we could put collars on all the Jerk Dominants and take them to an old parking lot and leave them there all tied up together until they get it together.

_____________________________

"Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague." Vincent Van Gogh

I'd Rather Be With You

Every single line means something.
Jean-Michel Basquiat



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Profile   Post #: 107
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/8/2009 9:24:40 PM   
MarcEsadrian


Posts: 852
Joined: 8/24/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: heartcream

quote:

ORIGINAL: MarcEsarian

...it might be a fair portrayal.


That is too bad we could use a few less jerks about the place.

Maybe we could put collars on all the Jerk Dominants and take them to an old parking lot and leave them there all tied up together until they get it together.


Out of concern for being fair and balanced, don't forget the jerk submissives. There are plenty of those, too.

(in reply to heartcream)
Profile   Post #: 108
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 12:00:45 AM   
heartcream


Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline 		MarcEsadrian, True dat werd to the Mother.

Personally I have behaved in jerk-like fashion enough times but I do not desire to be one.

Thank you PhlissophurDomme for the heads up on YMMV.

_____________________________

"Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague." Vincent Van Gogh

I'd Rather Be With You

Every single line means something.
Jean-Michel Basquiat



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Profile   Post #: 109
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 1:02:22 AM   
colouredin


Posts: 4279
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64

oh great next they will be redesigning what kink is


Well there is already a big enough debate on that anyways to be honest

quote:


i feel like i am in a freaking soap opera as the kink turns the never ending story of people out of place with socialism and idealolgy of the world as we know it on fox news we report you decide lol


Was just wondering what this meant?

_____________________________

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Profile   Post #: 110
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 1:17:36 AM   
MmeZoe


Posts: 6
Joined: 4/2/2009
Status: offline
quote:

How do you feel about dominants wearing collars?
How do you feel about unowned people wearing collars in public venues?
Do you think we should strive for a more unified culture in public space?
Do you always assume a person in a collar is owned?
What is your opinion of people who go to BDSM clubs (frequently or not, doesn't matter) to play, but do not keep a power exchange dynamic anywhere else?
quote:

ORIGINAL: colouredin

I think its fine if dominants wear collars, especially women because chokers are also jewelery. I also think its find if you are unowned loads of reasons for that, I wear them if I want to be left alone, and they sure can complete an outfit.

To be honest I dont think we should have a 'unified' culture, (sorry I have a terrible image of gold stars emblazoned onto clothes). I make no assumptions about people based on collars and thats good, as a young dead sexy female sub id hate the idea that all unowed subs had to be collarless because for me its an invitation to preditory doms and to be honest thats not why I go to events.

Your last question doesnt fit but who gives a crap? Each to their own.


Well for a while, when I took my submissive in, she didn't wear a collar until I felt that she was worthy enough for one. So instead of purchasing a collar, or making one, I gave her a necklace that I had around my neck. She doesn't take it off and it is a more personal subtle approach, and it shows that I care about her.
Collars are meant to make a statement. That's it. A statement to a sub so that he/she knows that they are owned, and a statement out in public to show that this submissive is owned.
If by any chance we were to go to a public event, I put her in cuffs to show that she is owned. It's my own way of saying that she is my lover, my slave and my sexual prisoner. Sometimes I let her roam free and sometimes we are equal. The point of the matter is, a collar is a statement.

A Dominant can wear collars for many reasons
It could be to state that even though they are Dominant they also have a Master/Mistress that has requested that they wear their collar to symbolize their relationship.

It could be a sign of being a slave to BDSM (not a submissive slave, but a statement saying that it's a huge part of their life.)

It could be just jewelry

Whatever the purpose is... I don't care. Collars are collars, and they are all different to every individual.


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Profile   Post #: 111
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 6:55:18 AM   
Andalusite


Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper
How do you feel about dominants wearing collars?I don't care either way. Sometimes it can come across as cheesy FemDomme porn.
How do you feel about unowned people wearing collars in public venues?I tend to assume that people in BDSM public venues who wear collars are either owned submissives, or are wearing it as bondage for a scene that time. In public venues such as Gothic/Industrial clubs or Sci Fi conventions, I assume it's a fashion accessory.
Do you think we should strive for a more unified culture in public space?No.
Do you always assume a person in a collar is owned?No.
What is your opinion of people who go to BDSM clubs (frequently or not, doesn't matter) to play, but do not keep a power exchange dynamic anywhere else?I've usually only played in public clubs when I wasn't dating anyone seriously, so I don't connect that with a power exchange elsewhere. For that matter, I've been in a few longish-term BDSM-oriented relationships that didn't involve any D/s at all.

I've personally worn one particular collar/choker as a fashion accessory at clubs, a couple of others when I did some Gothic/industrial modelling, and a different one during play (mostly when I was with my last boyfriend/Dominant, and we were a bit ritualistic about putting it on and taking it off, but I wasn't formally collared. I've also sometimes worn a chain-link metal collar, but I've had it used on me/used it on other people more often as an impact toy.

LadyPact, I wouldn't hit on someone who was wearing a collar at a BDSM-oriented function, but if someone turned around and walked away if I just said Hi, I'd probably assume that he was rude and unfriendly, rather than that he was under speech restrictions. I'm aware that they exist, I just haven't run into people who express high-protocol in that fashion. So, if I later saw him with his Domme, I'd probably avoid both of them, unless she initiated contact with me.

< Message edited by Andalusite -- 4/9/2009 6:58:24 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 112
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 7:21:54 AM   
softness


Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper

quote:

The worst? I saw a women in a collar (not a switch) leading a guy with a collar on a dog chain


from another thread got me thinking. Many people support the "there's no true way" and "make BDSM whatever is right for you" theories, but then there's something like this. The quote was made in context of public play, does that change anything?

1. How do you feel about dominants wearing collars?
2. How do you feel about unowned people wearing collars in public venues?
3. Do you think we should strive for a more unified culture in public space?
4. Do you always assume a person in a collar is owned?
5. What is your opinion of people who go to BDSM clubs (frequently or not, doesn't matter) to play, but do not keep a power exchange dynamic anywhere else?


1 ... I actually quite like Dominants who wear something indicating there are in a relationship, just as I like to see both spouse wearing a wedding ring. It doesn't have to be a collar, but I am always warmed seeing a Dominant advertising the presence of a committment as well as the submissive.
2 ... as *technically* an unowned submissive I don't think I should be banned from wearing a collar. If in the future I earn a Collar then I will wear it with pride, at this current time I am not Owned as as such I do not wear a Collar (capital C indicating an ownership collar, one given me by by Owner). I do however wear collars, I had a collar put on me in play by Sir recently at a club It had a lot of meaning for both of us at the time but it was simply a collar for play in that scene. For my 18th birthday my parents bought me a silver band, which looks very like a collar. For the last 7 years it has been worn more or less everyday, it is my default jewellery and only really gets replaced for going out or dressing up. It is frequently commented upon as a "beautiful collar" and has been mistaken for an actual collar countless times. If someone said I had to stop wearing it to present a more unified public front, I would tell them where they could stick their unity.
3 ... 100% no. Though there are certain values I would like to see more unity on within the scene (education, awareness, tolerance) I have no desire whatsoever to become part of a strictly enforced culture. How I choose to do things, and the values I choose to have with the people I choose to have them with are my business. I live in high protocol service which is maintained when out and about, but I would never *ever* expect anyone else to live by it if that was not their choice.
4 ... nope, neither do I assume that someone without a collar is not owned. If I need that information I ask them, making assumptions is a fool's game.
5 ... Not linked to the discussion in my opinion. I have as much respect for people in a Top/bottom play relationship as I do for people in a 24/7 M/s one. It is the people who earn respect not their relationship model.

In addition. If it takes a collar to make a submissive Owned, the wearing of a piece of jewellery or leather, if that is the thing that makes the person owned then something is very wrong. The collar is a decoration,a representation of an abtract thing which exists between people. It is not the ring that makes two people married, it is the marriage that makes them married. the wearing, or not wearing, of a collar has little relevance at all to anyone outside the raltionship. Those on this inside may invest huge meaning in it, that is their decision. Any attempt to make that for them is rather invasive.


_____________________________

proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio





(in reply to HeavansKeeper)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 7:27:44 AM   
LATEXBABY64


Posts: 2107
Joined: 4/8/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: colouredin


quote:

ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64

oh great next they will be redesigning what kink is


Well there is already a big enough debate on that anyways to be honest

quote:


i feel like i am in a freaking soap opera as the kink turns the never ending story of people out of place with socialism and idealolgy of the world as we know it on fox news we report you decide lol


Was just wondering what this meant?



It was funny humor  lol   just alook at how standards change quicker then the stock market does
In life there is a natural order to things.  When we choose to ignore it  the powers that be remind us of it..
for example  skilled subs verse real ones  what is someones nature vs what someone does for moment of  high or buzz  so to speak    If someone wants to wear collar just cause they can or fashionable look  It is loike me wearing medals i did not earn in a war i did not fight or be apart of

(in reply to colouredin)
Profile   Post #: 114
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 7:45:36 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		LadyPact, I wouldn't hit on someone who was wearing a collar at a BDSM-oriented function, but if someone turned around and walked away if I just said Hi, I'd probably assume that he was rude and unfriendly, rather than that he was under speech restrictions. I'm aware that they exist, I just haven't run into people who express high-protocol in that fashion. So, if I later saw him with his Domme, I'd probably avoid both of them, unless she initiated contact with me.
[/quote]

There's actually a difference between high protocol and a speech restriction.  Protocol would dictate that introductions/conversations would go through the Dominant, rather than addressing an owned s-type without approval.  I'm not saying there wouldn't be a nod or an acknowledgment in some way, but at the same time, the boy knows it is proper protocol for you to address the Dominant first.  Basically, you're asking him to either be polite to you or to follow the criteria of the dynamic.  What choice would he have but to loyal to the D that is the owner?

As I would say about anyone interested in other cultures, I would think many people would be curious to attend a high protocol or leather event.  While it isn't what would suit every one for every day, it can be a fascinating experience.  Just the opportunity to watch the poise and grace of the unspoken understandings can be such a pleasure.  It's like observing service at the highest level in a five star restaurant or the dance steps of your favorite ballet.  Would you really disturb the dance just because you wanted to be part of the stage? 


_____________________________

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Profile   Post #: 115
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 7:55:22 AM   
Andalusite


Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline 		LadyPact, I think high protocol relationships or events could be quite beautiful, and I have no problem with them! If I were at a BDSM event that wasn't specifically high-protocol, though, and someone refused to talk with me, I'd be more likely to associate their behaviour with vanilla rudeness than with high protocol or with speech restrictions. Hopefully, I'd figure out otherwise, that's just likely to be my first reaction. In that environment, how would I know who his owner is, so that I *could* get her permission to talk with him first? (assuming that he and I were at the snack or water table, and his owner was elsewhere) I certainly wouldn't try to get him to play with me, if he were wearing a collar, but I don't usually approach anyone for play in any case (or accept an offer of play that evening with someone I've just met, for that matter).

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 116
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 8:02:38 AM   
Bearandfox


Posts: 5
Joined: 4/8/2009
Status: offline 		How do you feel about dominants wearing collars?
I don't really feel anything... I can  find the look of a collar on a person aethstetically pleasing, or not. I have known Dominants that wear them on occasion, everyone has thier own reasons.
How do you feel about unowned people wearing collars in public venues?
Again, the reasons are thier own. I like the look.
Do you think we should strive for a more unified culture in public space?
Given the subject of idea on a whole here, maybe a more unified protocal for public venues is the real inquery.
Do you always assume a person in a collar is owned?
No
What is your opinion of people who go to BDSM clubs (frequently or not, doesn't matter) to play, but do not keep a power exchange dynamic anywhere else?
I hope thier involvemnent choices are fulfilling personally to them. I really have no opinion on that sole basis. 

(in reply to HeavansKeeper)
Profile   Post #: 117
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 9:50:34 AM   
Interesdom


Posts: 197
Joined: 5/24/2004
From: England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper
How do you feel about dominants wearing collars?

I don't.  But then again, I'm one of those strange people who feels that if a dominant won't get on with their life without undue concern over what other people think, they are not really dominant.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper
How do you feel about unowned people wearing collars in public venues?

The largest instance of this that comes to mind is vicars.  I leave vicars alone; they leave me alone.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper
Do you think we should strive for a more unified culture in public space?

Who is 'we'?  Am I in your set of 'we' or not?  Do I want to be?  Do I want to be seen to be?  Why?  If you want to dress like me and behave like me, that's up to you - just so long as you don't pretend to be me or pretend to represent me in any way at all.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper
Do you always assume a person in a collar is owned?

Normally, yes, taking "owned" loosely.  The type of ownership is not always obvious, though: subs by a dominant, slaves by an owner, vicars by their God, fetishists by their fixation, teenagers by fashion.  However, if I saw the Queen of England wear a collar, I don't think I would assume she was owned.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper
What is your opinion of people who go to BDSM clubs (frequently or not, doesn't matter) to play, but do not keep a power exchange dynamic anywhere else?

Similar to those who go to a health club but do not keep a healthy lifestyle anywhere else; or those who go to political assemblies but do not have any other political activities; or those who go to church but otherwise ignore God.
So long as they don't detract from anyone else's life, it is no business of anyone else what they do.  In personal relation to me, I might consider them a bit shallow unless I get to know them better.

(in reply to HeavansKeeper)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 10:00:21 AM   
MasterDarkSadist


Posts: 60
Joined: 6/17/2008
Status: offline 		Being that no matter how logical of an argument one makes for either side of this debate, nobody is going to be willing to budge an inch on their stance, because they are taking it personally, I'm done.  I said my piece, and for that I was raked over the coals because I think having a generally agreed upon foundation for everything else that occurs within "bdsm" (which technically I am not a part of, if you go by my very own stances). 

On the symbolism of the "collar."  No, it is not the thing that makes the person owned, it is the relationship.  Would my slave be any less my slave if she was not wearing my collar?  No, she would not.  However, I believe very strongly in symbols.  However since I have a more traditional view on things, the more liberal crew is going to say that I am somehow wrong.  Telling me that the symbol that I (and many many others) take to mean a slave is owned, will put me off. 

Again, you may do as you like, because most of you are free to do and think as you please.  Being nonconformist can be just as problematic as you see being conformist.  The trick is to try to be respectful to others around you.  You demand that I respect your right to wear any fashion accessory that you wish, and granted you may.  I conversely demand that you respect the symbolic meaning that I (and many others) place on the meaning of the collar.  Do you have to participate in the particular lifestyle it represents, no.  See, I am willing to compromise, are you? 

(in reply to Interesdom)
Profile   Post #: 119
RE: Dominants Wearing Collars - 4/9/2009 10:05:56 AM   
colouredin


Posts: 4279
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline 		People are allowed to take the symbols as seriously as they like, thats their choice but equally it is anothers choice not to.

_____________________________

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There would be no gossip without secrets
I don't want to be anything other than what I've been trying to be lately

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELvfMJoKDAk

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Profile   Post #: 120
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