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RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 7:39:33 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lusciouslips19

I jusr wonder how prevalent it is to Demonize Doms? I just dont see that happening.  Usually the ones who are being talked about are talked about for a reason.  More often then not, Bad Doms continue and are allowed at events and the bad ones continue because no one takes the subs complaints serious.
Ahhhhhhhhh but you see, this is where it can get interesting luscious.  In my first post above, I mistakenly...please note the word mistakenly...described the second submissive as committing the actions that the first one actually did (the speaking to her friends about the way I marked her, etc.).  After that, several people in the circles we were both in would not even talk to me, let alone play with me.  That was one the word of ONE submissive, not several.  So...while I agree with you that sometimes, bad dominants continue on unabated, I do not agree that it is the case in most instances.  We all have our view and I know that in my case, it only took one submissive to keep me from having a local play partner for quite awhile.  It wasn't until my first submissive and her husband moved to Denver for awhile and she submitted and played with me in public at the local dungeon...even though she was a femdominant by then...that people realized the first submissive, who had long since disappeared from the local scene, might have been stretching things a bit and in fact, may have been the one with a problem.

quote:

People are human though. Most have their asshole moments and people love gossip. Some will never learn humilty or compassion and there will always be people who cant take criticism .  Fortunately, there are good Doms out there that are ready to learn more and soak up knowlege. These are the ones that seem to inheretly know how far to go and when to pull back. The dance is amazing with them.
I agree that there are those dominants who are ready to learn and gladly accept help...whether it be from dominants or from submissives who may know more about the technique that the dominant wants to implement than the dominant does.  I'm one of them.  Michael is one of them.  There are others on here. 

< Message edited by CreativeDominant -- 7/20/2009 7:56:33 AM >

(in reply to lusciouslips19)
Profile   Post #: 121
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 1:08:59 PM   
Ialdabaoth


Posts: 1073
Joined: 5/4/2008
From: Tempe, AZ
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyShoeBitch

Ahh.. I get it. 

SCENARIO 1:
If Human "A" falls of their bike, and Human "B" says, "Don't you know how to ride a fucking bike you stupid, fucking moron?", then Human "A" is going to feel like an idiot (which might undermine their self confidence) , so the next time Human "A" rides a bike, if they feel like Human "B" is expecting them to fall again, it could become a self fulfilling prophecy; and if that were to happen, they would more than likely hide the fact they fell from Human "B" (and all of their friends) because they don't want to be called a "stupid fucking moron" again. 

OR:

SCENARIO 2:
If Human "A" falls of their bike, and Human "B" says, "Oops, are you ok?  Don't worry that happens to alot of people when they first learn to ride a bike.  Can I show an easier way to try that? It may help to keep you from falling off next time."


Here's a brilliant bit of psychology, though: If Human "B" wants to be a better bike-rider than Human "A", and is afraid that if Human "A" gets better at bike-riding, it'll limit Human "B"s chances, isn't it in Human "B"s best interest to go with Scenario 1? That way, he destroys Human "A"s capacity to compete, and simultaneously proves himself a bad-ass to anyone who's watching - since clearly, if he's destroyed Human "A"s confidence with his scathing critique of Human "A"s lack of bike-riding ability, he must be an expert bike-rider himself. In fact, if he manages to find enough "A" victims to destroy, he may never have to actually ride a bike himself in order to show off his bike-riding cred.

You see how that works?

(in reply to BossyShoeBitch)
Profile   Post #: 122
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 2:20:47 PM   
subtee


Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

There's no such thing as a bad dom....only an incompatible one.


Oh man, I really disagree with this.


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Don't believe everything you think...

(in reply to IrishMist)
Profile   Post #: 123
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 2:24:05 PM   
NormalOutside


Posts: 622
Joined: 1/8/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

There's no such thing as a bad dom....only an incompatible one.


Oh man, I really disagree with this.


I agree with it.


_____________________________

I won't see your reply, because I don't use this account anymore.

(in reply to subtee)
Profile   Post #: 124
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 2:27:44 PM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

The incessant chest thumping and demonizing "wannabee" doms is a very bad concept.  Especially while coddling submissives that they have no responsibility in making bad relationship choices.

It destroys our community!



Surely these are people who are doing no more than finding their way in life....occasionallly posting utter bollocks on a message board. Hardly the backbone of destruction.

The 'community' will keep on going Mike.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 125
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 2:33:54 PM   
subtee


Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NormalOutside

quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

There's no such thing as a bad dom....only an incompatible one.


Oh man, I really disagree with this.


I agree with it.


You should read some of my mail.


_____________________________

Don't believe everything you think...

(in reply to NormalOutside)
Profile   Post #: 126
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 2:53:50 PM   
Prinsexx


Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

The incessant chest thumping and demonizing "wannabee" doms is a very bad concept.  Especially while coddling submissives that they have no responsibility in making bad relationship choices.

It destroys our community!



Surely these are people who are doing no more than finding their way in life....occasionallly posting utter bollocks on a message board. Hardly the backbone of destruction.

The 'community' will keep on going Mike.

I agree. Whilst it is possible to make 'community' as a group noun. and verb grammatically agree... as in the community thinks...the community is not a person it is merely a group and to accrue it with any reaction whatsoever is playing  bad sociology at best.
The community doesn't 'care'. The community doesn't breathe. But in my opinion the submissives, (who are supposedly being coddled by the community), do breathe and are making and taking responsibility for their relationship choices.
Even if those choices are bad ones (says who?).
How do I know this?
Because I am assuming that that so called community is made up of sunmissibes like me. Not exactly like me. Difficult as it might be to work with the concept of a community of individuals. Not exactly like me. But akin to me.
And I for one have my wires crossed when it comes to pan and pleasure. I have my wires crossed when it comes to control and freedom. I have my wires crossed when it comes to humiliation and praise.
I apologise to the community if this fucks things up somewhat. But you know what? I have actually met dominants who have their wires crossed too. And giving pain gives them pleasure. You know: it's called sadism. Humiliating me and those akin to me gives them pleasure.
Sorry (on behalf of the so-called community) if this shakes up the so-called social order somewhat.
And the beat goes on. And the beat goes on. Oh and the community.



< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 7/20/2009 2:55:59 PM >

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to NorthernGent)
Profile   Post #: 127
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/20/2009 3:23:46 PM   
HuskerDu


Posts: 5
Joined: 5/30/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

quote:

ORIGINAL: NormalOutside

quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

There's no such thing as a bad dom....only an incompatible one.


Oh man, I really disagree with this.


I agree with it.


You should read some of my mail.



LOL, I can only imagine.

(in reply to subtee)
Profile   Post #: 128
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/21/2009 11:46:45 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		I can't believe I waited five days to answer this thread and it became what it did. 

To recap certain thoughts, I'm going to disagree with some of the phrasing, if not especially the content.  It's a small point, but there is nothing that I found in the OP that has the potential to destroy the community.  It would be My opinion that, in fact, the community has grown in the past decade in ways that most of us never believed possible.  The good and the bad has come from that.  The full range of the spectrum of our hopes and our pitfalls.  What the next ten years will bring us, I couldn't say, but the last thing I would predict would be the end of the community.

I disagree with the term demonizing as well.  That's a pretty far stretch.  I'm not familiar with the thread that inspired this post, but I can assure you that I'm not seeing it in meatlife nearly as often as anyone would want to think it an issue.

Rather, have I seen people called on their mistakes, their lack of knowledge, their arrogance....... Yes, I have.  When their fantasy of BDSM doesn't quite match up with the reality of putting things into practice, you bet.  There's a difference between someone being guided when "I'm Dom and hear Me roar" and they find out that isn't quite how it goes, and someone who has had the opportunity to learn better, but refuses to be educated.  People living in the fantasy, that just happen to stumble into r/t, but think it all goes the way they have conjured up in their head, aren't a loss to this community.

This is something completely different when compared to anyone who has ever missed a strike or those who just haven't figured out the difference between dominating and domineering.  I've said this before on other threads.  There is a difference between a lack of education and ignorance.  It's not a lack of knowledge that is the crux of the matter.  It's the lack of wanting to learn.  Willingness shouldn't just be a word that applies to the other side of the kneel.

Too many people these days think that we should forgive anything and everything.  I'm not quite that politically correct.  Some of the best lessons that I ever got was when other people told Me, or I knew for a fact that I screwed up.  When I was called on My shit, I deserved it.  Those were My learning opportunities.  They still are.  Hopefully, I did better after realizing My faults.

It really boils down to one premise.  Is that person teachable?


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to HuskerDu)
Profile   Post #: 129
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/22/2009 3:49:45 AM   
Prinsexx


Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact



It really boils down to one premise.  Is that person teachable?


Dear LadyPact
Hope the move went smoothly and you found somewhere to eat. I have no idea of the distances or changes involved: it's outside of my experience.
In response to are people teachable?
Now that's a question from my side of the whip.
My experience?  Unfortunately on the whole no. On the whole I have experienced dominants who are arrogant, egoistic, intractable, consummated by 'the lifestyle' and without compassion.
Now I don't need to be trained. I have a full set of crossed wires for pain, humiliation and deprivation. But I have never ever given up my capacity to learn in all areas of my life.
The best I have been able to do is to release myself. Often whilst still in the full ind set of service and being owned. To crawl away and deal with my wounds on my own.
On the whole 'the community' here doesn't take kindly to slaves speaking out.
There's more but I need to get up and get coffee.


_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 130
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/22/2009 7:33:53 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		My dear, I certainly understand the need for caffeine.  LOL.

Being teachable is a wonderful concept.  We always talk about it in regard to the submissive.  It is rare to talk about it from the D side.

Why this is, I don't know.  I suppose it is that Dominants are just supposed to be omnipotent in some way.  We just all woke up one day, decided that we know everything, and that was that.  Oh, we'll talk for hours about how our s-types must always be learning, always growing, providing better service, pushing their limits.......

Yet, where are we?

Did our growth stop?  Did we slap the title of Master or Mistress on our own name and decide that was good enough?  All of the while, we insist that our boy or girl continue to do better?  So they grow and we stay the same.  How exactly does that work?


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to Prinsexx)
Profile   Post #: 131
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/22/2009 8:30:27 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		One of the best things I think I did, for myself and anyone that may serve me was to take time away from any sort of relationship and focus on being a better me. Everything from getting better control over my finances, my health, exercise, eating.

I got to know people that had been involved in power exchange relationships for long periods of time. Listened to what worked for them, how they felt about all of it. I watched people that consistently fuck it up and tried to figure out how and why. I paid attention to the s-types and what they felt was important and, tried to understand their points of view.

I knew I had the potential to do a lot of harm. Whether intentionally or more probable, unintentionally. I wanted to avoid that.

I caught a lot of flack. People told me I just needed to jump in and do. I ignored them. I think there is a fine line between avoiding reality and proceeding with caution. I simply wanted to have a clue what I was doing BEFORE I jumped in with both feet and fucked someone up. I haven't regretted it for a minute.


_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 132
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/22/2009 8:53:06 AM   
LATEXBABY64


Posts: 2107
Joined: 4/8/2004
Status: offline 		that is very cool and well said I think many rush in with blinders on or rose colored glasses and end up making huge mistakes
:)

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 133
RE: Why demonizing bad doms is bad - 7/22/2009 9:06:58 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		Kevin, it was my way. It isn't the, one true way. 

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to LATEXBABY64)
Profile   Post #: 134
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