regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (Full Version)

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crouchingtigress -> regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:33:06 PM)

Man we bandie the terms around so easily "Fake dom", "wanna be"

What is a fake dom? If someone is playing with power, but it does not look the way another might play with power, then they are "fake" why is that?

What is wrong with being a wanna be? Dont all folks start out anything they desire by first wanting to be it?





MasterSlaveLA -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:47:30 PM)

1. "Fake" = false.

2. "Wannabe" = clueless

Two dangerous things for someone who's supposed to be in control... "the blind leading the blind", and all that. 




crouchingtigress -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:50:56 PM)

What is an example of a false Dom please.





OwnerSeeking -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:51:28 PM)

I perosnally have viewed a "fake" in terms of it being a person only interested in satisfying their own needs at the expence of another. Which in a BDSM context can lead to one person not only being emotionally hurt but also physically hurt beyond what they ever may have desired.



Esinn -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:52:25 PM)

I misunderstood OP - deleted.



Arpig -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:54:59 PM)

quote:

1. "Fake" = false.

2. "Wannabe" = clueless

Two dangerous things for someone who's supposed to be in control... "the blind leading the blind", and all that.

OK, I see several issues here...
1) Who determines who is "false" and who is "clueless"
2) We all started out clueless, and perhaps some of us still are, but we are less clueless than we were  when we started.
3)Your "blind leading the blind" bit is also presumptuous, how the fuck is anybody supposed to learn, or do true Doms just spring into being fully conversant in single tails and shibari? Even the Marquis de Sade had to start somewhere....armed with nothing but his desires and a bit of common sense, just like the rest of us. We all start out as wannabe's.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:56:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress

What is an example of a false Dom please.



Someone who states they've trained/owned subs/slaves and has not.




crouchingtigress -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 10:59:58 PM)

I have never met any one that was really like that, if you talk to those that other folks feel are selfish, often you find out that they were upfront about what they wanted, and there were grave misunderstandings from each person which was the "fault" of a lack of communication.




NormalOutside -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:00:50 PM)

Apparently everybody has their own definition of what "fake" means.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:04:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

1. "Fake" = false.

2. "Wannabe" = clueless

Two dangerous things for someone who's supposed to be in control... "the blind leading the blind", and all that.

OK, I see several issues here...
1) Who determines who is "false" and who is "clueless"


The person with a brain that questions the idiot that tosses about the "You're my property" after 2 emails, for example.

quote:

 
2) We all started out clueless, and perhaps some of us still are, but we are less clueless than we were  when we started.


See last post... clueless is fine as long as the person ADMITS they're a newbie and clueless.  Shocker... many don't. (GASP), for obvious reasons.

quote:


3)Your "blind leading the blind" bit is also presumptuous, how the fuck is anybody supposed to learn, or do true Doms just spring into being fully conversant in single tails and shibari? Even the Marquis de Sade had to start somewhere....armed with nothing but his desires and a bit of common sense, just like the rest of us. We all start out as wannabe's.


See above answer and last post.  You can't be so naive as to think many don't come here and PRETEND to be Toppy in order to get laid.  Yes (DOUBLE GASP) it happens.  Psst... many will say/do anything to get laid.




Arpig -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:06:20 PM)

quote:

Someone who states they've trained/owned subs/slaves and has not.

No, that would not make him/her a fake, it would make him/her a liar. If a vanilla person (or a submissive) were to claim they were a Dom, then he/she would be a fake Dom.

Being a Dominant or submissive is something innate, it is similar to sexual orientation. Being a fake Dominant is like being a fake homosexual. I have encountered fakes on here, they have a profile describing themselves as a Dominant, and they send me a CMail stating they are a slave and live only to serve me. Now this person is either a fake Dominant, or a fake slave, I don't know which, but definatly a fake. Also the girls from Ghana and Nigeria tend to be fakes (fake girls to be precise).





Danemora -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:08:17 PM)

It really ultimately boils down to an individual's subjective criteria for determining what constitutes "fake" or "wannabe."  Its not like we can go to the BDSM DMV to take a test and obtain a license that demonstrates we are who we claim we are.  I dont know about anyone else, but I honestly sure as heck didnt come out of my mama's womb with the knowledge that I have gained over the years.  I knew what I was, but like any fine craft...it requires skills that must be honed.  That takes time and dedication.

I personally hate to see people painted with such a broad brush.  How many people have been written off as "fake" or a "wannabe", but really were just novice individuals trying to find their way in the BDSM world?   Who is to say that with some time and guidance, that fake wannabe couldnt turn out to be a phenomenal dominant?

Now dont get me wrong, there are dangerous people out there among all of us.  People who will unfortunately claim to be dominant as a means of being able to access potential victims for their own agenda that is about as far from BDSM as you can actually get.  These are the folks that I personally am concerned about. 



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:09:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress

I have never met any one that was really like that, if you talk to those that other folks feel are selfish, often you find out that they were upfront about what they wanted, and there were grave misunderstandings from each person which was the "fault" of a lack of communication.



You're lucky... many have very obviously visited the "Castle Realm" type of site and then parrot that garbage to potentials under the guise of being the Uber Dommy-Dom whose trained and owned "many", but have likely only dominated their cat.  Makes it very obvious they're lying about their experience and pulled that shit off some fantasy kink site.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:10:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

Someone who states they've trained/owned subs/slaves and has not.

No, that would not make him/her a fake, it would make him/her a liar.



Bullshit... but you're welcome to your view.



crouchingtigress -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:11:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

1. "Fake" = false.

2. "Wannabe" = clueless

Two dangerous things for someone who's supposed to be in control... "the blind leading the blind", and all that.

OK, I see several issues here...
1) Who determines who is "false" and who is "clueless"
2) We all started out clueless, and perhaps some of us still are, but we are less clueless than we were  when we started.
3)Your "blind leading the blind" bit is also presumptuous, how the fuck is anybody supposed to learn, or do true Doms just spring into being fully conversant in single tails and shibari? Even the Marquis de Sade had to start somewhere....armed with nothing but his desires and a bit of common sense, just like the rest of us. We all start out as wannabe's.




Excellent point Arpig, and I would ad that when folks start saying being new and being inexperienced is "dangerous", they might not realise it but being it is my experience, that being an alarmist is also dangerous, because it creates fear around being new, which means folks tend to posture about having more experience.

And calling folks "wannabes" can create fear around making mistakes, so folks hide thier questions and make thier mistakes in private where they are not as likely to be labeled dangerous.

Every Dom I know has had a life or death oops at some point, talking about those ooopses openly and with out the fear of being labeled  is the only way I know of learning from others mistakes...and not having to make your own as much.

I wish we embraced our wannabes and our newbies, instead of marginalising them so that they feel they have to make all their mistakes in private.




WyldHrt -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:13:18 PM)

quote:

Your "blind leading the blind" bit is also presumptuous, how the fuck is anybody supposed to learn, or do true Doms just spring into being fully conversant in single tails and shibari?

You mean you didn't??? FAKE!!! [:D]

The only folks I call fake are scammers and those pretending to be what they are not (and by that I mean things like men pretending to be women, people who use photos of other people, things like that.) Note that this isn't limited to Doms, there are plenty of fake "subs" out there, too.




crouchingtigress -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:18:41 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Danemora

It really ultimately boils down to an individual's subjective criteria for determining what constitutes "fake" or "wannabe."  Its not like we can go to the BDSM DMV to take a test and obtain a license that demonstrates we are who we claim we are.  I dont know about anyone else, but I honestly sure as heck didnt come out of my mama's womb with the knowledge that I have gained over the years.  I knew what I was, but like any fine craft...it requires skills that must be honed.  That takes time and dedication.

I personally hate to see people painted with such a broad brush.  How many people have been written off as "fake" or a "wannabe", but really were just novice individuals trying to find their way in the BDSM world?   Who is to say that with some time and guidance, that fake wannabe couldnt turn out to be a phenomenal dominant?

Now dont get me wrong, there are dangerous people out there among all of us.  People who will unfortunately claim to be dominant as a means of being able to access potential victims for their own agenda that is about as far from BDSM as you can actually get.  These are the folks that I personally am concerned about. 



I hear all the time about dangerous people among us, but in the 22 years I have been in the lifestyle I have never met one...I meet folks that make mistakes, or dont communicate well or are unskilled at doing things like suspentions, but usually anytime folks get hurt, its a lack of planning and communicating.

I loved what you said about those folks turning out to be phenomanal dominants, I have a lot of freinds (folks that we have all read thier books and gone to thier classes) and every one of them will tell you of thier shaky beginnings....



WyldHrt -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:18:49 PM)

quote:

but have likely only dominated their cat.

If I met someone who actually succeeded in dominating their cat, I'd be fairly impressed. [:D]



gift4mistress -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:19:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

Two dangerous things for someone who's supposed to be in control... "the blind leading the blind", and all that.




It's possible that I might have misunderstood your comment.

Oh, I am a sub so I must be blind? I must be incapable of leading? It's not like there are any submissive generals, doctors, ceo's, or anyone else in a leadership position.  Ignorance is also dangerous.



Arpig -> RE: regarding fake doms and wanna bes. (7/16/2009 11:21:18 PM)

quote:

If I met someone who actually succeeded in dominating their cat, I'd be fairly impressed.

Living under the tyrannical control of three of them, I would too.



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