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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 8:27:49 AM   
IronBear


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Padriag

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bearlee

I am horribly afraid of heights and will drive hundreds of miles to avoid many of the high mountain passes here in Colorado.  It is a sickening and visceral feeling that knows no logic.  Were another human being to put me through such fear, I would put as much distance between me and them as possible.

That I think goes to the heart of so many of the replies.  Say the word "fear" an immediately thier thought turn to such extremes.  I find it intriguing few can imagine anything else.


I've found very few people who did not fear something even if were death itself. However there are those who have a fear of some things which they have learned to handle or if you prefer, have learned handling techniques so they can cope quite well. I had to do this to deal with a lifetime fear of spiders and these days since 'Nam a fear of enclosed spaces. Abject fear can turn muscles to water, shit your pants and blubber like a baby. I have a healthy respect for those who have conquered their fears.


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Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 9:52:03 AM   
sweetsub1957


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Submissive-types: Do you fear your dominant, at least to a degree? If so, why?
 
Dominant-sorts: Do you think your submissive has any fear of you? Should they?
 
Mental, physical, fear in any form, should fear play a part in D/s?


No, I do not fear Sir.  I love & respect Him immensely & He doesn't want me to fear Him.  My love & respect for Him makes me constantly want to please Him.  The one thing that does horrify me though is if, somehow, I were to displease Him.  But so far that hasn't happened.

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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 9:57:37 AM   
sweetgirlserves


Posts: 373
Joined: 4/14/2009
Status: offline 		I think there should be some fear of consequences for disobedience, but I don't think that other than that there should be fear.  Some men who are sadists enjoy seeing their girl in fear of them all of the time.   Never knowing when there will be some 'punishment' for some 'unknown offence'.   That is not a healthy fear at all.  It is sad really, to think that a man is so out of control of himself that he can't appreciate the love, devotion and service of a girl without keeping her in an almost constant state of anxiety and fear.   But its out there.  

~sgs

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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 6:44:19 PM   
KneelforAnne


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quote:

ORIGINAL: allthatjaz


quote:

ORIGINAL: KneelforAnne

~FR~

I've not read all of the responses, but to me this is a deal breaker.

I can't trust someone and be afraid of them at the same time.

I can't really "let go" if I have to wonder what will happen and if I will be safe.

Now, I can totally and completely fear disappointing, or being punished or things along those lines.

I cannot --will not-- fear that he will damage me because he is disappointed, or punishing me.

How do you trust someone you fear?




Sorry but I have read this sort of reply throughout the thread and its a contradiction in terms.




I'm sorry I wasn't clear.

The only way I can really explain what I mean is that I don't want to fear him losing control... does that make sense?

I can fear disappointment-- who wants to disappoint? I can fear punishment-- I probably SHOULD fear it.

I'll never, ever be able to completely relax and totally give myself if I have to wonder if he can control himself. I feel that I should never fear HIM, but perhaps the acts that he wants to do.

I hope that's more clear, but it may not have helped... LOL



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Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 7:01:21 PM   
oceanwinds


Posts: 530
Status: offline 		I want to throw a monkey wrench in here. Why would any dominant person want a s-type to fear them? What would be the advantage?

Fear is part of life, and as many know I am going thorugh it now, but not because of a Dominant. Then I never cared so the persona that needs to wear a tee shirt saying I am a dom and showing two hands beating their chest. There is honor in being a dominant imho, but there is none when one needs to continuing prove it by want their s-type for fear them.

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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 7:23:15 PM   
IronBear


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quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwinds

I want to throw a monkey wrench in here. Why would any dominant person want a s-type to fear them? What would be the advantage?




I know a few dominant types both in and out of the lifestyle who bass their dominance on fear. Some do this particularly in a work environment where they have sadly been given authority and others at home. Why do they want their subordinates to fear them and rule by fear? Because it is all they know and understand. None of them are overly successful and are not well liked or respected.




_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 7:30:16 PM   
cpK69


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cpK69

To answer the first question; no, I do not fear him, nor do I want to.
 
As for the second; there is a type of fear present, but I’m not exactly sure what it is based on.
 
Perhaps it is about forgetting myself… failing as a ‘submisive’.
 
I don’t know…
 
Kim


I’ve decided to change my answer. I don’t think it is respect, and now, I am less certain the feeling I was thinking of, when I first responded, is fear.

No, I think it is something else.

Kim



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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 7:35:48 PM   
Level


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Status: offline 		And, to oceanwinds post: some get off on it. Fear is, to some, an aphrodesiac, I believe.

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RE: Fear - 7/20/2009 9:06:22 PM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline 		Hi Level!

No, I don't fear him at all.  I respect him, and I respect his authority.  Nor do I fear disappointing him.  I could only disappoint him if I intentionally tried to, and I don't plan on that. 


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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 12:40:57 AM   
IronBear


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

Hi Level!

No, I don't fear him at all.  I respect him, and I respect his authority.  Nor do I fear disappointing him.  I could only disappoint him if I intentionally tried to, and I don't plan on that. 



The points I have highlighted are precisely the way I see things but from a Dominant's aspect. I am told I have the patience of Job when dealing with people other than those who refuse to listen and either become stroppy or bull headed about things. It is indeed hard for a slave to really disappoint me 99% of the time. We are all human and humans make mistakes and have bad hair days (assuming you have hair ~ RWL ~ ). We simply sort things out and later at an appropriate talk through the matter.


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 12:57:46 AM   
NihilusZero


Posts: 4036
Joined: 9/10/2008
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		I don't seek out fear itself, but a sub's fear of displeasing hir D-type is a perfectly sensible and honest expression of self in such a dynamic. Fear for fear itself isn't so much the thing as how the fear is indicative of commitment and a desire to please. 

_____________________________

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I know they're all insane
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I know that I'm to blame."
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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 1:34:50 AM   
sirsholly


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From: Quietville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

I don't seek out fear itself, but a sub's fear of displeasing hir D-type is a perfectly sensible and honest expression of self in such a dynamic. Fear for fear itself isn't so much the thing as how the fear is indicative of commitment and a desire to please. 
you have watched one too many episodes of Dr Phil

< Message edited by sirsholly -- 7/21/2009 1:35:35 AM >

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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 7:51:46 AM   
oceanwinds


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

And, to oceanwinds post: some get off on it. Fear is, to some, an aphrodesiac, I believe.


That might very well be, especially in areas of mind f**ck. From my own experiences, my father was a domineering man who ruled through fear. His rule, yes there were tender times, only made me disrespect him and count the days I could move out from his domain. This has been so impregnanted in my head, I cant adjuct to a Dominant who aphrodesiace is fear. I do not those who control, but not to the point that makes me so fearful of him. Yes, I goof up at times, make mistakes, he still dont rule with fear. I do not like to disappoint him or anyone. I will beat myself up more then any Dom. can.

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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 8:02:56 AM   
NuevaVida


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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

Hi Level!

No, I don't fear him at all.  I respect him, and I respect his authority.  Nor do I fear disappointing him.  I could only disappoint him if I intentionally tried to, and I don't plan on that. 



The points I have highlighted are precisely the way I see things but from a Dominant's aspect. I am told I have the patience of Job when dealing with people other than those who refuse to listen and either become stroppy or bull headed about things. It is indeed hard for a slave to really disappoint me 99% of the time. We are all human and humans make mistakes and have bad hair days (assuming you have hair ~ RWL ~ ). We simply sort things out and later at an appropriate talk through the matter.



The way I see it, he chose me - my personality, my "quirks" (he calls it weirdness, I call it quirks lol), my insecurities, my heart, my mind, etc.  Well, we chose each other, actually, but he knows what I'm like.  If my personality disappoints him, then he's got the wrong girl.  Of course I want to add to the goodness in his life, and I focus on doing so.  But I don't live my life in fear of making mistakes - that's negative thinking.  I live my life aiming for good. 

I got down on myself about a month ago for overdoing it in raquetball and messing up my elbow.  He had warned me to start slow but I got so gung-ho and excited about the fun I was  having, I overdid it without thinking.  I came to him and said I had failed, at which point he obliterated that word from my vocabulary.  He said I had exceeded a limitation, to rest and heal my elbow, and to go back and SLOWLY build back up, to the point where I could gently push past that limitation over time.  Failure, in his eye, is the end of something.  And all this was, was a setback because I jumped beyond where I should have.  It was not a disappointment to him that I overdid it, it was an opportunity for him to point out a lesson in all of this, which I learned.

You're right, IronBear.  We are human.  When our intentions are good and we still mess up, it is hardly the end of things.  This doesn't mean I am cavalier about messing up.  It just means that, for the first time in my life actually, I do not live with fear.  And he prefers this - he has said it's time to fly high, rather than be beaten down, so our interactions tend to focus on the strength and goodness in each other.  And when you're buildling on goodness, what's to fear?


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Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.



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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 8:11:30 AM   
NihilusZero


Posts: 4036
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From: Nashville, TN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

I don't seek out fear itself, but a sub's fear of displeasing hir D-type is a perfectly sensible and honest expression of self in such a dynamic. Fear for fear itself isn't so much the thing as how the fear is indicative of commitment and a desire to please. 
you have watched one too many episodes of Dr Phil

I don't watch him at all.

Does he normally focus on one part of sentences to the exclusion of the context of the rest of the surrounding words too?


_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 8:17:39 AM   
DesFIP


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From: Apple County NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
And, to oceanwinds post: some get off on it. Fear is, to some, an aphrodesiac, I believe.


For a relationship to succeed, it would have to be for both. If he got off on fear while it makes me dislike him and be turned off on him, the relationship would have been very short lived should I have been foolish enough to engage with him at all.

But it isn't an honest and sensible expression of the dynamic in my relationship because for me; making me afraid makes me not want him in any way. You don't make yourself bigger by making someone else smaller. Bullying others just shows up your own insecurities.

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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 8:26:43 AM   
NihilusZero


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

But it isn't an honest and sensible expression of the dynamic in my relationship because for me; making me afraid makes me not want him in any way. You don't make yourself bigger by making someone else smaller. Bullying others just shows up your own insecurities.

There is a difference between the sort of fear that is directly relevant to someone as far as their reactions are concerned (ala, the 'fear of god') and the type of fear that is an inner echo of the desire not to make a mistake.

I'm speaking of the latter. I don't expect to be feared. I do, however, expect to be important enough a part of a sub/slaves life that the normal human reactions of fear of error would be present. Personally, it's not even a fear that I would seek to build rather than assuage...I just won't pretend that humans are always emotionally neutral, perfectly 'carpe diem' beings when it comes to the things that make them happiest.

< Message edited by NihilusZero -- 7/21/2009 8:27:30 AM >

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"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 8:57:32 AM   
cpK69


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

I'm speaking of the latter. I don't expect to be feared. I do, however, expect to be important enough a part of a sub/slaves life that the normal human reactions of fear of error would be present.


I am not so sure this is true. It is more likely that fearing error is a conditioned response. It is not the error that is feared, but the consequence of the error; right?

To fear making mistakes, is to fear being human; isn't it?

Kim

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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 9:09:03 AM   
NihilusZero


Posts: 4036
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From: Nashville, TN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cpK69

It is not the error that is feared, but the consequence of the error; right?

Yes, although I'm more referring to inner, self-created consequences not those of another source. It's easy to find plenty of commentary from subs who would readily admit that their own self-haunting for feeling they've disappointed their D-types is worse than any other punishment/consequence.

quote:

ORIGINAL: cpK69

To fear making mistakes, is to fear being human; isn't it?

Likely where a lot of depression and self-critical views stem from. This is why I say that I don't encourage such a self-deprecatory process. It's a weird paradox because while the existence of such fear of failure is an indication of something important, I wouldn't use it as the means to reinforce the dynamic itself at all (which is where I think many people naturally get a distaste for the idea).


_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

NihilusZero.com

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RE: Fear - 7/21/2009 9:25:49 AM   
sirsholly


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From: Quietville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

I don't seek out fear itself, but a sub's fear of displeasing hir D-type is a perfectly sensible and honest expression of self in such a dynamic. Fear for fear itself isn't so much the thing as how the fear is indicative of commitment and a desire to please. 
you have watched one too many episodes of Dr Phil

I don't watch him at all.

Does he normally focus on one part of sentences to the exclusion of the context of the rest of the surrounding words too?

Naaa. he makes oxymoronic statements that have the psych professionals rolling their eyes.

I am overmedicated right now so watch me make ol Phil soumd like the second coming of Einstein (minus the hair do)

There is no such animal as a perfectly sensible and hoonest expression of self. Break it down and it would work, but the terms together are a contradiction. If one gives an HONEST expression of self...yippee skippy! But it would make no sense to anyone other than the owner of the ego. If they blab something that makes sense to others then they have in some way modified it, thus lessening the honesty, to make it more understandable.


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