RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (Full Version)

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HimNbabygirl -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 6:05:12 PM)

lol good one NZ, i can't stop laughing

His baby girl



tazzygirl -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 6:22:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: HimNbabygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucienne
Do you have specific real life examples of kinky people acting out in public...


Actually, yes... a few years back on a Saturday night on the Sunset Strip and viewing a couple in BDSM garb walking around via Collar & Leash.  Pathetically fucking stupid, and clearly doing so for the "shock value" of it all.



i take my 9 year old son to the local mall frequently and we constantly see teens wearing leashes and someone else holding the other end. only once did he even take note of it a few years ago and his response was "look mommy they are playing puppy, may i play too?" i just told him when we get home because he makes a very noisy puppy. by the time we got back to our house, he had forgot all about it. i have seen teens do this when i used to take my teen daughter to our local showings of Rocky Horror Picture show, i never took my son. i also make the choice not to take him places he has a good chance of seeing non age appropriate things, such as the drunks having sex in the alleys behind the bars. personally i am more offended with the girls walking around the mall with their skirts so short their asses are hanging out the bottom of them, but then again that's my own opinion and the only reason i'm offended is because i know i could never pull off that look again without surgery...curse gravity...

His baby girl



I watched a young girl (16?) moving down the esclator one day at the local Burlington. Her skirt was so short i could tell what color and style her panties were. So could a few young men watching her from below. Once she stepped off... mind you, the guys hadnt said a word, just stared... she started to complain, loudly. Finally one piped up and yelled "If you're gonna show it off, im not gonna to look away!" The police were called... and the cop basically said the same thing. No crime to look at what is on display. The officer did suggest if she felt subconscious enough, she may want to go back home and change.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 9:50:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

...what is so horrible about a slave saying the word "Master"...



Again... you and yours are imposing a power dynamic on those who have not consented.  Got this time?  And yeah... it's insecure, childish, rude, and crass. 




MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 9:54:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucienne

Perhaps you should reflect on the impressive cross-section of posters who disagree with you.



Perhaps someone needs to explain BIAS to you?  Contact some 'nilla folk and ask them the same question. Did you forget the basic premise here is about imposing this dynamic on those OUTSIDE this dynamic?  Keep your eye on the ball.




Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 10:07:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hierodule

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: Silence8

Good for them.



I disagree.  For those that applaud such a stupid display under the guise of "Sexual Freedom", I doubt those same people would applaud someone elses "Religious Freedom", for example, if spouting off of the evils of homosexuality and so forth.  Would likely suggest they "Keep their beliefs to themselves"... but when it's something YOU believe in, then you (not you personally) have no issue in shoving your choices down other people's throats.




The fundamental difference is that the preacher is attacking a way of life and the leash couple are simply expressing theirs.The preacher is telling people they can't live a certain way, if they do they are evil. Don't get me wrong I believe the preacher has a right to his opinion. But the couple with the leash isn't attacking "normal" couples or spouting a fevered rant about the evils of vanilla sex. They are simply expressing a facet of their relationship that isn't isn't even explicitly sexual.



*shrug*

I personally think it's better to let people say what's on their mind and try to counter it with rational discourse rather than just shaming them into silence and letting those thoughts fester.

I believe in freedom of expression, not "freedom for people who think like me to express themselves," so I'll always support someone's right to say something that I don't like, just like I'll support someone else's right to call that person a jerk [:D]



Hierodule -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 10:38:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hierodule

The fundamental difference is that the preacher is attacking a way of life and the leash couple are simply expressing theirs.The preacher is telling people they can't live a certain way, if they do they are evil. Don't get me wrong I believe the preacher has a right to his opinion. But the couple with the leash isn't attacking "normal" couples or spouting a fevered rant about the evils of vanilla sex. They are simply expressing a facet of their relationship that isn't isn't even explicitly sexual.



*shrug*

I personally think it's better to let people say what's on their mind and try to counter it with rational discourse rather than just shaming them into silence and letting those thoughts fester.

I believe in freedom of expression, not "freedom for people who think like me to express themselves," so I'll always support someone's right to say something that I don't like, just like I'll support someone else's right to call that person a jerk [:D]


Did you miss the part where I said the preacher had a right to speak his mind? I was just pointing out that comparing a preacher and a couple with a leash is apples and oranges because it fundamentally different.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 11:32:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero


So you've run out of anything of substance to say?




MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 11:52:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I have a far higher opinion of "nilla" people from actually interacting with them in my *culture* without hiding aspects of myself.



This contradicts an earlier post you made, where you'd stated in part:

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I didn't expose my sexuality to *the public*, prior to being a slave, why would I now?  I don't need *acceptance* of that kind.

Link: http://www.collarchat.com/m_647925/mpage_1/key_vanilla/tm.htm#649656






Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 11:56:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hierodule


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hierodule

The fundamental difference is that the preacher is attacking a way of life and the leash couple are simply expressing theirs.The preacher is telling people they can't live a certain way, if they do they are evil. Don't get me wrong I believe the preacher has a right to his opinion. But the couple with the leash isn't attacking "normal" couples or spouting a fevered rant about the evils of vanilla sex. They are simply expressing a facet of their relationship that isn't isn't even explicitly sexual.



*shrug*

I personally think it's better to let people say what's on their mind and try to counter it with rational discourse rather than just shaming them into silence and letting those thoughts fester.

I believe in freedom of expression, not "freedom for people who think like me to express themselves," so I'll always support someone's right to say something that I don't like, just like I'll support someone else's right to call that person a jerk [:D]


Did you miss the part where I said the preacher had a right to speak his mind? I was just pointing out that comparing a preacher and a couple with a leash is apples and oranges because it fundamentally different.



Heh I did actually.

Sorry about that.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 11:59:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero


What... no snappy come back?  Nothing similar to YOUR USUAL WIT?







Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 12:05:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero


What... no snappy come back?



OK I can see getting really into the debate but...this is starting to seem personal, first with Orion now with NZ.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 12:10:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

OK I can see getting really into the debate but...this is starting to seem personal, first with Orion...


Might want to review this poster's first reply to my question to him to see who made things "personal".

quote:

 
...now with NZ.


Might want to review this poster's last reply to this thread.

If some are going to dish it out, certainly they can take it as well.




MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 12:23:04 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hierodule

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: Silence8

Good for them.



I disagree.  For those that applaud such a stupid display under the guise of "Sexual Freedom", I doubt those same people would applaud someone elses "Religious Freedom", for example, if spouting off of the evils of homosexuality and so forth.  Would likely suggest they "Keep their beliefs to themselves"... but when it's something YOU believe in, then you (not you personally) have no issue in shoving your choices down other people's throats.




The fundamental difference is that the preacher is attacking a way of life...



Fair point... to clarify, the point I was trying to make is many are perfectly fine with the things THEY believe in, but are not so "tolerant" of the things others believe in.  I simply see no reason for anyone's PERSONAL power dynamic to enter the public arena, where those around them have not consented (or shown any desire) to be exposed to said power dynamic.




Hierodule -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 12:43:43 AM)

Every relationship, romantic or otherwise, is a power dynamic. Mine just happens to be a little more extreme than most.

(edited because I know the diff between "then" and "than")



Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 3:09:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

Fair point... to clarify, the point I was trying to make is many are perfectly fine with the things THEY believe in, but are not so "tolerant" of the things others believe in.  I simply see no reason for anyone's PERSONAL power dynamic to enter the public arena, where those around them have not consented (or shown any desire) to be exposed to said power dynamic.


I guess I just don't understand why you think it only applies to power dynamics, as opposed to the thousands of other things that might make someone uncomfortable, like wearing weird makeup or being gay or a 40 year old woman holding hands with her 20 year old lover, or just about anything personal or quasi-sexual that people can do in public.



Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 3:11:56 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

Fair point... to clarify, the point I was trying to make is many are perfectly fine with the things THEY believe in, but are not so "tolerant" of the things others believe in.  I simply see no reason for anyone's PERSONAL power dynamic to enter the public arena, where those around them have not consented (or shown any desire) to be exposed to said power dynamic.


Well yeah, that's exactly what you're doing. You're saying it's okay for me to say "my fiance" to describe my fiance (IE the thing you think is ok) but it's not okay for a slave to say "my master" to describe her master (ie the things others believe in) - so...you're making a point against yourself here.




agirl -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 5:00:32 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I have a far higher opinion of "nilla" people from actually interacting with them in my *culture* without hiding aspects of myself.



This contradicts an earlier post you made, where you'd stated in part:

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I didn't expose my sexuality to *the public*, prior to being a slave, why would I now?  I don't need *acceptance* of that kind.

Link: http://www.collarchat.com/m_647925/mpage_1/key_vanilla/tm.htm#649656






You are very mistaken if you think that referring to my Master as Master has anything to do with sex. Where has that idea sprung from?

Being owned has no more to do with sex than being married does. I had sex when I was married and I have sex while owned. I don't see what sex has to do with how you refer to your partner in public.

Being owned has NOTHING to do with MY sexuality in any way. It might be a sexual thing for you but it isn't to me, so try not to project that onto my relationship.

ALSO...nowhere in this thread have I said that *I* do it or don't do it. I HAVE said that I see nothing whatsoever wrong with it.

Please try to keep your facts straight, especially if you're going to work your way through posts I've made in the past......and keep them in context.

agirl











OrionTheWolf -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 5:58:31 AM)

Your opinion is apparently in the minority, and pretty bigoted. You can be ashamed of your dynamic and relationship if you wish, but I am going to be who I am. Has nothing to do with being all the insults you listed, it has to do with being true to yourself. It is not forcing anything on anyone, because they have the choice to come into public and be exposed to many different people and cultures.

You avoided several questions posed to you, and I can presume the reason why. How is it crass and rude? How is it anymore of a problem than using other terms from other relationships? Why should this be an area that people hide and conform in?

This is where your argument falls apart, and then you must resort to the other tactics.


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

...what is so horrible about a slave saying the word "Master"...



Again... you and yours are imposing a power dynamic on those who have not consented.  Got this time?  And yeah... it's insecure, childish, rude, and crass. 





OrionTheWolf -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 5:59:53 AM)

This is something she is not willing to admit.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hierodule

Every relationship, romantic or otherwise, is a power dynamic. Mine just happens to be a little more extreme than most.

(edited because I know the diff between "then" and "than")



agirl -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/28/2009 7:46:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA




Fair point... to clarify, the point I was trying to make is many are perfectly fine with the things THEY believe in, but are not so "tolerant" of the things others believe in.  I simply see no reason for anyone's PERSONAL power dynamic to enter the public arena, where those around them have not consented (or shown any desire) to be exposed to said power dynamic.




Which is basically what you are doing.

It's clearly not something that sits well with you and not someting you should do if you feel that way.

Like it or not, other people don't share your beliefs. If it's your belief that it's crass, rude and offensive then you're not going to do it, are you? Other people have a very different outlook and just because they do, doesn't make it crass, rude and offensive for THEM to do so....except in your opinion..which at best is limited to your own life. It's clear that it doesn't play out that way, or work that way for quite a few people that have participated in this thread.

You might not like it or be able to understand people that are at variance with your beliefs , but that's life and that's the way of the world.

agirl







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