RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it

RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (Full Version)

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MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:04:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA You missed the point... it's not the "children" that are "offended"... it's the PARENTS of said children that would be offended (and possibly miffed) for having been forced to now address what their child has become "curious" about because two people feel the need to include others in their power dynamic. Thus, we find this behavior rude, and crass. Your burden of responsibility is backwards... If you plan to live life as anything other than a hermit, you effectively sign an exposure waiver by choosing to go out in public. No... we agree to the "public" standards set by our community. And if that standard doesn't include some having someone's personal life shoved in our or our children's faces, then the "burden of responsibility" is on the individual who elects to violate said community standard.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:06:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: agirl No, I think you've missed the point. If YOU think it's rude behaviour, just don't do it. This gets back to the point I never saw an answer to earlier:... How many people in a crowded room must be offended before we say the person is "imposing" themselves on the public? You got your answer... the community standard can be violated by ONE or ONE MILLION. The number matters not... that standards set by the community do.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:08:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AnimusRex http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wippooDL6WE LOL [:D]

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:23:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf Has nothing to do with respect, it has to do with social mores, and whether you decide to hide and lie about who you are. Nonsense... so if you fancy walking about with a turtle hanging out your ass, then to hell with everyone just so YOU don't have to "hide and lie" about who you are?!! Garbage. Once again, it may suit you to ignore how you conduct yourself around children or in the community of which YOU agreed to be a part of (and in doing so, agreed to its standards)... we, on the other hand, are conscious of other people's little ones and the community standards we agreed to live up to by taking our residence here; and in doing so, act accordingly by being considerate of others in said community. Once more... YOUR OWN WORDS demonstrate your attitude/behavior is nothing more than stroking your fragile ego. quote: ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf I absolutely have the right, and exercise it often... Little more than a little man needing to show off... "Oooh... Oooh... Oooh... Look at me... Look at me... aren't I so dommy-wommy wiff my wittle swavey-wavy?!!" PUKE!!! [8\|]

NihilusZero -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:30:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... we agree to the "public" standards set by our community. No, we agree to the laws of our community. Everything else is a matter of intolerance (whether supported by popular view or not). Anything else is an issues of specific sub-regulations imposed by private business and private groups when we are on their property. quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA And if that standard doesn't include some having someone's personal life shoved in our or our children's faces, then the "burden of responsibility" is on the individual who elects to violate said community standard. Yes, actually it does. you consent to it by going out in public. Women consent to the chance of getting approached by guys at a bar. Parents consent to having their children potentially hazed by entering them into school. You consent to have to interact with people who have views of what is "imposing" that are just as viable as yours. There is absolutely no substance to any argument that starts from supporting an individual whose sole issue is taking offense at what someone else does when it does not harm them. Otherwise, you may as well support me if I demand that the site's moderators remove all your posts because I feel compelled to say that they offend me at that you are imposing your confusion onto me.

NihilusZero -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:33:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA Little more than a little man needing to show off... "Oooh... Oooh... Oooh... Look at me... Look at me... aren't I so dommy-wommy wiff my wittle swavey-wavy?!!" PUKE!!! [8\|] This coming from someone so insecure about his dominance that his avatar needs to be an image of his slave bound and restrained, rather than one of himself. Because that doesn't scream "I need to show how my dommy-dominance is uber-manifested to everyone on the site!" ...see how easily nonsense can get twisted to support stupid armchair psychology conclusions?

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:35:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... we agree to the "public" standards set by our community. No, we agree to the laws of our community. No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their residents and neighbors. Respectfully, NZ, we can go back and forth on this a million times and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on this issue. Which is fine... we agree to disagree.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:40:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero You're welcome to think what you want, no matter how nonsensical (as many couples on CM elect to do the same with their profiles)... it matters not. I find your profile pics quite silly, and I suspect you don't care.

NihilusZero -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:41:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their community and neighbors. None of which would be violated by anything being discussed here. quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA Respectfully, NZ, we can go back and forth on this a million times and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on this issue. Which is fine... we agree to disagree. But see...my point isn't to try and convert you (you're free to feel as you like). It's to get to the nitty gritty of which view on this issue holds up better under scrutiny. If we begin any system of ethical requirements with a measurement of whether anyone could be offended (in our specific geographical area?) we end up with undefinable, inarticulate, and unenforceable regulations. Because, for every person who claims to be offended, there is another that can claim to be offended by their reaction to being offended. Heck, sometimes I wish more stringent etiquette were applicable (take going to any sporting event and consider the fans) but it would be ridiculous to pretend that I should have power to alter their freedom of non-violent expression just because it's testosterone-based, drunken drivel being slurred in my ear.

NihilusZero -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:44:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA You're welcome to think what you want, no matter how nonsensical (as many couples on CM elect to do the same with their profiles)... it matters not. Just to clarify: you realize that my comment wasn't an issue with your avatar (I personally don't mind it)...it was an example to show that trying to cheap-shot others by 'interpreting' their words or actions to suggest that they suffer from emotional/psychological issues is a logically fraudulent trick, yes?

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:51:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their community and neighbors. None of which would be violated by anything being discussed here. I disagree. quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA Respectfully, NZ, we can go back and forth on this a million times and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on this issue. Which is fine... we agree to disagree. But see...my point isn't to try and convert you (you're free to feel as you like). It's to get to the nitty gritty of which view on this issue holds up better under scrutiny. We're of the "kink" sort, and have ZERO desire to see others displaying their kink at the grocery store. Silly, disrespectful, and crass. Having "scruitinized" the scenario, that's our personal analysis.

Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:52:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their residents and neighbors. Respectfully, NZ, we can go back and forth on this a million times and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on this issue. Which is fine... we agree to disagree. Communities also have tactics (social ostracism) to deal with people who don't abide by the commonly agreed upon social mores. If the person is willing to accept being a social outcast, what's the problem?

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:52:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero Just to clarify:.. No need to clarify... I understood. Just disagree.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 10:55:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their residents and neighbors. Respectfully, NZ, we can go back and forth on this a million times and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on this issue. Which is fine... we agree to disagree. Communities also have tactics (social ostracism) to deal with people who don't abide by the commonly agreed upon social mores. If the person is willing to accept being a social outcast, what's the problem? I think we both know most simply would not say anything, while still being miffed and/or offended.

NihilusZero -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 11:01:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their community and neighbors. None of which would be violated by anything being discussed here. I disagree. That's fantastic. Which community standards which are not legal and not private-business/private-ownership based get violated by use of the word "Master" or "lover" (for the earlier example of a gay couple) as a descriptor of a relationship? quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA We're of the "kink" sort, and have ZERO desire to see others displaying their kink at the grocery store. Silly, disrespectful, and crass. Having "scruitinized" the scenario, that's our personal analysis. This isn't about you, though. This , I thought, was about community standards, right? Someone's "personal analysis" is no basis to determine something as being offensive. You still haven't gotten around to explaining how you are going to change if I find your intolerance of other people's public discussions of their partners to be "disrespectful and crass". Oddly, the fact that you are on a website that is intended to be a virtual sanctuary for people to supportively discuss their kink means that you are actually violating "the non-written, non-legal decency standards" expected from members in this social setting. Actually, I'm wrong there. It is written in the Section Guidelines: quote: Keep the discussions civil and mature, and do not insult the kinks, preferences, lifestyles, etc. of others. Ergo...you are violating your own views.

Elisabella -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 11:02:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA No... communities have non-written, non-legal decency standards they expect from their residents and neighbors. Respectfully, NZ, we can go back and forth on this a million times and I doubt we'll ever see eye-to-eye on this issue. Which is fine... we agree to disagree. Communities also have tactics (social ostracism) to deal with people who don't abide by the commonly agreed upon social mores. If the person is willing to accept being a social outcast, what's the problem? I think we both know most simply would not say anything, while still being miffed and/or offended. Well yeah, and then that offended person likely wouldn't say good morning when they saw the offender, and would gossip about them behind their back, and the whole town would think that person was 'weird' and they'd be an outcast. What you're basically saying is "something that is weird or different is likely to make people uncomfortable and therefore shouldn't be done in public" - because IMO saying "it will make someone uncomfortable" is more appropriate than "it will offend someone" because taking offence tends to be a reaction to an insult, rather than something just weird. So, where do, say, goth kids fit into all this? Wearing white makeup and black lipstick is a totally unnecessary form of self expression that makes a lot of people uncomfortable. I guess they should just wear "normal clothes" when out in public. And I probably shouldn't have worn a skirt to Wal Mart when I lived in the US, because the norm there was trackies or cheap blue jeans...a skirt, heels and lipstick made it obvious I didn't belong and might make some people feel uncomfortable because they get it shoved in their face that not everyone goes out in trackies and t-shirts. You see where I'm going with this?

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 11:11:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero Which community standards which are not legal and not private-business/private-ownership based get violated by use of the word "Master" or "lover" (for the earlier example of a gay couple) as a descriptor of a relationship? Already addressed... those of the 'nilla sort (and some of us of the kink sort) find it rude and crass. quote: This isn't about you, though. This, I thought, was about community standards Actually, yes... it is about me with respect to my community, as it is also about others who live in said community. quote: Oddly, the fact that you are on a website that is intended to be a virtual sanctuary for people to supportively discuss their kink 1. Neither I nor you are REQUIRED to "support" anyone's kink. And besides, I thought this was not about "kink", as a number of participants of this thread have stated. 2. Nobody has been prevented from "discussing" anything.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/26/2009 11:21:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella Well yeah, and then that offended person likely wouldn't say good morning when they saw the offender, and would gossip about them behind their back, and the whole town would think that person was 'weird' and they'd be an outcast. Possibly... depends on the community. quote: What you're basically saying is... What I'm basically stating is, there's simply no need to include unconsenting third-parties to ones personal displays of the power dynamic ilk. Said display does not make one any more/less dominant or submissive; and may likely offend those in their community who'd rather they kept their priviate life... priviate. That'd be my peference. quote: So, where do, say, goth kids fit into all this? Wearing white makeup and black lipstick is a totally unnecessary form of self expression that makes a lot of people uncomfortable. I guess they should just wear "normal clothes" when out in public. Not likely most would find that "offensive"... probably weird, but not offensive; but I suppose that depends on their respective community? quote: And I probably shouldn't have worn a skirt to Wal Mart... Likely not an issue here in Los Angeles (would likely get a few dates out of it [;)])... but possibly an issue somewhere in the Bible Belt?

tazzygirl -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 2:28:11 AM)
~FR Just a note about something NZ said. quote: Yes, actually it does. you consent to it by going out in public. Women consent to the chance of getting approached by guys at a bar. Parents consent to having their children potentially hazed by entering them into school. quote: Hazing - A High School Tradition Or Illegal Activity Unacceptable Conduct Hazing is Illegal Hazing is illegal in most states. Only Alaska,Montana, South Dakota, Hawaii, New Mexico and Wyoming don't have anti-hazing laws. The legal ramifications of hazing are enormous. Learn how to protect your school with a zero tolerance policy and proactive education about hazing. Assume nothing. Even if you think your school is clean, you need to discuss the subject, lay out the ground rules and enforce them unequivocally. http://privateschool.about.com/cs/students/a/hazing1.htm

agirl -> RE: Involving others in your kink vs. Not feeling the need to hide it (11/27/2009 4:01:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA What I'm basically stating is, there's simply no need to include unconsenting third-parties to ones personal displays of the power dynamic ilk. Said display does not make one any more/less dominant or submissive; and may likely offend those in their community who'd rather they kept their priviate life... priviate. That'd be my peference. quote: So, where do, say, goth kids fit into all this? Wearing white makeup and black lipstick is a totally unnecessary form of self expression that makes a lot of people uncomfortable. I guess they should just wear "normal clothes" when out in public. Not likely most would find that "offensive"... probably weird, but not offensive; but I suppose that depends on their respective community? You seem to have a lot of information about what most would likely find just weird and what they'd find offensive. Your view of what constitutes good behaviour and the degree in which you wish to conform in your community is fine for you. You must abide by whatever that is. Other people are just as thoughtful, kind, respectful etc ........ they just have their own criteria and their own judgements on how they behave in the communities THEY live in. It's a little silly to say it's all wrong, at all, at anytime when out and about.....because it clearly isn't. I'm afraid that your blanket comment that * those of the'nilla sort find it crass and rude* simply isn't the case. As long as you accept that your idea is just yours, that's fine. agirl

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