LafayetteLady
Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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ORIGINAL: vincentML
Your logic may not be nonsense. I grant that was a tad offensive written in pissed off mood. Apologies. But you are generalizing from a very small data base. We were very involved with our students. I lived across the street from the high school where I worked. Hours were spent tutoring students, making phone calls and home visits. Our greatest impediments were from parents who believed their children should receive better grades despite their laziness and inability to comprehend the course material and from Administration who failed to support the teachers.
Apology accepted. I have seen your posts on the boards for a bit now, and it was an unexpected comment from you.
Make no mistake, I think most parents need to be slapped upside the head a bit about their kids in the schools. The look on my district's superintendant's face when I told him that I knew my son was lazy was absolutely priceless. The problem we were having was because my son is in a special education program that has a shortened day and the school had assured me that he would be able to graduate on schedule with his class when that wasn't the case. I had a meeting with him so that they made the proper amount of credits available to the students in that program and made it very clear what they needed to graduate. He seemed surprised when I told him that if my son didn't do his part, I didn't expect him to be passed through, but I wanted the schedule in place that would give him and the other students (most of whom have been at my house at one point or another) the opportunity. If they didn't take that opportunity....well then that's the students' problem. In the end he wanted to offer me a job as a teacher for that program and to be honest, I turned it down specifically because of all the beauracracy you talk about.
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I once failed a star senior athlete because she absented herself from one third of my classes and the "F" was struck from the student's records by the Principal because she had been accepted to a sports scholarship. Wasn't even required to make up the work in summer school. And this after contact and warning to the parents.
Again, I never even implied that you weren't a dedicated teacher. It sucks that you were the only one trying to do the right thing.
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Most of the teachers I knew were dedicated and worked hard for their students. I believe there are many who are the same today. I have not surveyed any teacher population. But I do not believe one can withstand the rigors of being on stage 25 periods a week without being motivated. It is my experience and belief that public school teaching has been devalued by the mad rush to get everyone into college whether they are motivated, capable students or not. Few care about high school when they recognize it is an easy pass into college. And hell, the colleges will take anyone, capable or not. More jobs for college professors, more money for the colleges.
When I lived in Florida, I was amazed at the dedication of my son's teachers. Based on their salaries, it was easy to see that they weren't there for the money. In NJ, that is just not the case. Honestly, my son was getting a better education when we lived in Florida than he is in NJ and the cost per student here is significantly higher.
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You sample one high school and talk to a few other teachers perhaps and from that sample make a broad sweeping statement that teachers don't care much for the students today and the Unions are of no value. That's a terribly weak and unacceptable basis from which to draw a conclusion.
Actually, that's the thing is that it wasn't just one high school and a few teachers. It has been several high schools and a good number of teachers. Along the way, I have also met some absolutely wonderful teachers as well, but they were in the minority. The number of teachers who were tenured and simply passing the time was sad.
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There is no perfection in any system. But the public education system has done a remarkable job considering some of the dire conditions from which their student population arises. Can the system be improved? Probably. But I do not know the solution. Many experiments were attempted. I believe this however. It will not be improved without the cooperation of the teachers. My Union used to work with Administration to implement new programs and improve old ones for the students.
Our country's education system is sorely lacking compared to those in Europe and Asia, which would be the only comparable equals.
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Parents and people with political agenda issued the same damning complaints about teachers when I was working. There was no satisfying them then and there is no satisfying them now. The public seems to be unable to accept the fact that education and hard study have a value. If teachers have that attitude it trickles down from the general society. High School education is poorly valued today as it was yesterday (except for the brief "sputnik" spurt) and as it will be tomorrow.
Look, parents are a HUGE part of the problem with the education system, no doubt about it. They account for a great deal of teacher apathy as well. Years ago, if the teacher said little Johnny was misbehaving in class, mommy and daddy didn't ask little Johnny any questions, he was simply punished. Now if the teacher says little Johnny is disruptive, or not doing the work, mommy and daddy will have a "talk" with the kid, who will undoubtedly blame the teacher and the result is the parents trying to say that their little Johnny is an "angel," even though everyone who has ever met the kid knows he is an out of control brat. As a nation, we have become so concerned with not hindering a child's "creativity" and "self worth," we are doing these kids more harm than good.
It's common in many high schools in this area to have the students do creative writing projects where spelling and grammar don't count. They want the kids to concentrate on the "story." I mean really, WTF? That's why there are drafts and final versions. Work on the damn story and once that is right fix the spelling and grammar.
Younger sports teams with no scoring because they are "all winners." Is it any wonder that they think they are entitled to everything?
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That is why I believe teacher salaries and working conditions will be threatened without the Unions. America is not willing to pay up for good high school education and/or may not be able to as people are squeezed with rising commodity prices, higher taxes and stagnant wages. Hell, we cannot even repair bridges. The infrastructure is falling. Public education is part of that falling infrastructure.
You may have a point, but one HUGE step to improving the situation would be to eliminate tenure. Teachers who still work towards seeing that "spark" of light in a student's eyes would be rewarded and those who were resting on their laurels and doing a suck ass job would be gone. Tenure and seniority don't have to be the same thing. But everyone wants to be rewarded for a job well done. In all honesty, I would love to see some parent involvement become mandatory. Why? Because I have had teachers turn to ME for help with some of my son's friends because of their parents lack of involvement. Neither parents or teachers can take on the job of education without the assistance of the other. And you really don't even want to ask me about all these stupid tests. It isn't an accurate gauge of what the kids are learning. It is just a gauge of how well they are taught how to take tests.
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Teachers as well as other workers today have seen the buying power of their 1980 dollar fall to $0.38 so i can understand the squeeze the public feels. Yes, if each single teacher has to face the Administration by himself you can very well wager their salaries will be cut. A Walmart Super School will be built across the street and the individual teacher will be reassigned or invited to take a hike. Working people know the truth of the inequality between management and the individual worker. You betcha!
Then perhaps restructuring what the unions can and can't do might be in order. I'm all for a teacher having support when facing the administration when wrongfully accused of wrongdoing. I'm not real fond of bad teachers having lots of union support to help them continue to do poor work. I can't imagine you would be for that either.
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