RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai

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susie -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:08:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy The issue is not the smoking- it is that a centralized power is dictating law to the point that some bloke in UK rots in jail for 6 months. The man in question chose to go to jail. He had many chances to pay the fine he was given. He chose not to pay it. He was warned that eventually he would end up in jail if he still refused to pay the fine and that is what HE chose as an option. quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy This is the result of taken god out of life. People have no manners to eachother- so then the state must mandate- but this then makes the state into god. The know all -be all- is now the state. god has nothing at all to do with manners or how people behave. Neither my sister, my partner or I believe in god and NOBODY has ever suggest there are any problems with our behaviour or manners. None of us have ever been guilty of breaking any law. What we all have in common is that we have been brought up by parents who taught us right from wrong and ensured that we understood common courtesy.

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:13:56 AM)
I am sorry but god does count for something. I lived in Chicago where people are pretty screw happy- and now I live in a small town in PA where the bulk of the populace is Christian. Guess which worked out better for me? so who do you obey? god or the material world. rather then people in the NWO doing what is right- everything is the penal code. everything. I am not saying PA is utopia. I am saying I get a fair shake here- because the people are Christians. Throw rocks if you like- but the state is not- and never can be god. a higher power exists- and that is not negotiable. That does not mean other can not be or are not respectful-- but absent of any rules- that then leaves only the state left to mandate such rules. And we know the state has killed millions of people. So that is who you bow down before when you support NWO.

Moonhead -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:19:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or I can live with that, common decency and such. I am not really addicted so I can do without. Especially if it really bothers someone. In people's homes and businesses the way I see it is that the owner's word is Law and I do not disrespect that. But I absolutely no respect for the government, nor those who use it as a big brother to impose their will on others. Kapeesh ? T Seen, bredrin. Isn't the problem here (which said law addresses) that a lot of people don't have the basic manners to refrain from smoking around others who don't like it without legal threats hanging over them? If less people thought they had an inalienable right to turn their workplace* into a fume chamber, then there wouldn't be any need for these sorts of law in the first place. Not all smokers have your politesse, sadly. *(Or in the case we're discussing, somebody else's workplace. I think Ellen's point about breathing protection for pub staff is a bit specious: a breathmask to eliminate concrete dust or asbestos isn't going to do much against tobacco smoke. You'd probably need a full blown gasmask or a closed respirator, which would make telling people how much they owe you for the drinks a bit tricky...)

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:25:05 AM)
It is absolutely pathetic that someone could go to jail over a parking ticket. I have worse infractions then that on me. I wont get into details-- but I do. Absolutely chilling that the state can slam someones ass in jail over a monetization issue. Such rules are disproportionate to poor people. That negates that all men are created equal. Fuck California. Let the riots begin!

mnottertail -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:25:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy so who do you obey? god or the material world. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ2tYoBfnlw New World Order

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:27:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy so who do you obey? god or the material world. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ2tYoBfnlw New World Order That is what I mean. Do you serve the government, or do you serve a higher power?

mnottertail -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:28:16 AM)
neither niether, Major Minor.

SaintIntensity -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:29:20 AM)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3duUzBbBmmc did someone say New Order [;)]

juliaoceania -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:31:40 AM)
quote: I believe that people will not learn how to respect one another's private space through "nanny laws" that attempt to compel good manners. I also think that, if someone doesn't want to smell cigarette smoke when they're out in public, they're welcome to choose their venues accordingly, as long as, if -I- want to have a cigarette while I'm out in public, I have the option of having a place where =I= can do so as well. The anti smoking laws have been extremely successful in this state in regulating clean air in public buildings.. which I am forever grateful for. I suppose you are for "separate yet equal" even though when people are allowed to smoke indoors legally, in my experience establishments try to create smoking and nonsmoking "areas", which do not translate to clean air... so basically you want to tread on people's goodwill toward one another, and it only takes a few assholes to spoil that.

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:33:30 AM)
Funny thing - that the jails are over crowded in CA. They keep trying to shift the prisoners to other states because they are too cheap to pay for them themself.

Moonhead -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:34:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy Absolutely chilling that the state can slam someones ass in jail over a monetization issue. Such rules are disproportionate to poor people. That negates that all men are created equal. He wasn't so broke that he couldn't pay the fine, he just refused to do so. That's already been pointed out to you three or four times though, so it probably won't sink in now either. Poor people tend not to own pubs, dig?

juliaoceania -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:36:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy I am sorry but god does count for something. I lived in Chicago where people are pretty screw happy- and now I live in a small town in PA where the bulk of the populace is Christian. Guess which worked out better for me? so who do you obey? god or the material world. rather then people in the NWO doing what is right- everything is the penal code. everything. I am not saying PA is utopia. I am saying I get a fair shake here- because the people are Christians. Throw rocks if you like- but the state is not- and never can be god. a higher power exists- and that is not negotiable. That does not mean other can not be or are not respectful-- but absent of any rules- that then leaves only the state left to mandate such rules. And we know the state has killed millions of people. So that is who you bow down before when you support NWO. Who would Jesus blow smoke at? (WWJBS) Seriously, if everyone would be god fearing "body as temple" folks.. then your way would work... You are not advocating freedom of religion, you are implying imposing your own... no thanks

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:38:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy I am sorry but god does count for something. I lived in Chicago where people are pretty screw happy- and now I live in a small town in PA where the bulk of the populace is Christian. Guess which worked out better for me? so who do you obey? god or the material world. rather then people in the NWO doing what is right- everything is the penal code. everything. I am not saying PA is utopia. I am saying I get a fair shake here- because the people are Christians. Throw rocks if you like- but the state is not- and never can be god. a higher power exists- and that is not negotiable. That does not mean other can not be or are not respectful-- but absent of any rules- that then leaves only the state left to mandate such rules. And we know the state has killed millions of people. So that is who you bow down before when you support NWO. Who would Jesus blow smoke at? (WWJBS) Seriously, if everyone would be god fearing "body as temple" folks.. then your way would work... You are not advocating freedom of religion, you are implying imposing your own... no thanks I am more important then the government.

juliaoceania -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:40:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy It is absolutely pathetic that someone could go to jail over a parking ticket. I have worse infractions then that on me. I wont get into details-- but I do. Absolutely chilling that the state can slam someones ass in jail over a monetization issue. Such rules are disproportionate to poor people. That negates that all men are created equal. Fuck California. Let the riots begin! You say that because you have never seen how dickheads park here if given free reign to park where they want and how they want.... if there were no financial penalty to parking like an asshole, many more people would do it. If there were no threat of jail to pay fines, no one would pay them... I like rules, they make life easier to live with others, but then I am a submissive after all, and I do not mind peace and order.

juliaoceania -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:42:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy Funny thing - that the jails are over crowded in CA. They keep trying to shift the prisoners to other states because they are too cheap to pay for them themself. Most people obey laws like not smoking in public places.. and traffic violations, they pay the fines for those... No, it is the Three Strikes Laws that need to be repealed that are causing the overcrowding... You should really research these things before posting about that which you know nothing

Moonhead -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:42:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy I am more important then the government. How did you work that out? Bitching about the ~~conspiracy~~ government seems to be the only thing that gives you any sense of identity or self definition looking at your posts on here.

juliaoceania -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:43:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy Absolutely chilling that the state can slam someones ass in jail over a monetization issue. Such rules are disproportionate to poor people. That negates that all men are created equal. He wasn't so broke that he couldn't pay the fine, he just refused to do so. That's already been pointed out to you three or four times though, so it probably won't sink in now either. Poor people tend not to own pubs, dig? This pub dude is intentionally flouting the law and thumbing his nose to make a point, and now the point of his nose can rot in jail... I feel no pity for the fool.

juliaoceania -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:45:02 AM)
quote: I am more important then the government. The government here in the USA is "The People", and sorry to break it to you, but you as an individual are not more important than the rest of us...

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:50:26 AM)
rah rah- put me in jail- rah rah- I am suezy sunshine. I never break any fed- state- local- county- or other- rules- regs- guidelines- dictates and maxims. and hell yeah- I am more important then the government. most everyone here is more important then the government- because our creator has givin us un-alienable rights. That means that no govt on earth- (including NWO) is able to give us more rights then that.

pahunkboy -> RE: Pub landlord is first person in Britain to be jailed over smoking ban Read more: http://www.dai (3/1/2010 9:55:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead I'm a bit surprised that so little has been said about tobacco taxes in this thread. Given that most of the "How dare you evil liberals try to stop me from smoking in public!" stuff is coming from people who lean to the right (I get the impression that Termy's a libertarian, to pick one example, and apologise if I have that wrong), I'd have thought they'd be a lot more annoyed about the taxes they're paying for their fags. I'm an indy, with a bit of a libertarian bent, I guess, and probably just as much of an anarchist bent, under certain circumstances. Maybe I'm best described as an "thoughtful willow" -- I look at situations, evaluate arguments, and balance it against personal responsibility and individual freedom, and then decide where a given policy is going to carry me. In general, I oppose any laws that restrict an individual person from being able to do whatever xhe pleases with hir body, as long as hir doing so does not cause harm to someone else. For example, I opposed the mandatory vaccination for H1N1 that my employer tried to put into place -- and I agreed that, should I become sick with the flu, I would immediately agree to suspend work, drawing from my accrued vacation pay rather than sick pay, until I was cleared to return by my doctor. (I was one of three people in our department who -didn't- get the flu this season... and none of the three of us got flu shots). I figure that there -are- long-term costs associated with cigarette smoking. I knew that a long time ago, and for many years, I still chose to smoke. It makes perfect sense to me that I would pay taxes to cover the extra costs of my vice. It would make even MORE sense to me if we had a national health plan where those taxes were actually GOING to something having to do with my health, but I'm not even going to -go- there right now. There are taxes I find unjust. I think that it is completely unjust that I have to pay both an INCOME tax AND a SALES tax -- one or the other, to fund the running of a lean government with minimal stacks of intrusive laws... yeah, that would work for me... I'd be willing to pay a 15% flat tax on imported items, OR a 15% flat tax on my income, but double taxation bites wienies (and not in a good way). I believe that people will not learn how to respect one another's private space through "nanny laws" that attempt to compel good manners. I also think that, if someone doesn't want to smell cigarette smoke when they're out in public, they're welcome to choose their venues accordingly, as long as, if -I- want to have a cigarette while I'm out in public, I have the option of having a place where =I= can do so as well. Freedom isn't freedom if you have to step on someone else's neck to get it. Thank you for opposing mandatory h1n1 shots. No one in my family got one either. People can decide for themself if they need that vax.

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