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ORIGINAL: Andalusite

Most of the time, when my Master wants anything of me, I obey without stopping to think about it (unless I need some form of clarification). If it is truly something I'm truly struggling with (so far, it hasn't happened with an order, but has happened with things he wanted and knew ahead of time were things I would have difficulty with), I try to brainstorm with him ways to make it a little easier for me to start with, to ease into it a bit. Sometimes, just sharing that I *am* feeling a little scared or whatever is enough to calm me and reassure me. In general, if someone else tells me to do something, I'm very compliant if they have authority over me, or are reasonably polite about it. If they attempt to order me around when they have no right to do so, I put on my best impression of a mule and refuse, even if I would have done it if they'd asked nicely.

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ORIGINAL: Missokyst

I do not identify as a slave, however when I young and married title or not, that is what I was. Obedience was a conditioned response. I complied regardless of the fact I felt no love for my husband. I obeyed as a survival instinct. It was not that I was phyiscally abused, but mentally my happiness was not important, nor expected. Now as a submissive I obey not as a condtioned response.. instead I do it because I need to make my partner happy. My happiness is important and as such I only choose dominants with whom I feel a connection and who also desire I get something back from the relationship.

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ORIGINAL: UniqueRaven

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ORIGINAL: GraciousLady

As a Dominant I want my subs to willingly submit to me. It has to be their choice. But, I want them to because I have inspired them to do so.

My future Owner inspires me to be his - he draws me to to him to serve him, and him alone in exactly the way that pleases him, and him specifically, because of the Owner and the man that he is.

i see submission and obedience as actions - actions which i am responsible for on my life's journey as slave. There is very little "attached" to my submission and obedience, as i see them as unconditional actions of choice.

Honestly i can submit to, or obey anyone that i choose. It is the choice of who that makes all the difference.

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ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

99% of the time I obey my Sir without thinking about it - not as a conditioned response - but because there is nothing to think about. He wants a cup of coffee? - no brainer - I get it for him.

The other 1% I may query his choices - because they may not be the best thing for him. (Unique circumstances due to cancer and need to drink water and less coffee)
Other that that, I am not a dog, I don't salivate when the bell rings. I don't jump to attention when my Sir barks - but I do pay attention - even if he accuses me of not doing so.

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ORIGINAL: allthatjaz
Its very different with a slave/submissive and this is where nurture and nature start to get intertwined. Her nature wants to please him because pleasing him is a reward. Her nature has given her this awful condition of talking too much! Part of his skills as a Master/Dominant is to nurture/train and he's already on a winning streak because this chatterboxes aim in life is to please her man. She doesn't mind how many times he reminds or even punishes her because he has given her a challenge and that challenge brings positive reward and he will notice when she does change and reward her with his words.
Teachers and parents use positive persuasion with children all the time and it works because children want to please us and very much want us to respect them. The reward is self satisfaction and pride.
I think training only works when its realistic. There must be manageable goals, the goal set must be achievable or eventually it will fail.
A Dominant that takes on a new sub for training may tell her she can only pee when he calls her twice a day and that she must wear a butt plug for work and that she must be waiting naked on all fours when he walks through the door. If she does this it will be her consciously choosing to please him but in most cases will not ever get to the stage of her being trained to do that without thinking because he will probably lose interest and become forgetful about what he asked her to do before she does.

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ORIGINAL: Dominasola

Hmm.  This is tricky.  Neither?  Both?  Very early on in our relationship, I was forced to examine myself and the "inner civil war" that was going on over just how far my capabilities of submission went.  I made the conscious choice to eliminate my feelings of doubt and hesitancy over becoming a slave. So, initially, I did consciously choose to obey (or consciously chose to allow myself to be in a situation in which 100% obedience was required).

Since our relationship is still quite new, I find that I am consciously aware of the things I do that display obedience. I put "do" in bold font because I think that actions are important here - under certain circumstances, I am required to perform certain tasks or present myself in certain ways.  I am aware of my obedience in these situations and have to consciously remember to do them because I haven't been performing them long enough for them to flow unconsciously from me.  I can easily see these actions becoming automatic responses as I perform them more regularly, however I just can't see myself jumping up at the sound of the door opening to kneel in front of him as he steps in from being at work all day without being conscious of expressing my obedience through the kneel.  Even though, however, the thought, "Master is home now, so I have to do ________, " may not cross my mind in the future, and my response will be automatic, I will still be conscious of my continued desire to be obedient to him; it hasn't shut off since I agreed to be his slave.

This transition, I think, only really applies to actions that are more "protocol" in nature. The first few times we went out together, I had to consciously remember that he expected me to take his arm. It wasn't long at all, however, that I found myself automatically doing so without the active thought of "I have to take his arm now."   Hell, now I latch onto him like a leech onto skin...and just like the leech, there is no conscious decision.

My sense of obedience extends farther than just doing what is expected of me, though. I feel great pride in consciously doing little things that I know will make him happy - I do these things as part of my conscious desire to obey him.

As a little addendum as I have been thinking about this further - for situations where he asks me to do something that is NOT part of the "routine," my response, I think, is both conscious and subconscious (although, I don't know if I would call it "conditioned").  Obeying a request/order is conscious because it falls under the "continued conscious desire to obey"  category as everything else, but my obedience to that request isn't a conscious choice. I really have no choice in the matter.  I don't really think it is a conditioned response, though, either. My brain registers it and I am consciously aware of my obedience to the request; I am just not actively deciding to obey (this would assume that I could, alternately, consider disobeying, which is never the case).

I think that if I ever realized that my obedience to him was completely conditioned, I would feel ashamed and disappointed in myself.  I live off of the desire to please him, make him happy, and to obey him because I know that it makes him happy.  If one day I realized that everything I did for him was just the result of an unconscious routine...I don't think there would really be any point to our relationship.

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ORIGINAL: heartfeltsub

Dominating,

Thank you for reply. What you said made a great deal of sense a combination, what i would like to ask in contination, is would you prefer initial conscious choice and have it develop into a more of a conditioned obedience or do you always want it to stay a combination where some is automatic and other things are a willful obeying and submitting?

Thank you again for your reply,
heartfelt

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ORIGINAL: Andalusite

Most of my limits are of degree, rather than of kind. If I'm struggling with something, or I've previously had a bad experience with it, then depending on the relationship, I might still do it even though it is bad for me, or I might say No. Both my Master and my previous Dominant usually were very supportive and encouraging with me in venturing into those areas, rather than making them a question of obedience. I tried to give them a "heads up" about them when we were first dating, before making a commitment. Most of those difficult areas were things that neither of them were all that interested in, so I didn't have to worry about them. Others were things that they liked, but didn't feel were a requirement, so we approached them in a positive way, with lots of encouragement for trying, and less focus on the outcome.

I have some questions, but if you don't feel comfortable answering them, I understand! By limits, do you mean that you wouldn't want to do them with anyone, under any circumstances, or that you didn't feel comfortable and safe doing it with that particular person yet? Were you able to express your reasons for those limits ahead of time, and did they agree not to go there, or did they specifically express an interest in pushing/expanding your limits? Was it an over-all positive experience, and did you find you *wanted* to go there again, or was it still an area of resistance, or something that undermined your self-image that you had done it? Did you get a lot of aftercare or discuss with them how you felt about it afterward, or did you pretend it was no big deal after you had been swept up in the moment?

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ORIGINAL: chamberqueen

I was actually thinking about this same topic on my own this week.  I was talking with my sister slave about how I make a conscious decision every day to continue to give my power to our Master while she is driven to give hers to him, and how even though one is more intellectual and the other more emotional they must both be very valuable to him.  Ironically, even though she feels that she has no choice but to serve him she picks and chooses which tasks to follow while I simply will myself to do whatever is asked of me no matter how difficult.  One is not necessarily better than the other; what makes the service most treasured is when it is whole hearted no matter whether the heart, mind, or most likely some combination, is driving it.

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ORIGINAL: Domin8tingUrDrmz

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ORIGINAL: heartfeltsub

Dominating,

Thank you for reply. What you said made a great deal of sense a combination, what i would like to ask in contination, is would you prefer initial conscious choice and have it develop into a more of a conditioned obedience or do you always want it to stay a combination where some is automatic and other things are a willful obeying and submitting?

Thank you again for your reply,
heartfelt

I believe I'd always want some sense of concious choice. Not over every little detail, but I want to know that if I'm having an off day, they are going to be aware of that and give me some feedback. So, over time, I'd prefer a more auto-pilot response once trust has been established, with a concious awareness.

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ORIGINAL: heartfeltsub

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ORIGINAL: Missokyst

I do not identify as a slave, however when I young and married title or not, that is what I was. Obedience was a conditioned response. I complied regardless of the fact I felt no love for my husband. I obeyed as a survival instinct. It was not that I was phyiscally abused, but mentally my happiness was not important, nor expected. Now as a submissive I obey not as a condtioned response.. instead I do it because I need to make my partner happy. My happiness is important and as such I only choose dominants with whom I feel a connection and who also desire I get something back from the relationship.

Thank you for your reply. i can see where obeying as a survival mechanism would not be anything like being in a relationship where your happiness is important and you are being fed in the relationship. So given the fact that a conditioned obedience is possible for you, do you ever feel like your obedience comes from that place or because the difference in the relationships, does it not feel like that.

Thank you again for your reply,
heartfelt