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A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 11:53:16 AM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		Alright, het men, I'm looking for your perspectives.

A week ago, I was sitting with a bunch of men I know in a "business social" or networking context and later in the evening, the conversation changed to relationships. They all went on about how no heterosexual man will be friends with a woman he doesn't want to bed or more.

Of course, I interjected mentioning that one of my best friends is a heterosexual man and another really good friend of mine who I share a lot with is a straight man as well. They all laughed and told me I was blind. They assured me that if those guys weren't into me, my situation would be an extremely rare situation.

Are these guys bang on? Or am I the exception (I guess twice)? Or is this all macho nonsense and a man can have a meaningful with a woman he has no desire to be with? Be honest with yourselves and me, please.

- LA

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 12:15:11 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		I think there is always some measure of sexual tension in such friendships. In the best cases, that tension just becomes a little inside joke between friends. It doesn't have to be a problem.



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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 12:18:48 PM   
LillyoftheVally


Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline 		I think there is often something, either assumption the other person is interested in you or you being interested in them, sorry I am not a het man though

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 12:27:16 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		could it be that there is no attraction?   even tho- it is het- maybe there is not the sex appeal.


so in that regard you would be correct.

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 12:31:08 PM   
Phoenixpower


Posts: 8098
Status: offline 		IMO it is perfectly possible. I am in friendship with quite a few guys who are hetero and there is nothing else and never will be....personally I prefer friendship to men compared to women as they are sooooooooo much easier to get along with....just my view.

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 12:32:02 PM   
SirLost


Posts: 142
Joined: 7/5/2009
Status: offline 		I find it unbelievable when people mature and intelligent enough to participate in business social activities can make such stupid generalizations.

Okay, there are pretty ones among my female friends and some of them are single -which can make them potential girlfriends-, I won't talk about them. But what the f*ck, a big amount of them are 'unattractive', I wouldn't have sex with them unless they are the only remaining females in the world  (and no, they don't die for being with me, but that's not the topic. I had to state this).   

Most importantly, I do have male friends and guess what, I am not intending to bed them. I guess the minds of those people in OP's meeting aren't sufficient enough to comprehend that I can befriend a female for the same reasons I befriend males.


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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:03:23 PM   
LadyAngelika


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Joined: 7/4/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

I think there is always some measure of sexual tension in such friendships. In the best cases, that tension just becomes a little inside joke between friends. It doesn't have to be a problem.


I don't think it has to be a problem either. And it isn't the first time that I've heard this mentality. I guess it's a mix of this and a few other things that have me wondering.

And to the others, I do appreciate the responses from those other than heterosexual men, it's just that I know that generally, men and women don't think the same way about relationships and I'm looking for perspectives from the other side.

- LA

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:11:27 PM   
LadyAngelika


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Joined: 7/4/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SirLost

I find it unbelievable when people mature and intelligent enough to participate in business social activities can make such stupid generalizations.


I don't find it unbelievable to find a diversity of personalities, personal beliefs and ideologies amongst buiness people. We aren't a homogeneous group. I should add that these weren't all North American men. A few of them were Western & Eastern European and a few from Latin America. This complexifies the issue a little more.

quote:

Okay, there are pretty ones among my female friends and some of them are single -which can make them potential girlfriends-, I won't talk about them. But what the f*ck, a big amount of them are 'unattractive', I wouldn't have sex with them unless they are the only remaining females in the world  (and no, they don't die for being with me, but that's not the topic. I had to state this).   


Well I'm not super model, but both of the men I am referring too as well as the men involved in the conversation I described in the OP are of the opinion that I am an attractive woman. The group of men also all stated that it was more than a physical thing. When a man has a woman as his confidant, he has an emotional tie to her that screams a deep attraction (their words, not mine). Man did I ever feel on the hot seat. Thank goodness it was a good natured debate and there were rounds of Martinis!

quote:

Most importantly, I do have male friends and guess what, I am not intending to bed them. I guess the minds of those people in OP's meeting aren't sufficient enough to comprehend that I can befriend a female for the same reasons I befriend males.


My standard response to "men and women cannot be friends because of potential attraction" statement in the past was that by being bisexual, I couldn't be friends with anyone, so that this theory didn't hold water.

But I always have a little voice in the back of my head which was amplified by the discussion last week that makes me doubt.

- LA



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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:17:23 PM   
SirLost


Posts: 142
Joined: 7/5/2009
Status: offline 		On the other hand, I agree that the way men and women think about is different. I don't intend to jump to conclusions after my previous posts, but my observations make me believe that men are more likely to seize opposite sex as potential sex partners (and myself is included to this observation). But it just doesn't mean we are nice to a woman solely because of a sexual reason.

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:25:04 PM   
subexploring


Posts: 103
Joined: 12/28/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

Alright, het men, I'm looking for your perspectives.

A week ago, I was sitting with a bunch of men I know in a "business social" or networking context and later in the evening, the conversation changed to relationships. They all went on about how no heterosexual man will be friends with a woman he doesn't want to bed or more.

Of course, I interjected mentioning that one of my best friends is a heterosexual man and another really good friend of mine who I share a lot with is a straight man as well. They all laughed and told me I was blind. They assured me that if those guys weren't into me, my situation would be an extremely rare situation.

Are these guys bang on? Or am I the exception (I guess twice)? Or is this all macho nonsense and a man can have a meaningful with a woman he has no desire to be with? Be honest with yourselves and me, please.

- LA


In my experience, something like this was true in my early-mid 20s but ceased to be true as I got older and had more sexual experience, thus less urgency / need to prove myself sexually. Learning to have a greater appreciation of women as human beings first also made a difference. No offense, but I tend to think men who hold this belief are a little immature.

I do think there's a grain of truth here in that men are more indiscriminate sexually than women, so tend to have at least some sexual curiousity about women they like -- wouldn't mind giving them a try in bed, etc. But that's very different from the friendship being just some kind of cover for a desire to bed the woman. Given the choice, there are a number of women who I would turn down sex with in order to make sure our friendship was preserved and things didn't get weird. Sex can make friendship tricky (and the better the sex is, the trickier the friendship gets).

< Message edited by subexploring -- 5/15/2010 1:26:37 PM >

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:32:49 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Alright, het men, I'm looking for your perspectives.

A week ago, I was sitting with a bunch of men I know in a "business social" or networking context and later in the evening, the conversation changed to relationships. They all went on about how no heterosexual man will be friends with a woman he doesn't want to bed or more.

Of course, I interjected mentioning that one of my best friends is a heterosexual man and another really good friend of mine who I share a lot with is a straight man as well. They all laughed and told me I was blind. They assured me that if those guys weren't into me, my situation would be an extremely rare situation.

Are these guys bang on? Or am I the exception (I guess twice)? Or is this all macho nonsense and a man can have a meaningful with a woman he has no desire to be with? Be honest with yourselves and me, please.

- LA


Yes, I can be friends with a woman that I don't want to sleep with.

However, I can, and am, friends with a number of women that I DO want to also sleep with, or that I at least find sexually attractive.



_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to subexploring)
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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:37:34 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		Thanks for your perspective subexploring. For the record, I don't think that with either of the men I'm friends with that the friendship is a cover-up for them wanting to simply have sex. They would have invested way too much time and energy for a sexual experience.

But I think there are at least two levels they were alluding to here:
- casual friendship with underlying sexual tension
- deep friendship with underlying deeper emotional desire tension

I agree with you about maturity on behalf of all parties.

Also, I would add the the group of men did say that though the men might prefer a friendship with me, that at one point they had a desire. Gosh, what to make of bar stool psychology?!

- LA

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:39:09 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Yes, I can be friends with a woman that I don't want to sleep with.


What is your degree of closeness with these women? Are some of these the first ones you call when you need to talk to someone?

What are the reasons you don't want to sleep with them? Is it because you don't find them attractive or is it because you value your friendship with them more and don't want to ruin it?

- LA

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:40:46 PM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline 		I have had some really great female friends that I did not want to fuck. I've also had some really great female friends that I really wanted to fuck but would never have done so even if they threw it at me like a Frisbee©. I've learned the hard way early in adulthood that often the sexual tension is far more enjoyable than the payoff and it's just better not to go there with friends. I don't know anything about your colleagues' business acumen but I wouldn't rely on them too much for relationship advice.




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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:44:18 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus

I have had some really great female friends that I did not want to fuck. I've also had some really great female friends that I really wanted to fuck but would never have done so even if they threw it at me like a Frisbee©. I've learned the hard way early in adulthood that often the sexual tension is far more enjoyable than the payoff and it's just better not to go there with friends. I don't know anything about your colleagues' business acumen but I wouldn't rely on them too much for relationship advice.



I appreciate your perspective.

As for the men, how is reflecting on something they said equate to me taking relationship advice from them? I gather impressions and opinions from various sources and make up my own mind, much like I'm doing on this thread.

- LA

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:46:27 PM   
Searchin4What


Posts: 16
Joined: 7/18/2007
Status: offline 		My experience with female friends has been that I will need to address the relationship issue (either by talking to them or by thinking it out) before I can get to that level of not wanting to date/sleep with her.

In some cases, we talked it out and it was fine.

In others, she was not a good fit as a lover but a good fit as a friend.

It seems that women are able to put a man in the 'friends but not lovers' category with much more alacrity than a man is...and a lot of men would still be willing to sleep with a friend.

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:50:23 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

What is your degree of closeness with these women?


Quite close, to some.

quote:

Are some of these the first ones you call when you need to talk to someone?


Yes.

quote:

What are the reasons you don't want to sleep with them?
Is it because you don't find them attractive or is it because you value your friendship with them more and don't want to ruin it


It's because I don't find them physically attractive; if they are attractive, then I want to have sex with them, on a physical level, if nothing else... those little movies play in the mind's eye, but that does not mean I would try, or allow, it to happen.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 1:59:58 PM   
jbcurious


Posts: 717
Joined: 3/13/2010
Status: offline 		LA, I just got off the phone with my best friend, male and 10 years younger...there has never been anything sexual between us but are very affectionate with each other. I asked him your question in regards to our friendship. He said the reasons we're friends are...
You're the coolest woman I know
I can tell you anything and it stays between us.
Any party is better when you're there
You made me a pineapple upside down cake when I moved into my flat
No, I don't want to have sex with you...but some brownies??

I hope this helps

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 2:02:43 PM   
NorthernGent


Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

Are these guys bang on? Or am I the exception (I guess twice)? Or is this all macho nonsense and a man can have a meaningful with a woman he has no desire to be with? Be honest with yourselves and me, please.

- LA


Perhaps they're the sort of men who are out for what they can get.....so where they become 'friends' with women.....they're the sort of women they want to fuck...so they become 'friends' with them as a road in to what they really want..

What about blokes who are more interested in what someone has to say first and foremost?

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RE: A question for heterosexual men - 5/15/2010 2:08:54 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jbcurious

LA, I just got off the phone with my best friend, male and 10 years younger...there has never been anything sexual between us but are very affectionate with each other. I asked him your question in regards to our friendship. He said the reasons we're friends are...
You're the coolest woman I know
I can tell you anything and it stays between us.
Any party is better when you're there
You made me a pineapple upside down cake when I moved into my flat
No, I don't want to have sex with you...but some brownies??

I hope this helps


Please say thank you to him for me and tell him I send him a virtual brownie ;-)

- LA

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