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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 3:42:58 AM

VaguelyCurious

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That's not it, I'm afraid, but you're welcome to a smooch any time, my darling!

*SMOOOOCH*

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 3:45:03 AM

Level

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Yay!!

Now, someone find the lady her link!

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 4:03:41 AM

laurell3

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

FR

So where is the love? I suspect that in many cases it stays between the two(/three/four/however many) people involved.

Bingo!

Much of that stuff is not something I would express on a public forum. Hell you get chided and called sappy and sickening for so little around here, I'm not sure there's really an overwhelming desire for others to read it anyway.

I personally don't have much desire to have a couple thousand random internet strangers getting in the middle of my relationships. I'm quirky like that,

and honestly, there have been many times where people have posted about truly intimate subjects where I really cringed for their partner that they chose to air such sensitive information here.

I think there are way more balanced and healthy fully loving relationships here than people convey in select topics that are about d/s and/or bdsm. When a thread asks about spankings, responding with comments about love isn't really on topic or socially tactful. And, let's face it, talking about that stuff isn't as sexy. Hypothesizing about what one would or would not do in the context of role is much more sensational than admitting that the actual majority of what we do in relationships isn't wiitwd at all or even role based. But who wants to hear about that stuff in this venue?

I think you will find though that there are MANY threads on the preference to establish a "vanilla" rapore prior to talking about kink and that viewpoint does seem to be common here imo.

< Message edited by laurell3 -- 7/13/2010 4:41:00 AM >

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 4:27:39 AM

mastertizzi

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personally what attracts me to the lifestyle is the lack of a need to go through all the standard stuff.

i've tried to find an equal, i've put forth my best efforts to find a mate, but in the end it just doesn't work out for me.
i can't say for sure what it is, i know that in my life nothing was ever really "just do it like that" simple. my thinking is well, extremely abstract. (that's what they told me anyways) its not that this is a bad thing, its just that "standard" never seems to work for me.

when i started exploring beyond just a simple dom role play, and looking into a master/slave relationship, it was like a red light went off.
i just seem to have a natural dominant tendency, which i know that is partly to blame in my lack of being able to make things work in a normal relationship.

really all in all its kinda hard to explain, but for me its like a dream come true. in any romantic fantasy that i've ever had, there was never an equal role shared. it was always about everything being perfect, my mate is always willing to make me happy, this not being entirely sexual either.

in real life normal relationships i tend to get cornered to where i just give up on it, because i start to feel that there is no hope, as compromises are needed, and i can't compromise, and at the same time i overtake too much and decide how things have to be.
in short it just doesn't work for me.

i decided that the best thing for me is to own first then love later.

one thing that it gives that a normal relationship will never have from the start, is a higher level of trust. it seems that trust on the standard scale for a relationship becomes something frivolous when compared to the trust that is required on a more physical level. where the slave/sub is in a compromising position, that the master/dom has full control, there is that certain deeper level of trust that the sub must have, which in short i find as something beautiful. the fact that the sub/slave trusts that the master/dom will take care of them and not overstep the agreed hard limits, despite the fact that the dom/master has complete control.
its a deepness that im not sure that most standard relationships will ever experience.

i hope that makes sense. (getting a bit sleepy here)

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 4:42:59 AM

lally2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

maybe they just haven't encountered the shift from "me" to "us" yet.

i think maybe this is the thing. the emphasis is so much on what people need physically with BDSM and psychologically with Ds or Ms the shift from 'me' to 'us' gets given less emphasis.

then you get the mentality of the guy slanging people off for wanting a boyfriend rather than a Dominant and you realise how the misconception that this sort of relationship isnt about love at all and only about getting youre needs met.

fact is pretty much every guy whose written to me is looking for a committed relationship but there is also the unwritten codicil that the revolving door is very much in operation and that revolving door mentality makes working at a relationship less imperative somehow.

if youve been around a while that revolving door becomes easier to negotiate. it used to be that when a relationship failed id take months sometimes to re-group, now it takes me no time at all to just move on to the next hopeful. so in a way for some theres maybe the mentality that theyll go for the kink and the Ds and if a relationship comes out of it then all the better.

but then you have the added complication here of Dominance and submission - those two aspects of what we do here are highly individual interpretations and are so variable that just that alone can make or break a thing.

i do think therefore that love is one of those things that people dont leap into very quickly here - there are too many 'me' needs from both sides and too many things to trip things up. the shift to 'us' and love can only develop and grow as a relationship does and so many dont last long enough to get there. maybe people hold back on love until they feel sure theyre in a relationship where that investment is worth spending, to do otherwise would mess you up quite badly i think.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 4:57:49 AM

laurell3

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God I love that pic lally!

I agree, but sometimes it is about this:

quote:

then you get the mentality of the guy slanging people off for wanting a boyfriend rather than a Dominant and you realise how the misconception that this sort of relationship isnt about love at all and only about getting youre needs met.

and that's really ok too as long as you are honest about it.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 6:50:50 AM

lally2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

God I love that pic lally!

thank you *smoochies* xx

I agree, but sometimes it is about this:

quote:

then you get the mentality of the guy slanging people off for wanting a boyfriend rather than a Dominant and you realise how the misconception that this sort of relationship isnt about love at all and only about getting youre needs met.

and that's really ok too as long as you are honest about it.

oh i agree - but the two cannot be confused and yet they so often are i think, or atleast the above tends to bleed into the relationship guys too - easy come easy go - have a bit of fun along the way - plenty more fish - blah blah. one piece of the jigsaw doesnt fit and it all gets thrown out, but sometimes that piece of the jigsaw is quite a big one - and ive been guilty of this myself, more often than im prepared to admit

i suppose what im saying is that a level of promiscuity BDSM-wise has entered into it all because of the very nature of the internet really. if we were all swimming in our little local ponds would there be the revolving door so much.

< Message edited by lally2 -- 7/13/2010 6:52:02 AM >

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 7:20:45 AM

Kana

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Plasticine

I've tried to compose this thought several times and it just isn't coming together so here's out with it. There are a lot of current threads regarding the actual relationship between people. Discussions have regarded limits, aftercare, falling in love and other things which seem to be at their core about intimacy.

Why does it seem like so many people subjugate the "human relationship" part of WIITWD to the "kink" part? Maybe I'm old fashioned but I think that establishing a "vanilla" rapport and intimacy should still be the way to start a relationship of any kind. So why do so many posts seem to put the cart before the horse? Or if you'd rather, please rant about how I'm wrong. I like that part too.

Sigh. People.
I can't speak for anyone else, but for me the human element and the kink element are inseparable.
My kink is people-power and control over them. There is no subjugating of the relationship-the relationship is the focus, getting to know her, read her tells, her triggers, learning which strings to pull.
Make no mistake about it, it's all about the human element.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 7:45:04 AM

porcelaine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2

i suppose what im saying is that a level of promiscuity BDSM-wise has entered into it all because of the very nature of the internet really. if we were all swimming in our little local ponds would there be the revolving door so much.

lally,

See that's the thing. I don't think it's nearly as promiscuous as people are putting forth. But I do believe that this idea that kink is the end all and be all can only take one so far. Especially if you haven't established a relationship with another party beforehand as LadyPact articulated so eloquently. And granted, there are some that may be looking for the past-time but I don't think that's indicative of most. And with that number I'm also suggesting that some of the people looking aren't fully cognizant in what they want, they just know they want 'something'. Now I'm all for folks having their fantasy until it reaches the point where they start affixing their reality on other people and defining what is/isn't according to a flawed philosophy that they aren't adhering to themselves. The downside is that the unsuspecting buys into what's projected and mimics behaviors that hinder their quest in the long run.

And by the way, I love the new pic! I saw it yesterday on my list and you look great! *smooch*

~porcelaine

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 8:12:02 AM

aldompdx

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Love or fulfillment arises in the only place it is felt, one's very own heart. With that awareness, one can openly and unconditionally share their own fulfillment with another. That is intimacy (subjectification). One who lacks that awareness will bargain to obtain exclusively external inspiration for feeling fulfillment. That is objectification.

One who recognizes the actual source of their feelings, they can appreciate external things which resonate with and inspire their feelings. It is like a musical duet. One musician does not give or cause the other to make music, but can resonantly inspire its creation and expression.

While it may seem that kink is about objectification, it is actually a deeper search for intimacy. Those who find intimacy often tend to not search so hard.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 8:18:25 AM

BitaTruble

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Plasticine

I've tried to compose this thought several times and it just isn't coming together so here's out with it. There are a lot of current threads regarding the actual relationship between people. Discussions have regarded limits, aftercare, falling in love and other things which seem to be at their core about intimacy.

Why does it seem like so many people subjugate the "human relationship" part of WIITWD to the "kink" part? Maybe I'm old fashioned but I think that establishing a "vanilla" rapport and intimacy should still be the way to start a relationship of any kind. So why do so many posts seem to put the cart before the horse? Or if you'd rather, please rant about how I'm wrong. I like that part too.

What's right for you is right for you.. as long as you realize that it doesn't apply to everyone. Himself and I started right off the bat as D/s and our relationship evolved over time to include romantic love. We've got 15 solid years behind us so, obviously, it can work the other way as well.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 8:20:34 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Plasticine

Why does it seem like so many people subjugate the "human relationship" part of WIITWD to the "kink" part? Maybe I'm old fashioned but I think that establishing a "vanilla" rapport and intimacy should still be the way to start a relationship of any kind. So why do so many posts seem to put the cart before the horse? Or if you'd rather, please rant about how I'm wrong. I like that part too.

I can only answer for me, but while I sort of agree with the sentiment -- that the real interaction is between people, not between "kinks" -- I have to say that the general gist of your post reinforces the whole idea that everyone who participates in fetish activities has to be in a romantic relationship. That just isn't true for me. I have casual involvements with people where we do nothing but play around with needles or floggers or fire. I have other people with whom I have close familial relationships but with whom I do my level best not to get all up on my "bossy" horse (a tough one, considering that I'm bossy and domineering even when -not- in an authority-based dynamic!!!).

I think that it's -fine- to have casual relationships where the thing that you share is the fetish and that's it, as long as everyone is on board for that. I have a lot of casual associates who I wouldn't call 'friends' -- we just don't really get along socially that well in any setting that doesn't involve me decorating them with needles, piercing strange parts of their body, or leaving red marks in pretty patterns over their bodies... and that's ok. Everyone involved knows why xhe's there, and our expectations are commensurate with that knowledge.

JMTC-YMMV

Calla

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 8:48:46 AM

MistressRoux

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Depends on the person. At this point, I'm more likely to put the cart before the horse because that's where my priorities are at the moment, but someday, I'll get it the right way around and that will be the day that I'm actually looking for a real thing versus a monogamous thing for the benefits of monogamy and not much else.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 9:18:13 AM

lally2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine

Now I'm all for folks having their fantasy until it reaches the point where they start affixing their reality on other people and defining what is/isn't according to a flawed philosophy that they aren't adhering to themselves. The downside is that the unsuspecting buys into what's projected and mimics behaviors that hinder their quest in the long run.

And by the way, I love the new pic! I saw it yesterday on my list and you look great! *smooch*

thanks hun xxx

~porcelaine

it may not be promiscuity on a grand scale, but i have to admit ive gone through more men here in BDSM land than at any time else in my life (god that makes me sound such a ho!) - but in a way it was all about a fantasy i had in my head that they didnt live up to (ive grown up a bit now tho). the 'me' and what i wanted was very strong and what they wanted barely featured - im talking at the very start.

i think the people who respond to posts like this are people, who like myself have grown, changed and learnt to step into the harness of submission more capably. ive now (hopefully) found myself a man i can love and surrender to because ive dropped the me and im focusing on the 'us'.

but i can remember a time when love was not the focus at all, getting my fix was - it was all about submission and to whom almost didnt matter - now theres a confession

. i realise thats just me but i dont think im all that rare to be honest. im in touch with newbie subs who are doing pretty much what i did, they want the love but they cant extricate the 'me' and find the 'us' enough to find the love. they will but it takes a time to get all the pieces up together to make the picture.

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 10:45:58 AM

porcelaine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2

but in a way it was all about a fantasy i had in my head that they didnt live up to (ive grown up a bit now tho). the 'me' and what i wanted was very strong and what they wanted barely featured - im talking at the very start.

lally,

Admittedly I'm smiling as I recollect then and now. You've come a long way and the changes are amazing. Mistakes or not, your ability to harness that into something better speaks of the resolve you carried within and your commitment to having what you seek. Attributes I find admirable and indicative of why you're further ahead at present.

quote:

i think the people who respond to posts like this are people, who like myself have grown, changed and learnt to step into the harness of submission more capably. ive now (hopefully) found myself a man i can love and surrender to because ive dropped the me and im focusing on the 'us'.

I like the line about harnessing submission. It's well articulated. I also believe we evolve. We discover ourselves amidst the changes and finally reach the point where we're narrowed down what makes us happy companion wise. I know I have. But that's undergone a lot of change over the years.

quote:

but i can remember a time when love was not the focus at all, getting my fix was - it was all about submission and to whom almost didnt matter - now theres a confession . i realise thats just me but i dont think im all that rare to be honest. im in touch with newbie subs who are doing pretty much what i did, they want the love but they cant extricate the 'me' and find the 'us' enough to find the love. they will but it takes a time to get all the pieces up together to make the picture.

Is this where I confess those delightful late twenties models make me ponder the 'fix' you've mentioned?

I digress some temptations are challenging to resist. *laughs* I discovered that moving from the place where everything centered on the individual took concerted effort and a more developed mindset on my end. But then I recognized the necessity of complementing that appropriately to permit the coalescence I sought. I place a heavy premise on having the right fit more than ever before. He must be on par with me and we should be operating from the save wavelength, or it just won't work. Now finding that is something altogether different. But I'm patience and picky. Both keep me centered and focused on the larger goal.

As for you, I can only hope this is it. You know my thoughts and desires where you're concerned. I needn't repeat them. Just give me the happy ending so we have something to celebrate. You're more than deserving.

~porcelaine

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 11:15:59 AM

MissSepphora1

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here is where the line blurs, and sorry if someone has already said this.
the married people on here who say... i love my spouse but they don't understand me sexually. so i have to be a dominant/submissive discreetly because oh lord if they found out would i be in trouble.
and the more funny ones are the married subs looking for service only.
if you want to clean someone's house, clean your own. you might get laid every once in a while.
just my blunt, cynical .02.
so yes, i'm looking for a loving relationship, but i'd like it to start out with a little kink, so i know neither of us will need to go looking for ANYTHING elsewhere.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 11:21:22 AM

LaTigresse

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To have a slave in service to me I do not require romantic love. I am not even sure I want it. Like them? Yes! Enjoy being with them? Absolutely! Care about them? Wouldn't want it any other way. But madly in love....... Not even on my radar.

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 11:33:00 AM

Frankseas

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"Whats Love Got to do with it? HUH Absolutely Nothing!!" All this place is for is for like minded people to share and enjoy the same kink. And some get lucky and find the right one to.

But Love? Hell go to one of those Love match places....Like Vanilla Romances.Com or Russian Brides for You!

A kink is easy to share and enjoy as well not much work involved in it. But Love is a full time job to work at to get it growing and keep improving on it and most of all giving your heart to it. And heartbreak doesnt happen as much in BDSM as it does in real life!

So keep looking for Love....good luck!

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 12:11:46 PM

porcelaine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Frankseas

But Love? Hell go to one of those Love match places....Like Vanilla Romances.Com or Russian Brides for You!

So love makes the person non kink oriented now?

quote:

A kink is easy to share and enjoy as well not much work involved in it. But Love is a full time job to work at to get it growing and keep improving on it and most of all giving your heart to it. And heartbreak doesnt happen as much in BDSM as it does in real life!

Really? Allow me to redirect your attention to the umpteen threads regarding the subject you profess rarely happens. I'm sorry, but disappointment and heartbreak is just as common in BDSM as non kink relationships.

~porcelaine

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RE: Where's the love? - 7/13/2010 12:28:06 PM

NorthernGent

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Plasticine

I've tried to compose this thought several times and it just isn't coming together so here's out with it. There are a lot of current threads regarding the actual relationship between people. Discussions have regarded limits, aftercare, falling in love and other things which seem to be at their core about intimacy.

Why does it seem like so many people subjugate the "human relationship" part of WIITWD to the "kink" part? Maybe I'm old fashioned but I think that establishing a "vanilla" rapport and intimacy should still be the way to start a relationship of any kind. So why do so many posts seem to put the cart before the horse? Or if you'd rather, please rant about how I'm wrong. I like that part too.

I would agree in the sense that getting to know someone is of the utmost importance as opposed to diving in whip first. Although the obligatory horses for courses still stands depending upon taste.

But 'vanilla rapport'? Not likely. You're looking for a submissive woman presumably....so presumably that is what you're sounding out....do you have something going?....can you get something going?....with a woman who can offer what you need beyond the short term.

And the 'human relationship'.....it's all human ain't it?

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