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RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:11:03 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		Thanks for clarifying, julia!! I know perfectly well that you are not a dingbat by anyone's standards!

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(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:14:00 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I consider it my dominant's job to know the techniques he wants to incorporate in play, unless he tells me it is mine, and then I would take a more active interest I suppose...

Also, I would wonder about a dominant that learned their techniques via an internet message board... reading will only help one so much


With all due respect julia, I encourage all submissives to have some understanding of proper techniques and to never lay the responsibility for their participation at the feet of a dominant. A little knowledge makes it much easier for them to identify when they may be in the hands of the dangerous or clueless.


I really agree with that, erin. Especially when so many participate on the basis of their fantasies and what they read in novels, having no idea that some of things they dream of or some author has floridly written about, are perhaps a tad more dangerous than they think.

There are those who do not have a clue that the person they play with is not some blow up doll where they can do whatever what they want to and the next day it will all go away.

To understand it is a flesh and blood person they are playing with just interferes with the hotness of the fantasy.

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:22:06 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Now if I were into going down to the local dungeon and playing casually, I would probably think differently about this, but since I do not, and since when I am bottoming I am also submitting, it makes the dominant in that arena completely responsible for having skills.. my responsibility is to give him information about my health status prior to play, during play, and after play.


Whoa julia, nowhere did I say that I don't believe that a dominant needs to own the responsibility for their skills and actions. I believe though that no matter how much responsibility a dominant has, it does not absolve the submissive of their responsibility to be aware and have an understanding of the risks that come with their participation. I believe a submissive has far more responsibility than making their health status available. This has nothing to do with casual play vs. private play.

I disagree with you that great information can not be found on an internet website such as this. Yes, it does come down to common sense...it always does. I am not a proponent of the one true way either but one can put out information that gets a person to think and investigate for themselves about any particular topic. If one does not belong to a community and their only source of information regarding techniques, risks and safety is coming from the person they are submitting/bottoming to, it seems to be that the likelihood of them getting a "one true way" opinion in that situation is far greater than getting it from a diverse source such as this where the information presented is commented on/debated from a variety of perspectives.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:25:03 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

I really agree with that, erin. Especially when so many participate on the basis of their fantasies and what they read in novels, having no idea that some of things they dream of or some author has floridly written about, are perhaps a tad more dangerous than they think.

There are those who do not have a clue that the person they play with is not some blow up doll where they can do whatever what they want to and the next day it will all go away.

To understand it is a flesh and blood person they are playing with just interferes with the hotness of the fantasy.


Seriously, if someone is coming at kink with that idealistic and naive perspective, what makes you think they are going to listen to good advice on message boards? There is a lot of stuff on here that 1. is wrong or 2. completely incomplete. I would no sooner think I had educated myself about suspension play by reading a forum, then think I could learn how to become a dentist from reading one... Sometimes a little knowledge is even more dangerous than a lot.,

I am reminded of people who ask how to use a whip on their partner on here

The only way to really educate yourself on things like this is to go to seminars that train people to do dangerous things, you ain't going to get it here....and if you do not have enough common sense to know that if you are going to tie someone up they need to have circulation, etc, perhaps you need to log off and read an anatomy book

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:27:35 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

I really agree with that, erin. Especially when so many participate on the basis of their fantasies and what they read in novels, having no idea that some of things they dream of or some author has floridly written about, are perhaps a tad more dangerous than they think.

There are those who do not have a clue that the person they play with is not some blow up doll where they can do whatever what they want to and the next day it will all go away.

To understand it is a flesh and blood person they are playing with just interferes with the hotness of the fantasy.


Seriously, if someone is coming at kink with that idealistic and naive perspective, what makes you think they are going to listen to good advice on message boards? There is a lot of stuff on here that 1. is wrong or 2. completely incomplete. I would no sooner think I had educated myself about suspension play by reading a forum, then think I could learn how to become a dentist from reading one... Sometimes a little knowledge is even more dangerous than a lot.,

I am reminded of people who ask how to use a whip on their partner on here

The only way to really educate yourself on things like this is to go to seminars that train people to do dangerous things, you ain't going to get it here....and if you do not have enough common sense to know that if you are going to tie someone up they need to have circulation, etc, perhaps you need to log off and read an anatomy book


Oh I agree with all that. I was just saying that the concept of the OP was one that I agreed with. Of course, I would never recommend getting your learning from one place, especially a message board. :)

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:33:49 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		... and they all sang Kumbayah.

Amen.

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:35:59 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		I think there's a disconnect here. Most of us don't submit to someone we just play with. We also don't submit the first time we meet someone. So someone like Julia, who doesn't play casually, as I don't, and only plays inside a committed relationship as I do, is already going to know about what he knows and who competent he is before the first playdate. We learn it during the dating process.

Now at this point, 8 years into the relationship I'm certainly not going to put him through any questioning about his skills. If he says he wants to try something new, then I'm going to offer him help finding resources to learn about it. If he says he doesn't need my help, I'll believe him. Because I already know he won't take chances with my safety. So either it means he did it with someone else or he's learned it without mentioning it to me. But his personality isn't going to change overnight so I know I'm safe with him.

In general though, why don't people talk about safety? Because you get shot down if you do. If someone says they are going to do something that seems risky, someone will point it out at which point the op gets defensive about how he isn't the domliest thing around and gets nasty to those who point out his stupidity. So it does get pointed out and then it gets dropped as nobody in their right mind willingly courts flaming. I exempt the people who populate religion & politics of course.


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Slave to laundry

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(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:36:58 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

I believe though that no matter how much responsibility a dominant has, it does not absolve the submissive of their responsibility to be aware and have an understanding of the risks that come with their participation


Hmmmm.... isn't that a pretty basic thing? Of course one should be risk aware, that is elementary stuff.... common sense stuff. If someone does not have enough common sense to know this, are they going to learn it here?

We are discussing how come people do not contribute to technique threads, the above concept is not about technique, it is about kink risk awareness, consent, etc. Those threads do very well here.

Like I said repeatedly though, there are people on these interwebs that think they are experts because they read it on a message board... they aren't. Picking good partners is the best way to keep a submissive safe, and a good skilled dominant will make sure that the submissive knows there are risks... if people are learning together they should seek knowledge in the real world, not here...that is my opinion

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:38:50 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Thanks for clarifying, julia!! I know perfectly well that you are not a dingbat by anyone's standards!


Well, I can be a dingbat...lol... this is why I am careful about who ties me up, etc... I don't think it is a good idea to have two dingbats doing BDSM...

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:40:09 AM   
Rochsub2009


Posts: 2536
Status: offline 		Mistoferin,
I agree with your general point.  Stupid questions by wankers go on for pages and pages, while substantive conversations about actual BDSM activities die on the vine.

I think that one reason for this is that we all have unique BDSM interests.  You mentioned that your thread was about blood play.  That is not a topic that interests me, so I would never participate in that conversation.  Similarly, a topic like mummification may be interesting, but it's not interesting to me.  So I would ignore that thread.

I think that people who have been on here a while know that I am a service oriented male sub.  So when topics on those areas come up, I almost always participate.  I also consider myself to be one of the resident experts on male chastity and chastity devices.  So whenever someone ask a question about that, I almost always offer my thoughts.

No given kink is going to appeal to everybody.  But a thread like men is panties has pretty universal appeal.  So don't let it get you down.

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:43:15 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

Oh I agree with all that. I was just saying that the concept of the OP was one that I agreed with. Of course, I would never recommend getting your learning from one place, especially a message board. :)


The thing that scares me, people do

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:46:06 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

So it does get pointed out and then it gets dropped as nobody in their right mind willingly courts flaming. I exempt the people who populate religion & politics of course.


Slight hijack of my own thread but I just have to say....now THAT there was some funny shit!

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:47:52 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dovie

quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss
...
Best,
sunshine



Ditto! 
 
dovie
 
 


Dovie - I know you wrote me on the other side.  I tried to write back, but you have me blocked.  FYI.
sunshine

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to dovie)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:47:57 AM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline 		mist,

I love you posts, I love your threads. I don't usually peruse that section and don't engage in blood play, sorry I missed it.

I did make a thread in off-topic to bring together the concerns people are expressing right now, because it does seem to be all over the place in many threads at the moment.


http://www.collarchat.com/m_3322966/tm.htm

< Message edited by laurell3 -- 7/21/2010 9:49:52 AM >

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:50:40 AM   
Missokyst


Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline 		I moved over to fet because there did seem to be more people over there actually DOING, than there are here. Sometimes I find it comical if I mention something that for me was just the way things were, and it stops the thread here, or it takes a deep breath of a day before it restarts. lol It makes me think that these forums are more for bdsm lite, the new fluffy loving relationship driven ds and not the evil mean bdsm. :) But that is ok. People take the road of their choice.
I do post more on CM than I do on fet, mostly because those people do seem to be doing things and there are fewer concerns. Frankly people with no issues are boring!
Serious topics in bdsm, such as those that make you take responsibility for your own safety fail I think because people don't want to recognize there are risks.
I am often appalled that people I know play casually, exchange body fluids, fuck, suck, swallow and risk infection from partner after partner because "they know them" Umm... excuse me, if guy A has banged every woman in the group and 2 or 3 of the guys, don't they stop to think that they don't know everything?? And, no one asks for medical proof because "they know them" Blood play at least makes them take some precautions. I think people don't want to know they are at risk. There are no rainbows and sparklies if you mix logic into fantasy.
quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

Why bother coming to a bdsm forum if you have no interest in actually doing...or at the very least, discussing doing? I mean there are tons of porn sites and chat rooms out there if all one wants is to get turned on or find material to whack off to. Lots of them even have graphic pictures...LOL!


(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 9:57:54 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

... and they all sang Kumbayah.

Amen.


(in reply to sunshinemiss)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 10:12:25 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		I'm not sure how I put all this together, but here goes:

From the "what have I done" thread:

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I'd like to also comment on the aspect of being emotionally bound to someone who is a danger to you. Sometimes those bonds can indeed be far greater than the physical...and sometimes the resulting damage can be astronomically greater and take far longer to recover from. I have been in that situation too. The bonds between us were formed in good times...our world was a blissfully perfect place for a lot of years before they took a turn. Those bonds kept me in that place for far longer than I ever should have been there. Some of us "just go through" and make it out the other side....some of us don't. I can tell you that those bonds were harder to break than anything that I have ever had to do in my lifetime...and the scars will last forever.



I find it interesting Erin that given what you've posted above you ignored this rather serious thread:  http://www.collarchat.com/m_3319660/mpage_1/tm.htm

Perhaps the reason you did not post on this serious thread is the same reason others don't post on other serious threads?

Please know that this is not a criticism.  It is merely an observation.

best,
sunshine

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 10:18:27 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

In general though, why don't people talk about safety? Because you get shot down if you do. If someone says they are going to do something that seems risky, someone will point it out at which point the op gets defensive about how he isn't the domliest thing around and gets nasty to those who point out his stupidity.


Start a safeword thread and see how fast the conversation devolves

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 10:19:04 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

I'm not sure how I put all this together, but here goes:

From the "what have I done" thread:

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I'd like to also comment on the aspect of being emotionally bound to someone who is a danger to you. Sometimes those bonds can indeed be far greater than the physical...and sometimes the resulting damage can be astronomically greater and take far longer to recover from. I have been in that situation too. The bonds between us were formed in good times...our world was a blissfully perfect place for a lot of years before they took a turn. Those bonds kept me in that place for far longer than I ever should have been there. Some of us "just go through" and make it out the other side....some of us don't. I can tell you that those bonds were harder to break than anything that I have ever had to do in my lifetime...and the scars will last forever.



I find it interesting Erin that given what you've posted above you ignored this rather serious thread:  http://www.collarchat.com/m_3319660/mpage_1/tm.htm

Perhaps the reason you did not post on this serious thread is the same reason others don't post on other serious threads?

Please know that this is not a criticism.  It is merely an observation.

best,
sunshine


To be really honest with you I haven't even opened that thread yet. Probably the reason that I haven't is because the title tells me that it is not something that I have any experience with to give an objective opinion. I have never had a relationship that was not D/s or M/s.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to sunshinemiss)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Lack of interest in threads pertaining to hands on,... - 7/21/2010 10:22:08 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		Therein lies my point.

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 60
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