What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico?

What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (Full Version)

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jlf1961 -> What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 2:42:15 PM)
A fence? Fences can be cut. Putting troops on the border every 500 to 1000 feet? That is an excessive amount of manpower, and would it be effective stopping large groups of people crossing the border? The most secure border in modern history was probably the Cold War border between East and West Germany. To keep their people from leaving—logistically much easier than keeping others from entering—the East Germans built more than 700 watchtowers, sprinkled more than a million antipersonnel mines, created a deep no-man's zone of barbed wire and electric fencing, and deployed nearly 50 guards per square mile with shoot-to-kill orders. Even so about 1,000 people each year somehow managed to find a way across. source Perhaps if we brought ALL of the US troops presently stationed around the world, we could effectively secure the border with constant air, mechanized and foot patrols. Guard towers every thousand feet, anti personnel devices (landmines, razor wire, electric fences) but would it be enough? Would that stop tunneling? Sure there are sensors to detect tunneling, but what do you do when you detect a tunnel? Use explosives to cave it in? Securing the US Mexico border is much more complicated than just putting up a fence and patrolling a border. You would need constant patrols, and not every so often but round the clock patrols.

mnottertail -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 2:48:37 PM)
OK, we go invade Iraq, force ourselves upon them to export our brand of enlightenment to the world and we discuss ways to keep people from coming into our country. One real deterrant would be to take the starwars ball bearing shooting thingies and keep them full of ball bearings and stand them shoulder to shoulder on the boarder and not worry about deer and jackrabbits, just waste everything.

jlf1961 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 2:51:37 PM)
I was against the invasion of Iraq from the get go. We could use those troops on the border, according to some people I have read on the internet while looking into this problem.

mnottertail -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 2:53:33 PM)
Ja, look AZ has turned it into a states rights issue, they can build whatever they want across their part of the boarder, federally, I would be against building anything. Nobody wants to chop lettuce, and you already dont eat enough roughage, and you damn sure aint paying 30 bucks for a head of it. In any case if we do anything federally, whatever it is, AZ should be exempt. They got the law.

Moonhead -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 2:57:45 PM)
Maybe stopping employers in California and Texas from hiring Mexicans who've sneaked across the border would have the desired effect, but paying a living wage is something the neocons have been dead against since long before Futuyama disowned them.

popeye1250 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 2:59:44 PM)
JLF, the "most secure" border is S/N Korea's. They have minefields, no-mans lands, all kinds of sensors so that if a mouse gets through at 0300 they know about it. And they have mines that detect tunneling and go off above or below the tunnels. Also, with all the Troops already back or returning by next summer from Iraq (there are still 50,000 Troops in Iraq who will be brought back by July 1st according to Joe Biden) there's certainly no "shortage" of Troops that we're alreaddy "paying". I think 30,000 up in Washington state with the 7th cav, Ft Hood must have 50-75 K, Ft. Leonard Wood in Missouri 50k, Ft Stewart Ga. 50k, and Ft Bragg in N.C. is a Huge base! It's in "Fayetteville, we used to call it "Fayettenam" when I was in the Navy because everyone there was just back from or going to Vietnam. There must be 100,000 Troops there! And all the other Army Forts throughout the country. In many areas along that border you could have 10 soldiers watching 25 miles of border while in other areas you'd need 50-100 per mile. Thirty thousand Troops could do it which is a drop in the bucket and who we're paying already. One thing is for sure, if you don't walk in a minefield you won't get blown up.

slvemike4u -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:02:02 PM)
Yep,thats what we want to do ...militirize our southern border. America....a shining light unto the world.....you guys crack me up.

slvemike4u -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:03:54 PM)
Next thing you know Popeye,with all of the wisdom he has learned ,will be here to extol the virtues of landmines.

jlf1961 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:05:28 PM)
True enough mnottertail, but if we were to put massive amounts of troops on the border, it would stop a lot of the drug traffic....

Moonhead -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:07:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 It's in "Fayetteville, we used to call it "Fayettenam" when I was in the Navy because everyone there was just back from or going to Vietnam. There must be 100,000 Troops there! And all the other Army Forts throughout the country. That was forty years ago, sunshine. You have a much smaller army now, party due to a reliance on drones and long range artillery. The main reason you're getting your arses kicked by insurgents in a couple of middle eastern countries at the moment is your military no longer has the manpower to do anything effectively. Just how big is the border with Mexicon? Do you think your country is employing enough troops to secure that, even if they weren't needed for IED fodder elsewhere? Don't make me fucking laugh.

jlf1961 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:12:45 PM)
The length of the US Mexico border is 1,954 miles.

Moonhead -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:17:09 PM)
Thank you. I knew it was quite a stretch of land. Not realised it was that long, though. So you'd need a much bigger army. The liberals don't like that idea on general principles, and the cons will shit blood at the thought of paying for it.

MstrPBK -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:20:52 PM)
Ask and you shall receive ... the US/Mexican Boarder is 1969 miles long or ... 10,396,320 feet ... My wise crack of the day is this: we could just extend the Rio Grand River west and then watch what tectonics do from there ... MstrPBK St. Paul, MN USA P,S. I think Bush wanted to build a wall. Was that plan legislated?

jlf1961 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:53:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Yep,thats what we want to do ...militirize our southern border. America....a shining light unto the world.....you guys crack me up. Everyone wants to stop illegal aliens from coming across the border. All I am asking is what will it take to actually do that? The Chinese built a wall a few thousand years ago, and it proved to be rather ineffective since the Mongols just went around it.

Moonhead -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:56:09 PM)
The French had the same problem with the Maginot line, if memory serves. Stopping the illegals wanting to enter the country in the first place would be a start. Business in California and Texas will never go for that, though.

Yourscum -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 3:57:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MstrPBK . MstrPBK St. Paul, MN USA P,S. I think Bush wanted to build a wall. Was that plan legislated? He wanted to build a fence? I find that hard to believe since he was the moron that wanted to give ALL illegal aliens living in the country legal status.

popeye1250 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 4:09:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Yep,thats what we want to do ...militirize our southern border. America....a shining light unto the world.....you guys crack me up. Mike, do you really think we have a choice? This past weekend they were unearthing bodies in N. Mexico of drug cartel victims. They started out at 18 then 26 then 31 then 38,.....they had to keep raising the over/under! I think they're up to 51 now last I heard. And then yesterday Yahoo News said that the Jailors let out a bunch of prisoners, let them borrow their guns so that they could go and kill their rivals! Mexico is a "country" in name only! It's run by the drug cartels and now they're using "I.E.D.s" remote controlled car bombs just like in Iraq and Afganistan. A shinning light unto the world? WTF? I'd be happy with having a sovereign country. I thought the world "hates the U.S.?" What happened to all that? The only time the world "likes" the U.S. is when they have their hands out or they want us to "do something!" that will benefit them! One thing is for sure, "Mexico" is not our friend!

jlf1961 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 4:10:14 PM)
Seriously, everyone claims they want to stop illegal immigration, the liberals and the conservatives. Everyone agrees it is a problem. As already shown, the two most secure borders in history was the border between east and west Germany during the cold war, and the present border between North and South Korea. In both examples, it was a military presence and anti personnel devices that have made it possible. So, slvemike, and others, what do we do to secure the border? Here is the chance to give your ideas.

aphotic -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 4:22:24 PM)
This question is easy, and necessary for the well-being of any given amount of space (or country if you like politics)-- Population control. No one is having babies in mangers these days, and when they have to go to the hospital, we'll practice infantcide. Of course I'm stealing this idea for Vonnegut, but it did sound glorious in 2BRO2B. No one is going to come here when they can't just have Catholic sex as often as they want and produce offspring like the indomitable miscreants they are. I don't even have a problem with immigrants, but it would probably help. It would also get rid of some of the other idoicies of society--like the "Nineteen and Counting" show, or the fascination with having a large family. Isn't that everyone's real problem? That it's getting crowded and influxing too many different cultures upon you? Culture is a spice of life, but not when it's conflict for space and well-being. So we can curb it! I realize most people will disagree with this, but let's be honest: in a world of dying resources and depleting living conditions for the lower and middle classes, you need not look any further than population control. P.S. As someone who lives in the upper-Northwest now, but lived in Texas for a great deal of time--those Mexicans were always taking work for jobs that others don't want to do, and when they'd do a repair for me, they were nothing less than any other person I'd love to have in my house again. They were shocked when I'd offer them to have tea or a dinner with me, and why is that? Everyone is good enough, but let's not confuse space with racism.

jlf1961 -> RE: What would it take to actually secure the border with Mexico? (7/26/2010 7:14:49 PM)
Still, no answers to the question, interesting.

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