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Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 6:28:44 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline 		I've been reading postings on another site regarding a situation in a community that I know no one in. I am using it as an example for this post, not because I want to delve into their specific issues, but because it is a good example to use as a backdrop to consider for a question that I have wondered about for some time as I have seen many instances over the years where people seem to take a similar stance. I don't have any dog in their fight, and maybe that makes me see it differently but...just looking to get people's thoughts.

A brief summary of their issue...

A couple (group leaders) open their private home for public play parties. (By public I mean that they are not private invite parties, they are open to any member of their local community.) At a recent party it came to the attention of one of the attendees that there were minor children in a room in the basement with a note on the door stating that the room was "Off Limits". Just outside of that room the play party was going on. This was a huge concern to the attendee because they felt that having minor children on the premises significantly upped the legal risk factor (not to mention their own moral or ethical beliefs) to all in attendance and that they felt that attendees should have been made aware that the children were present just beyond that door so that they could make their own decisions regarding their participation and attendance at the party. This attendee left the party when they became aware and proceeded to make a post on the group's message board informing other members of the situation. They made the post anonymously instead of using their own user ID, a decision that resulted in much controversy. In response, the party host has made another posting declaring that he will no longer host parties.

What surprised me about it, and what has surprised me on several other occasions over the years, is that the "messenger" is being strongly chastised and criticized...but the party host, who in my opinion has made a very poor decision regarding these minors AND the safety and well being of his guests, is being applauded and supported in huge numbers. I might also add that the host does not seem to be taking any responsibility for that decision and is taking the stand of "look at all I've done for you all, how dare anyone question me?". Surely there can not be many people who honestly believe it is ok to have young children present at a BDSM party...and yet the vast majority is expressing support to this host and speaking of how saddened they are that he has decided to cancel future parties...a decision that will severely limit their possibilities to find play partners and get their kink on.

I have seen similar displays of support over the years when someone who provides an avenue for others kink gets called out on their poor decisions or behavior. It seems that the majority of the people will support whoever provides the party regardless of the infraction.

?????

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 6:32:17 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Some folks just wanna do whatever enables the kink, it is instant gratification over future (or immediate) consequence. 

By and large my moral compass went south at birth, but there are some things that just aren't gonna happen in my world. Call 'em like you see 'em.

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 6:41:21 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		I think when I was younger, my ability to ignore my moral compass was greater. I was more easily influenced, more susceptible to others' points of view, more worried about what people thought of me. I would more easily go with the flow of the crowd, even if it bothered me internally.

Not now. Now I don't care what anyone thinks, I am going to stand up for what I believe is right. If that is a problem for someone, they can just kiss my ass. I am the one that has to look at the face in the mirror, at the end of the day.

As for the example.......I would have done the same thing but not anonymously. I own my words and take full responsibility for any potential repercussions of those words. The reaction says an awful lot about the people that are supporting the hosts.


< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 9/21/2010 6:52:25 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 6:46:46 AM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline 		I've always maintained that just because it's BDSM doesn't mean that it precludes manners or morals. But, many use BDSM as an excuse to throw those things away and provide support to others to do so, as well.

Hell, I called someone on their rudeness yesterday and called me a wannabe. Obviously I'm supposed to tolerate men saying rude things to me because I'm a sub woman and he's labeled himself a Dom.

And for the record, I agree with the folks that left the party.

< Message edited by OsideGirl -- 9/21/2010 6:49:44 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 6:48:36 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		~Fast Reply~

I would not do this. However... it's not ignoring their moral compass if they don't see it as a problem. They feel it's acceptable, they did it.

I agree with you that is ups the legal risk for everyone involved and that it was a poor decision. I don't know the ages of anything so their parents/guardians may have had quite a reasonable expection of the kids staying behind the door and not causing an issue. As I don't know the situation (if this was a reoccuring event or a one time situation created by an emergancy/unusual circumstances), it's hard for me to pass judgement since it was their private home and not a dungeon - even though the event was public.

I, personally, would not be comfortable having a play party in my home while there were children in it. I would not be comfortable at a play party where there were children in the house. I would be extremely pissed at having not been told there were children in the house as I would not attend a party where I knew there were going to be kids. I kinda wonder if there is more to it though. I haven't seen anything like that around here though I do know that people will attend the play parties of people that they don't like/don't approve of just to have somewhere to play.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 9/21/2010 7:17:21 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:05:21 AM   
MistressLavinia


Posts: 1110
Joined: 3/6/2009
From: DFWM in the Land of LaviKinks
Status: offline 		What I've seen within the community and even here, are the sheep, following who they believe are the shepherds. I don't care who likes me and who doesn't like me, when I see something that's not right, I'd have to take a stand right there and then, (like what happened at the play party) if underage people are around, it's up to the adults to take a stand and say, "this isn't right" For any adult to stand by something that's not only morally incorrect but legally incorrect, only shows they wanted the party and didn't care what laws were broken or who was hurt by the party. Which leads me to believe who the hell would want to play in that kind of situation anyway. Who could you possibly trust at a party where the adults weren't taking the proper precautions, just because it was a "party". I don't know what adult I could or would ever trust, who would want to be a part of that?

All things may not be morally correct to the next person and that's debatable, children involved in anything kinky is not debatable, it's unacceptable. That to me is not only a morality issue it's the law and it's sick to have a party where children can walk into the scene or hear what's going on within the scene, a sign on the door is not protecting them enough. I don't think it's proper to bash someone on the internet after the fact, It should have been ended at the party, by all the responsible adults there, not to post a bashing after its done and over with. As far as the people defending the host, that's what selfish people do, they want the party and don't give a shit who they hurt along the way.

Edited: of course -


< Message edited by MistressLavinia -- 9/21/2010 7:13:04 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:13:30 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		I would not ignore MY moral compass to get my kink on, although I might ignore YOURS...

I agree with you that I would find it troubling to play in a location that had minors on it, but there might be other instances that you found troubling that I wouldn't. Morals are not universal is my point.

_____________________________

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:24:35 AM   
WinsomeDefiance


Posts: 6719
Joined: 8/7/2007
Status: offline 		I can honestly say no, to this question and to this situation in particular.

A very long time ago, in a place far far away - I once moved myself and my children into my boyfriends home. This caused an uproar, amongst those who had previously had the use of his home as a play space. People were offended and upset that I would move children into 'their' play space, when in fact I hadn't. I moved myself, and my children into our new home.

I was a bit hurt by everyone's reaction, because instead of being happy for Jim and me, they were up in arms over the loss of their play space. I didn't take personal offense, instead, I went in search of a new play space, found one. Incorporated our group as a Non-profit. Organized a group of leaders willing and able to step forward and help me and Jim run the organization. Talked our members into paying membership fees, purchased liability insurance, and had our first play party in our new place all within a matter of a mere few weeks. If it sounds like I'm bragging, I guess maybe I am a little, but my point is - I didn't compromise my moral compass, and I still managed to get my kink on.

WinD

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:29:35 AM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline 		I agree with Aqua, that if they saw nothing wrong it, they were not ignoring their moral compass.  It could be that these folks, collectively, just have a much different moral compass than you or I.

That said, I certainly would not endorse having children in the home when there's a play party.  I would have left, too.

As for the overall question - the title of this thread - Do I ignore my  moral compass to get my kink on?  Off the cuff I'd say no, but in the past when enslaved, there were things required of me which went beyond what I felt was morally OK.  Because of my belief that I, as his slave, must do all he required, I found myself, at times, having to put my own moral beliefs aside in order to serve him.  This was no easy thing for me, but it was something I felt I had to do.  Not "to get my kink on", but to live the commitment I had sworn myself to.  This time around I was sure to align myself with someone who has the same moral compass as I do.


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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:34:24 AM   
angelikaJ


Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline 		FR

It is one thing for parents to have kinky bedroom play behind their own closed doors, when the kids are home.

To have a play party in your home, with the children there is unacceptable.
I can understand the legal implications for the attendees, but I can also understand why the parents might not have wanted to let people know the children were there: not for legality's sake but for the protection of the kids.

It wasn't against the moral compass of the parents, and it may or may not have been against the morality of the other party goers. They may be just pissed that their venue options have narrowed and they can't see past that, even if they themselves would never consider that doing something similar in their own homes. They were ok with it because they didn't know. They may not think it is ok, so much as that now they know and they don't like it. It's easier to pretend it didn't happen, and to blame the other couple for spoiling things.

The other couple was clear on where their moral compass point was, and told the truth.

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:38:02 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		They may feel that if the children were supervised and could not enter into the party area, that it was safe. I can see that pov. However, not telling others of this was tantamount to lying. They had to know that many people would have declined the invitation if they knew there were minors on the premises.

If they feel the supervision was sufficient to protect the children, then obviously they aren't crossing their own moral boundaries.
But they denied everyone else the opportunity to make that decision for themselves. And that's wrong.

I do understand the dislike of an anonymous posting though. Probably had the poster said who he or she was, they would have gotten more credibility. The effect is cheapened by making it anonymous. It makes one seem to be a hypocrite, that they're saying "My morality is better than yours but I still want the opportunity to go back next time".


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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:40:13 AM   
BonesFromAsh


Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline 		No.

I don't attend play parties, this is now something I either do with a partner I'm in a commited relationship with or I don't do it at all. For me, this is a compatibility issue...those of myself and my partner.

edited to add....As for the example, the situation would have been unacceptable for me so I would have left asap. Posting the information on a message board anonymously is a bit hinky. If you have an opinion...stand by it as who you are and not as a blank one-post wonder.

< Message edited by BonesFromAsh -- 9/21/2010 7:44:29 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:48:36 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BonesFromAsh

No.

I don't attend play parties, this is now something I either do with a partner I'm in a commited relationship with or I don't do it at all. For me, this is a compatibility issue...those of myself and my partner.



What does being in a commited relationship have to do with attending a play party or not? Plenty of couples in commited relationships attend play parties. Sometimes because their lives are so hectic that it provides them a calm and - usually! lol - child-free play to play. Many times play parties have nicer/larger equipment that many people either can't afford or don't have the space to store in their homes. There are many reasons why a commited couple would choose to attend a play party.

Edited to add: Not saying anyone should or should not attend, just don't understand what a commited relationship has to do with it. No one is required to play with anyone outside of their relationship.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 9/21/2010 7:50:44 AM >

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:53:28 AM   
marie2


Posts: 1690
Joined: 11/4/2008
From: Jersey
Status: offline 		I have noticed that some kinksters get so caught-up and obsessed with the public scene, and play parties, and dungeons and all that stuff that they can't even see the light of day anymore, nevermind their own moral compass.

A play party with kids in the house? No, it wouldn't be something I would be a part of. I doubt I'd go so far as to start a thread about it warning others, but I can't say I blame the person who did that, if they were acting on a strong conviction.

And no, I don't ignore my moral compass or any other compass to get my kink on, no matter how strongly I may feel about something or someone. Fortunately my common sense always prevails, and I'm probably more towards the conservative, almost tight-ass side when it comes to things like that. I won't do anything that I think is stupid, immoral, too risky, will involve others without their knowledge, or anything that could get my ass in hot water publically, legally or whatever else. Sure, I take some risks to some degree, by engaging in the first place, but I'm as careful about it as possible, while minimizing the risks of any of the above.




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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 7:53:41 AM   
angelikaJ


Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline 		To answer the posted question: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on?

The uncomfortable truth is that yes, I did.
By having play partners, and disconnecting my thoughts and feelings about how it felt and what I thought, I was ignoring my moral compass.

I was listening to what other people were telling me was okay and what was okay for me and I was not listening to what I knew to be true for myself and that voice began getting fainter and fainter.

I made poor choices, and poorer choices.

It began to change when someone asked me what was I looking for and the honest answer was I didn't know.

Do I ignore my moral compass to get my kink on?
No, I don't.

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 8:04:15 AM   
BonesFromAsh


Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: BonesFromAsh

No.

I don't attend play parties, this is now something I either do with a partner I'm in a commited relationship with or I don't do it at all. For me, this is a compatibility issue...those of myself and my partner.



What does being in a commited relationship have to do with attending a play party or not? Plenty of couples in commited relationships attend play parties. Sometimes because their lives are so hectic that it provides them a calm and - usually! lol - child-free play to play. Many times play parties have nicer/larger equipment that many people either can't afford or don't have the space to store in their homes. There are many reasons why a commited couple would choose to attend a play party.

Edited to add: Not saying anyone should or should not attend, just don't understand what a commited relationship has to do with it. No one is required to play with anyone outside of their relationship.


It has nothing to do with attending a play party or not...except for me. This is why I including the fact that I only do this in that type of relationship...one on one...not public...private. Not a judgement of public/private parties and those who attend them or whether or not being in a commited relationship is a factor for other people when considering attending one.

That's all...nothing more/nothing less.

< Message edited by BonesFromAsh -- 9/21/2010 8:06:58 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 8:05:13 AM   
MasterCord


Posts: 144
Joined: 7/6/2009
Status: offline 		Yes, there was a time when I had and it cost me the most wonderful woman and potential life partner on the planet. There is not a day that passes by that I do not think of not only the toll my own stupidity took on me, but far more the toll it took on her.

The worst part of it was seeing her eyes....on Christmas Eve...of all nights...the anger and pain and hurt...all eminating from someone who truly loved me, in all the right ways and for all the right reasons....and whose heart and trust I had broken...and in hindsight....for what?

Years have passed, and to this day my eyes still water when different things in everyday life remind me of just how blindly and inexcuseably stupid I was to hurt someone so devoted to me.

MC


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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 8:16:00 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Morality wise I tend to be in Ron's camp although I am A-moral, in that I have my own sense of right and wrong and will not be directed by the common morality which is by and large religious based, there are some things which I will not be part of nor tolerate. Underage beasties present on the same property as a play party and I do an about turn, thank the hosts and excuse myself. I do not and will not be drawn into any discussion regarding the matter nor the rights and wrongs of the hosts for it is not my place on this earth to do so. (Having said this, were I to find that the hosts involved the young'ns in play areas, I would speak out and for that is disgratzia).

< Message edited by IronBear -- 9/21/2010 8:17:33 AM >

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 8:22:26 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BonesFromAsh

It has nothing to do with attending a play party or not...except for me. This is why I including the fact that I only do this in that type of relationship...one on one...not public...private. Not a judgement of public/private parties and those who attend them or whether or not being in a commited relationship is a factor for other people when considering attending one.

That's all...nothing more/nothing less.


I'm just curious. I get not going to them because someone is a private person and just doesn't want to play publically. I just don't the commited part as why someone wouldn't go.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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RE: Do you ignore your moral compass to get your kink on? - 9/21/2010 8:26:31 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterCord

Yes, there was a time when I had and it cost me the most wonderful woman and potential life partner on the planet. There is not a day that passes by that I do not think of not only the toll my own stupidity took on me, but far more the toll it took on her.

The worst part of it was seeing her eyes....on Christmas Eve...of all nights...the anger and pain and hurt...all eminating from someone who truly loved me, in all the right ways and for all the right reasons....and whose heart and trust I had broken...and in hindsight....for what?

Years have passed, and to this day my eyes still water when different things in everyday life remind me of just how blindly and inexcuseably stupid I was to hurt someone so devoted to me.

MC




I respect someone admitting they were at fault; I would like to think my ex will feel this way, but he has no clue how to take ownership of any wrong doing.

As for the OP, I would never ignore my moral compass, never have, never will, to get my kink on. There are so many other important things and many more times you can do what you want in a safe environment not hurting anyone else.

As for children, I find it despicable that anyone would have a play party anywhere near children. It is incomprehensible how selfish people are.

Our world currently is one of entitlement, everyone feels entitled to have immediate gratification despite the consequences.

And if I sound old fashioned, good, I am about things like this.

(in reply to MasterCord)
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